John Anthony's channel taken down

[Emerald]

Just now, How to be wise said:

I would much rather a woman sleeps with me rather than simply 'admires' me while fucking another guy.

That's a reflection of your own priorities. And that's fine if those are your priorities.

All you really need is audacity to achieve that.

Just don't mistake having women sleep with you as an indication that you're an attractive man or a great man.

[AION]

2 hours ago, Emerald said:

The misread is that pick-up makes you more attractive. It really doesn't.

Becoming a great man who lives by his values and is an asset to the community makes you more attractive. And this will increase your options for romantic partners significantly because your social status will improve and you will be more respected in general by others.

But it won't get you laid at the volume that pick-up does. But it's way more efficient for finding a partner and other opportunities in life. 

Pick-up is about audacity and persistence... not attractiveness. 

Pick-up is about sleeping with women... not being attractive to them or admired by them more generally. All you need is go through he numbers game to find a woman who's looking for a hook-up out of loneliness, boredom, or horniness to succeed at sleeping with a woman.

And if you show up as an option and you're audacious about it without completely bungling the social cues, sometimes you'll get picked.

But it doesn't mean you're attractive. It means that you're good enough for the moment.

So, I'll ask you this question... "Is it more important to you to become a great man in your own eyes, the eyes of women, and the eyes of the world at large? Or is it more important for you to maximize your lay count?"

That is why I am breaking my rule about body-shaming and emphasizing the fact that these male "role models' that teach men how to attract women are not attractive men.

A discerning woman wouldn't touch them with a ten-foot pole. And while there is a sizable percentage of undiscerning women, probably at least half of women are discerning women. 

So, these guys may get laid often enough... but they aren't attractive. They're just audacious and persuasive... and more willing to impose themselves on the situation.

I think you are proposing a false dichotomy. Both is possible. Why should I care about what other people perceive me as. I live by my own values. Getting a baby doll girl doesn’t always mean she is an air head. And getting a mature woman doesn’t always mean she is a great partner. I think you should be careful with making these assumptions. 

I’m focusing on my life purpose and I’m doing this for myself. Not to get praise from a group of people or from bimbos who can’t even offer their ******** to me so why should I be offering my best to them. 

The woman who don’t like men like Andrew Tate don’t like those girls who disapprove of him anyway. So you disapproving of him doesn’t mean much. He doesn’t want you to begin with. 

Men who are not typical attractive but reached a certain amount of success don’t have to be good looking to begin with. They play on a different paradigm. Girls can look beyond their looks. 

 

[How to be wise]

8 minutes ago, Emerald said:

That's a reflection of your own priorities. And that's fine if those are your priorities.

All you really need is audacity to achieve that.

Just don't mistake having women sleep with you as an indication that you're an attractive man or a great man.

As long as we are in these human suits, everything is transactional. 

What's the point of being great if we won't get anything in return.

The point of being attractive is to sleep (or marry) with women.

If a politician wants to be great, it's only because he wants your vote. Otherwise what's the point of being great.

 

[Emerald]

12 minutes ago, AION said:

I think you are proposing a false dichotomy. Both is possible. Why should I care about what other people perceive me as. I live by my own values. Getting a baby doll girl doesn’t always mean she is an air head. And getting a mature woman doesn’t always mean she is a great partner. I think you should be careful with making these assumptions. 

I’m focusing on my life purpose and I’m doing this for myself. Not to get praise from a group of people or from bimbos who can’t even offer their ******** to me so why should I be offering my best to them. 

The woman who don’t like men like Andrew Tate don’t like those girls who disapprove of him anyway. So you disapproving of him doesn’t mean much. He doesn’t want you to begin with. 

Men who are not typical attractive but reached a certain amount of success don’t have to be good looking to begin with. They play on a different paradigm. Girls can look beyond their looks. 

I'm sure that Andrew Tate and I would have a mutual disgust for one another. That is true. 

