Nivsch
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Posts posted by Nivsch
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But to be fair Netanyahu is equally an obstacle to the agreement just like the Palestinians.
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7 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:Right now they don't even have full of control of the land that they do own because they are under occupation so are you sure you aren't projecting Israels values onto them?
This is not Israel values but the deep right wing ones. Israel is very diverse between different groups and opinions.
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@Twentyfirst An intentional violent against civilians is not acceptable. I mean they could actually build without ask near the settlements, and to protest if Israelis would resist.
But even easier than that they could accept the peace proposals they have got.
Israel deep right-wing tend to care more about land and religion. The light right wing is diverse between that and the 2 state solution at least before oct 7th.
The center and the left wanted 2 state solution and care less about the land according to what I always hear.
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7 hours ago, Twentyfirst said:Palestinians could take back most of the land by expanding over years just like how Israel did.
Good idea.
Why didn't they do that?
Maybe because they don't so much care about more land in a physcial sense, but rather to have the WHOLE holy land in an ideological sense.
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@Girzo They partially cut out from the world for a reason.
And yes they have responsibility for their situation. Everyone have full responsibility to work on their thinking patterns and their part in every interaction with others, be their situation fair less or more.
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2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:Did not know that the biggest open air prison in the world called Gaza, where nobody can go in and out and is heavily controlled by Israel is a "state".
By Israel and Egypt
I answered above about this to @zazen
They have honestly earned the distrust towards them and why they can't allowed to have marine and air ways.
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@Danioover9000 This is always the result of a positive feedback between the two sides, but they didn't let Israel any choice but to not let them this physical accesses, and they are the ones who refused to any proposal to an independent state and chose terror.
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9 minutes ago, zazen said:A state has its own laws, capital, border air and sea control, airports and ports, sovereignty in the fullest sense including to its own resources (water in West Bank and Gas off of Gaza).
Palestinians may be governed under the pinky finger of Hamas and the PLO but both occupied territories are under the thumb of Israel and the thumb is more dominant than the pinky - there's a reason people play thumb wars.
This is their problem after all the suicide bombing they did and when a terror organization is in charge there, they cant expect maritime and air ways. Gaza shares border with egypt too.
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@Karmadhi Dont know what is "the way they treated". They are an independent state in Gaza and under the PLO in West bank. The settlements problem could end if they would agree to only 1 out of 4653 offers they got.
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There is only one side who initiates attacks against civilians and another side who never (99.9% of its society and the decades long proven policy) wants to do anything unless provoked and acts against the attacks source. Numbers worth nothing out of context.
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@zazen I wanted to comment but this isn't worth it. Tell me when the 7.10 denial sub thread will end 🙂
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@Karmadhi And the Allied killed 350,000 to 500,000 in WW2.
Numbers are meaningless without big picture context.
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3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:Watch your rationalizations.
The desecration of 16 graveyards is not "some bad apples", that comes from official policy.
What do you think the rational behind this if this is indeed a policy?
If so, I want to believe this is only possible because of the current radical government the most radical since Israel establishment. Far right wing toxicity.
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6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:This is pretty bad:
It is frustrating to hear about those dark cells within the system but it is very difficult to demand the whole system to be disciplined or equally moral, with all the depressing reality of the fact that bad apples can infect he whole basket reputation.
@Danioover9000 As every military has and often even more than IDF if to be honest.
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7 hours ago, Girzo said:So you can clearly see how approach chosen by Israel is going to get things worse in the end by radicalizing the other side.
They are human beings. They have at the very least 50% responsibility to the conflict dyamics, aside with full responsibility to their thinking patterns. They can make conclusions in many directions.
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30 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said:I feel sorry for the Israelis, they are so conditioned, manipulated and brainwashed from birth, just lIke how they say Palestinians are, they are big on projecting from their virtual, dream cameras. It’s a cult like experience.
I was indeed brainwashed by exploded buses and restaurants, missiles and shooting on civilians from (almost) birth.
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3 minutes ago, Raze said:Former IDF general and Netanyahu war cabinet member has called for a ceasefire, this is after his son died in combat.
"Only ceasefire can free hostages"
A temporary ceasefire.
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@zazen The weapon you mention is already exist.
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This is just fair to counteract the palestinian propaganda MONSTER being spreaded to hundreds of millions in numbers we cannot compete with, unless we invest in our algorithm to the point it will be better than the other ones.
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1 hour ago, lina said:he beginning of the civil war is typically dated to April 13, 1975, when the Phalangists attacked a bus taking Palestinians to a refugee camp at Tall al-Zaʿtar, Lebanon. The attack escalated an intermittent cycle of violence into a more general battle between the Phalangists and the LNM, whose coalition of Lebanese leftists and Muslims supported the PLO’s cause.
This is only a result of a complex positive feedback happened before that.
1 hour ago, lina said:also due to the arrival of Palestinian refugees in Lebanon (thanks to Israel).
Thanks to the fact they were kicked out of Jordan too.
1 hour ago, lina said:I disagree with this. The way I see it is that Palestinian violence have mostly been a form of retaliation. While the source of violence have started from far-right separatist racist groups.
Its interesting they can never get along with roughly ANYONE.
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1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:I am sure they would be if you give them a fair deal. I saw from the Oslo stuff that even Israelis said "We would not have taken that deal if we were in Palestine place". So it depends on the deal. Give them a 50-50 land split and they will accept im sure.
They got almost 50-50 in 1947. They were offered 67 lines. The 90's agreements were all trust building tries. The whole world tried to help them including Russia and the Arab League but it didn't help.
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18 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:But they are irrelevant.
The Palestinian authority in West Bank is what matters and they seem to be open to it.
Hamas is disowned even by most Arabs.
I dont know why you keep bringing them up.
They suck.
The end.
With that I agree. But no, the PLO are not open at all too and never were. They too rejected every proposal placed on their desk.
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Palestinians are equally hostile to other countries too. Israel is not the source of the problem but an another trigger for them.
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