Nivsch

@Raze From my experience I think your interpretation of Israelis' motivations is wrong

What eats Israel from inside

Charisma is such a powerful tool that can cause very serious problems if the wrong person holds it. Democracy is maybe the best method we have seen so far, but it is still a bad one. I think Meritocracy should be the next level.

But Ra'am isn't part of the Joint List these days, and this alliance include parties whose rhetoric is seen as extreme by many Israelis. But even if we ignore this detail, we still get around 35% of Israeli Jews who don't support disqualifying these Arab parties, which is no less significant.

This thread's goal is to show the election campaign Israel has entered into this month. I am going to show the dynamics here in a new way, which is even more transparent and direct than before. The main emphasis here will be party leaders' daily declarations, the secondary emphasis will be key journalists and Knesset members. I don't want you to suffice with tweets I add here but also to enter the links I will add to every message, read further about the candidates's tweets, and follow twitter's suggestion for you on more politicians from the same political camp. The camps will be represented as evenly as possible and polls will be shown on a weekly basis. All tweets I will add here are originally in Hebrew and aimed to Israeli ears, therefore they reflect a purely internal discussion. I hope you will enjoy reading this thread and you can always ask whatever you want, even if it will be emotionally uncomfortable for me 😝

The Gathering Storm Yair Zivan There is a storm heading toward Israel. " The sanctions announced by the governments of Britain, France and Canada, together with the support of dozens of other countries, are the darkening clouds. They are a warning of what is still to come. For two decades now, I have been involved, in one way or another, in efforts on behalf of Israel. I began as an activist on university campuses in England, then coordinated the political activities of Jewish students across Britain, served in the IDF Spokesperson’s Unit, was responsible for Shimon Peres’s international media relations during his final years as President of Israel, and for more than a decade I have worked with Yair Lapid as a diplomatic adviser, both in government and in opposition. Over those years, I have seen attitudes toward Israel from almost every possible angle — in battles on university campuses, in the corridors of power around the world, and through years of working with the international media. From all those years, and from every possible vantage point, two things are clear to me: Israel’s international standing has never been this bad, and without a change of government, it will become much worse. There are four points that are important to make at the outset: Antisemitism exists in the world. There are people, organizations, donors and countries that will exploit any situation and any opportunity to advance an agenda whose aim, more or less explicitly, is the elimination of the State of Israel. Qatari and Iranian money, and the convergence of antisemitism from the far left, the far right and radical Islam — these forces have always existed, and they always will. Israel’s war in Gaza was just and necessary. We were attacked on October 7. We did not start this war and we did not ask for it, and as long as Hamas held Israeli hostages, there was no possibility of bringing it to an end. War is cruel and difficult, and it exacts a heavy price, especially when fighting a terrorist organization that is both vicious and utterly cynical about human life, hiding behind women and children. The citizens of Israel have the right to choose whatever government they want. We are a democracy. No one can tell us whom to vote for, and we do not take orders from anyone. We established a state so that the Jewish people could once again be sovereign, so that we could take our fate into our own hands rather than depend on the goodwill of another nation. But just as we can vote for whoever we believe deserves to lead the country, the rest of the world can respond to that choice as it sees fit. And it will. Israel cannot be an island nation. We cannot prosper or survive in the way we want to without international markets for our high-tech industry, without security cooperation for our submarines and aircraft, without tourism, and without friends and allies willing to stand by us. There will be time to analyze how we lost the battle for global public opinion after Israelis were massacred inside cities and communities within the State of Israel. How did it happen that, while Israeli men, women and children were being held hostage by a terrorist organization under horrific conditions, we lost the sympathy of the world? While accusations of apartheid and colonialism never truly gained broad traction, or were effectively pushed back against, the accusation of genocide has taken hold in the public consciousness. It is, of course, untrue. Whatever criticism one may have of the war in Gaza, the war does not meet any definition of the term genocide. It is simply a lie. But it is an effective lie. One can look at public-opinion data in the United States, across age groups, ethnic groups and political views, or at international opinion surveys showing that almost nowhere do we still enjoy the level of public support we once had. One can also look at the empty hall at the UN during Prime Minister Netanyahu’s most recent speech, or at the scarcity of diplomatic visits to Israel. But one thing is absolutely clear: the Israeli government has made the situation worse. The outrageous statements, the extremist rhetoric, the indifference to human suffering, the absurd fantasies about resettling Gaza or removing its population, the refusal to confront Jewish terrorism, the inability — or unwillingness — to present a positive vision for the future, and the failure to build a serious public-diplomacy apparatus, choosing instead to appease the worst elements in the government — all of these together have brought us to where we are today. They have alienated our friends and empowered our adversaries. From conversations with diplomats, opinion leaders and politicians abroad, the message is clear: we will not be able to stop the storm unless Israel changes course. Our friends around the world are sounding the alarm. They are asking us to wake up. There will be those who stand beside us while others turn their backs on us. They will be the courageous few. But above all, there are friends who want to stand with us, who want once again to see an Israel they can believe in and support. Those friends are Jewish and non-Jewish; they are on the left, the right and in the center; they sit in capitals across the Middle East. We need to listen to moderate senators and ministers who were once firmly pro-Israel and who are now almost pleading with us to listen. The sentence we hear again and again from our friends is simple: Help us help you. Give us something to work with. Even with a new government, the challenges facing us will be enormous. A new government will have to demonstrate that it shares the values of our friends in the West, that it understands the interests of our friends in the region, and that the world beyond Israel matters to it. I do not want to be a prophet of doom, but the storm heading our way is among the most severe we have faced in our history. Sanctions will expand. Trade will become more difficult. It will begin with everything beyond the Green Line, but it will not stop there. It will begin with goods, but it will not stop there — our banking system will be next. It will begin with a ban on the sale of offensive weapons, but it will not stop there. The demands of the anti-Israel movement will only grow, sympathy within the international community will continue to erode, and politicians will take the easy path and give in to pressure, knowing that they will pay no political price for doing so. Within a few years, every Israeli will feel the impact — in their wallet, in their ability to travel abroad, and ultimately in our ability to defend ourselves effectively. A new government does not need to — and must not — compromise even by a millimeter on Israel’s security. That is the first responsibility of any government toward its citizens, and it is also what the world expects of us. But it will have to understand that real security does not depend on strength alone. It comes from a combination of military power, economic strength, diplomatic standing and social cohesion. It requires both strength at home and partnerships abroad. Anyone who doubts this should examine the weapons systems that keep us safe, the flight paths our pilots take to Iran, or the foundations of our economy. And that brings me to the upcoming election. We face a choice, and that choice has real consequences. Any government that includes Ben Gvir and Smotrich will signal to the world that Israel is continuing along the same path. Any government led by Netanyahu will make a change of course impossible. Policy matters, and the people who sit in government matter too. If we want to repair at least some of the damage, and if we want to take advantage of the opportunities that still exist in the region — and they do still exist — we need a change in leadership and a change in policy. When we go to vote on October 27, we need to remember this reality. We must not close our eyes to the consequences of our choices. Each and every one of us must take those consequences into account when making our decision. " https://www.facebook.com/share/p/19mVY31RwF/