Also, you need both partners to be mature to have a good relationship. If one or both partners are immature, the relationship will be a total mess.

But those things aside... my point is that there is a real dichotomy that exists with these priorities... and one thing must be prioritized over the other.

A man can either prioritize maximizing the number of women he sleeps with by trying to mold himself to be a sexual option to the lowest common denominator of women... Or a man can prioritize becoming a great man.

He will have to choose one or the other... as becoming a great man is very self-directed while being a sexual option to the maximum number of women is very centered on the question of "How can I become the type of guy that women are more likely to say yes to?"

And this is one of the main bottlenecks that men have with regard to developing maturity, character, and more refined Masculine strengths.

A man who takes the former option develops a more detached relationship with women and sexuality... and he focuses on making himself great and working towards his purpose. And this has a side-effect of making him a lot more attractive to women, even if he doesn't go out looking to get laid as a major life priority.

So, his lower number of sexual partners compared to the man who prioritizes sleeping with lots of women could be interpreted by the uninitiated man as "The man who has a lower number of lays is a less attractive man than the man with a higher number of lays."

Men often think 'The man with more lays is more desirable to women.' So, they devalue becoming a great man... and get focused instead on optimizing themselves for maximum sex and believing that that's what makes them Masculine, desirable, and attractive.

And it leaves them much less attractive for it... as it's a very needy stance to take to prioritize maximizing sexual options over becoming a great man.

But a man who knows that there are plenty of women out there who would be interested in him, where he knows that he needn't mold himself to be a sexual option for women because there is no scarcity, is able to prioritize authenticity, purpose, contribution, fun, and all sorts of other things. 

I notice that guys who get heavily involved in pick-up tend to get so bogged down in it that they end up losing focus on developing themselves as people. It all becomes about women. And it ironically ends up making them less attractive to women.

[Emerald]

35 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

As long as we are in these human suits, everything is transactional. 

What's the point of being great if we won't get anything in return.

The point of being attractive is to sleep (or marry) with women.

If a politician wants to be great, it's only because he wants your vote. Otherwise what's the point of being great.

My whole point is that it's a better life strategy that will lead to better outcomes.

You will get a lot of things by prioritizing becoming a great man over optimizing yourself to sleep with lots of women... including better relationship options.

It's really the key to living a good life and being respected within the wider community.

The side effect of prioritizing being a great man is that women will be more attracted to you in a deeper way and respect you more. And you can parlay that into a great relationship and great marriage. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

59 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

As long as we are in these human suits, everything is transactional. 

What's the point of being great if we won't get anything in return.

I hope you are just saying this in isolation and not applying it as some life philosophy.

Because this is really a crossroads of ego and meaning talking. If you are chasing greatness for something in return - it's all ego. The moment you don't get what you want you are left with a hollow feeling. When you choose greatness it is because excellence feels like alignment: it is who you are.

The truth is you don't always get anything lasting 'in return' for being great. You become something from it. That is the real transformative transaction. The process is where all the good stuff is.

[AION]

56 minutes ago, Emerald said:

I'm sure that Andrew Tate and I would have a mutual disgust for one another. That is true. 

Also, you need both partners to be mature to have a good relationship. If one or both partners are immature, the relationship will be a total mess.

But those things aside... my point is that there is a real dichotomy that exists with these priorities... and one thing must be prioritized over the other.

A man can either prioritize maximizing the number of women he sleeps with by trying to mold himself to be a sexual option to the lowest common denominator of women... Or a man can prioritize becoming a great man.

He will have to choose one or the other... as becoming a great man is very self-directed while being a sexual option to the maximum number of women is very centered on the question of "How can I become the type of guy that women are more likely to say yes to?"

And this is one of the main bottlenecks that men have with regard to developing maturity, character, and more refined Masculine strengths.

A man who takes the former option develops a more detached relationship with women and sexuality... and he focuses on making himself great and working towards his purpose. And this has a side-effect of making him a lot more attractive to women, even if he doesn't go out looking to get laid as a major life priority.

So, his lower number of sexual partners compared to the man who prioritizes sleeping with lots of women could be interpreted by the uninitiated man as "The man who has a lower number of lays is a less attractive man than the man with a higher number of lays."

Men often think 'The man with more lays is more desirable to women.' So, they devalue becoming a great man... and get focused instead on optimizing themselves for maximum sex and believing that that's what makes them Masculine, desirable, and attractive.

And it leaves them much less attractive for it... as it's a very needy stance to take to prioritize maximizing sexual options over becoming a great man.

But a man who knows that there are plenty of women out there who would be interested in him, where he knows that he needn't mold himself to be a sexual option for women because there is no scarcity, is able to prioritize authenticity, purpose, contribution, fun, and all sorts of other things. 

I notice that guys who get heavily involved in pick-up tend to get so bogged down in it that they end up losing focus on developing themselves as people. It all becomes about women. And it ironically ends up making them less attractive to women.

I actually agree that men shouldn’t do autopsy on who they are to be liked by the masses. But I think this counts for everybody. Not just for men. They should become who they are which is part of individuation. But there is no bypass imo. People have to fuck around. And find out. 

I do pickup and yes I have a persona. In the same way women have makeup. To a certain degree I think it is ok to have a persona. It starts becoming a problem when people start identifying with their persona and de-identifying with their true self. 

I do a hybrid approach. That is why I do think it is a false dichotomy. I always lead with my true self and a lot of girls reject my nerdy side which is ok. I still have 10-20% success rate to find a good connection with the Barbie doll kind of girl. It is all about how to deal with rejection. When I’m rejected I could say “I need to hide my nerdy side” but I say fuck her and I own up more to it and that just fires up my vibe. I’m doing pickup for myself. The game you are proposing is old man’s game. People who are too old to do pickup so they go into this provider frame. Pickup is for young people. Both are legit coping mechanisms depending on the age of the person 

 

Edited 10 hours ago by AION

[Emerald]

48 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I hope you are just saying this in isolation and not applying it as some life philosophy.

Because this is really a crossroads of ego and meaning talking. If you are chasing greatness for something in return - it's all ego. The moment you don't get what you want you are left with a hollow feeling. When you choose greatness it is because excellence feels like alignment: it is who you are.

The truth is you don't always get anything lasting 'in return' for being great. You become something from it. That is the real transformative transaction. The process is where all the good stuff is.

Very well said!

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Emerald said:

Just don't mistake having women sleep with you as an indication that you're an attractive man or a great man.

If plenty of women sleep with a man that definitionally means he is attractive.

Great? No.

Many women do not sleep with unattractive men. This is a fantasy.

Just because you don't find a man attractive based on your high consciousness values does not mean most women agree with you.

[Jodistrict]

20 hours ago, Emerald said:

I know it's not nice to appearance shame but I feel like it should be said... a lot of guys who are popular pick-up artist coaches are very unattractive. I'm bringing it up because I find it ironic that the guys who teach men how to be attractive are usually not attractive themselves.

Not being attractive is an important part of their marketing.  Because the average guy says "well if he can do it the so can I", and then buys the course.   They also tend to have a gift for gab to make up for looks.    

Edited 9 hours ago by Jodistrict
typo

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

If plenty of women sleep with a man that definitionally means he is attractive.

Great? No.

Many women do not sleep with unattractive men. This is a fantasy.

Just because you don't find a man attractive based on your high consciousness values does not mean most women agree with you.

That logic doesn't actually work out in reality.

I've known plenty of unattractive guys who had plenty of sex just because they were social and persistent... and slept with less discerning women. 

The issue is that most men have this inaccurate belief that women are universally picky about sex... and that that's why a high body count means something objective about a man's level of desirability to women in general.