https://x.com/gadi_eisenkot/status/2104822473426391237?s=20

China is perceived as a potential rival for global power while the others largely aren't. Japan is less antagonistic towards the West.

https://x.com/itamarbengvir/status/2104284928095682808?s=20

This is indeed what part of the coalition parties want, especially the far right parties and part of Likud supporters.

But genocide looks completely different. What I think is that this government may be trying to make Gaza uninhabitable in order to make Gazans leave. And this is FAR better supported by evidence from the ground and from government members statements, interviews, and apparent way of thinking.

I agree with you that IDF shows patterns of both stupid action and hyper-cautious methods that many militaries don't use to warn civilians. This shows how heterogenous this organization is, and it isn't surprising because Israel has mandatory military service and IDF draws from different sectors of society.

On the other hand the continuation of the war is unjustified. The IDF has to sit in the perimeter, protect itself and not doing beyond that. Netanyahu wants the war to not end because it serves him politically.

Israel, in the eyes of someone from America or Europe, can sometimes seem - wrongly - like it is a tiny village where everyone talks to everyone. This is why anything an Israeli says or thinks can very easily be perceived as something "all Israelis" or "most Israelis" think.

Sure there are many deeply problematic behaviours fueled by our government and soldiers who act criminally.

Because their actions in Venice portrayed an entire country in a one-dimentional and unrealistic way and therefore it wasn't fair criticism and many Israelis are right to be outraged by that.

But the mechanism is the same. The cheapening of civilians lives in muslim states and the willingness to accept dozens of killed civilians for one terroroist. The undelrying thinking is not unique to Israel. We have seen it in other Western militaries as well. And Gaza is far more densely populated precisely because of the population difference you mentioned.

https://x.com/gadi_eisenkot/status/2103365141177770489?s=20

Unfamiliarity and fear from someone who seems different than you. I admit I feel sometimes a little bit of negative emotions to China as well. Many things which are new to you will feel negative or at least difficult with a sense of 'hostility' at the beginning. Including a new workplace you have just joined to. This doesn't mean China is a better than the US in being a dominant player in the world. It isn't in my opinion.

Something can be bad enough and unacceptable without trying to clothe it in the most bombastic words we can find in the book.

Says someone from abroad who doesn't really know Israel.

In Afghanistan and Iraq tens of thousands of innocent civilians were killed with no 'genocide' trend on social media. This is a problem of Western countries' conduct in guerilla warfare and the cheapening of the lives of civilians as were an acceptable cost of their goals.

https://x.com/YairGolan1/status/2102758829733679595?s=20

The proof: All the cool kids think that so it is true.

I have been impressed from interviews with him that he wants Palestinians to be autonomous in the long term. I will try to find a direct source for that. There were reports that he is talking behind the scenes with the Arab parties on either supporting him from outside, or forming a coalition with him after the elections, to make sure he will get 61 mandates and will be able to form a coalition and a government. On the other hand his party denied such negotiations.