And men tend to want to hold onto that illusion that sleeping with women means something about their level of attractiveness, values, Masculinity, worth, etc.

But there is a sizable minority of women who aren't picky at all. So, getting low-discernment women to sleep with you means literally nothing about your level of general attractiveness. (And to clarify, there are low and high discernment women of all levels of physical attractiveness)

So, the idea that a man having a lay-count means something about his level of attractiveness isn't true. 

So no. There are TONS of very unattractive men getting laid... and it doesn't qualify them as attractive.

Case in point... the guy that this thread is about. 

And it's a nice compliment that you think I'm very conscious, but I am still a woman and my perspective on men would be shared by many women. 

And there are plenty of scrubs getting laid and plenty of low-discernment women willing to accept them. But that doesn't make the scrubs attractive. 

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Jodistrict said:

Not being attractive is an important part of their marketing.  Because the average guy says "well if he can do it the so can I", and then buys the course.   They also tend to have a gift for gab to make up for looks.    

I figured that that's part of it. 

But it's just funny to imagine the dynamic flipped around, where an unattractive and abrasive woman who's teaching bad advice becomes a super popular female dating coach. 

[Hojo]

Women feel superior over unattractive men. They actually dont even want to talk to unattractive men. Woman value is beauty if they find themselves more beautiful they feel more valuable. Then games over they are not interested they have control over the unattractive man.

I have seen more woman bully ugly men then try to sleep with them.

Saying ugly men have to be persistent basically is saying if men beg a woman for sex long enough then she can feel bad and give it to them. Pity sex and it wont happen twice. Be ready to swallow any pride you had.

Edited 6 hours ago by Hojo

[AerisVahnEphelia]

18 hours ago, something_else said:

You're right, but what I think you're missing is that in order to transform your life from that of a socially anxious basement dwelling neckbeard into that of a work of art will require a lot of effort. It isn't something you can just 'do' or 'be' on a whim. I don't particularly like the framing of a lot of pickup advice but it is a good first step to get a man out into the world and talking to people.

I think framing it as 'pickup' is a fundamental mistake because, like you say, it's very needy. It has a lot of very negative connotations and for good reason. It's much better to instead frame it as building social skills, but a lot of the stuff involved is very similar regardless of what you call it. It largely just involves forcing yourself into social situations, pushing your comfort zone socially, making friends, and yea, trying to get laid. I'm sure you'd agree that none of this is inherently bad behaviour. Most men go through a stage like this in their late teens to early twenties without even really knowing what pickup is, it's just a natural stage of male development that got formalised into pickup at some point.

Socializing and talking to a lot of people and being intimate with them ( not even sexually ) will be a better way, sure, in fact, it might be the only good way, people must chase being socially aware, not even being social, just aware.
 

[El Rizzidente]

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

That logic doesn't actually work out in reality.

I've known plenty of unattractive guys who had plenty of sex just because they were social and persistent... and slept with less discerning women. 

The issue is that most men have this inaccurate belief that women are universally picky about sex... and that that's why a high body count means something objective about a man's level of desirability to women in general.

And men tend to want to hold onto that illusion that sleeping with women means something about their level of attractiveness, values, Masculinity, worth, etc.

But there is a sizable minority of women who aren't picky at all. So, getting low-discernment women to sleep with you means literally nothing about your level of general attractiveness. (And to clarify, there are low and high discernment women of all levels of physical attractiveness)

So, the idea that a man having a lay-count means something about his level of attractiveness isn't true. 

So no. There are TONS of very unattractive men getting laid... and it doesn't qualify them as attractive.

Case in point... the guy that this thread is about. 

And it's a nice compliment that you think I'm very conscious, but I am still a woman and my perspective on men would be shared by many women. 

And there are plenty of scrubs getting laid and plenty of low-discernment women willing to accept them. But that doesn't make the scrubs attractive. 

i have to mostly disagree with you on this 

if a guy sleeps with a lot of ATTRACTIVE women (c'mon, we know what they look like, let's not kidd ourselves), that guy is for all intents and purposes attractive

BUT like you mentioned, unattractive men CAN get laid. and that is because:

1. they themselves are undiscerning as to who they fuck (e.g. stooping as low as 2-3)

2. the ones that would be traditionally deemed as "unattractive" (e.g. fat, short, bald, etc.) can still be attractive to women (even high-quaity ones) due to strong social skills, vibe, and demeanour

and as for john anthony, he is a tall 6' 4" white guy who is a really smart dude. so he's able to effectively demonstrate that in his approaches (e.g. convincing command, wit, bragging about shit he's done, etc.). so while he isn't a traditionally good-looking dude, he would be attractive to high-quality women due qualities that women resonate more with 

in short, yes "unattractive guys" getting laid doesn't NECESSARILY make them attractive. but you cannot be an unattractive guy if you are sleeping with attractive women (which i have  no doubt john does, even if his "2000+"  lay count is exaggerated)

[El Rizzidente]

18 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Was any reason given for the take down?

Did he take it down himself or YT did?

word on the street is some other dating guru on youtube had his fanbase mass report him (probably copyright infringement?)

not 100% sure about this by any means, but i doubt youtube would ban him for something he said or an infield he uploaded (he's lasted too long for that not to happen already, and he's also toned down his content considerably over the years)

 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Emerald I too am slightly confused with your take here. There may be a nuance or context you are operating from that hasn't been stated.

If a woman consensually sleeps with a man - she must perceive him as attractive. Unconscious or conscious.

Whether that be looks, social status, intellect, wit, charm, humor. Something in his character is attracting her.

Whether it is low consciousness (she has anxious attachment and is attracted to avoidant men, she has had trauma and mistakes love for adrenaline, she has low self esteem and negging makes her approval seeking) attraction or high consciousness does not matter.

There is still something there attracting her. That she is matching to within the man.

Unless you are referring to the sort of axis relating solely to the physical - IE a woman will sleep with a man who she finds physically unappealing due to his humor, intellect etc. But this is still attraction to the man. 

My perspective comes from a woman who has never slept with a man I found unattractive. And I have experienced no sexual assault. And my frame is one of enthusiastic consent with the above. 

I can only think of outlier cases being exclusions. IE a woman feeling she owes it to the man but doesn't like/feel attracted to him. Or feeling guilted into sex. 

Edited 4 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Alexop]

@Natasha Tori Maru great ideas! And this concludes Leos attractive but not necessarily great. 

To be great in this rotten society you might give up attractiveness. You will have less social status and social skills due to Isolation, might have less humor, you might not be interested into small talk that much anymore, you might not have that much money etc. and truth alone won't get you laid that much. You might  get passionate about very "shady" but true ideas that if you tell them you might get rejected. And wise women sometimes sense when you hold back shit. Or you yourself might not get arroused by most women anymore

My personal experience with physical attractiveness mattering for women is that it does not matter that much. Now I am getting a bit bald but in my 20s I had perfect hairline, 192 cm tall, athletic, nice face and all that. Almost no woman flipped an eye to that until she found me funny, safe, high status, or whatever. In the club they use to notice me more due to height. Very rarely I got flirting looks by  women that didn't know me yet. Today I feel that women care a lot more about the man being safe and sound, and funny and intelligent of course. Maybe those club girls that only look after sex might care more about looks because all they want is you body. Attractive women have so many options these days that looks alone cannot compete. It is a plus not a decisive factor as in women's case.

Edited 2 hours ago by Alexop

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, El Rizzidente said:

word on the street is some other dating guru on youtube had his fanbase mass report him

That's not good.

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, Hojo said:

if men beg a woman for sex long enough then she can feel bad and give it to them. Pity sex

That's not a thing. Women don't give pity sex.