DieFree

Can stage yellow support the death penalty? 

289 posts in this topic

Yellow would say it should be made available, but not forced on anyone.

This is the only acceptable answer.

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1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

You are framing it as if Biden or Trump are just gonna hand out death penalties to people they dislike.

First, not presidents are the ones who are directly doing the imposition of penalty - judges are.

Second, do we really think there is no corruption or that there is little corruption when it comes to judges?

 

But again, even if we assume 0% corruption, innocent people dying is still there, especially, because in your system there would be no fucking around, just straight up quick execution - no room for proving a person innocent. Also, a shooter killing people does not necessarily indicates, that that person is totally untreatable or that it is impossible to heal that person. The guy might have been on drugs thats why he/she did it or there could be a thousand other different reasons. 

 

Edited by zurew

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2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Are you in favor of putting him to death then? 

Yes I would be , but at the same time I wouldn't support a system where death penalty is avaliable. I would rather prefer a system where there is no death penalty and I would bite the bullet, that the guy won't be killed by death penalty.

Anyone would say yes to that question , because it would be based on a very serious personal grudge. But we shouldn't make a law system based on personal feelings and grudges.

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6 minutes ago, zurew said:

Yes I would be , but at the same time I wouldn't support a system where death penalty is avaliable. I would rather prefer a system where there is no death penalty and I would bite the bullet, that the guy won't be killed by death penalty.

Anyone would say yes to that question , because it would be based on a very serious personal grudge. But we shouldn't make a law system based on personal feelings and grudges.

Thats right but the question is why are you not in favor?  It shouldn't be just because someone could be innocent.  It should be because it's wrong at a high level.   Freeing up resources is a very low consciousness reason.   You could make the argument for yellow bring in favor of that because it sees society has no other option.   But it's weak.  It really is.

 

Edited by Inliytened1

 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

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1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

In obvious cases, like when we have video of a shooter, he can be executed immediately after the trial. This endless process of appeals for obvious cases is just silly.

Some percentage of murderers are rehabilitatable, plus some percentage of the convicted will be innocent. And if you say you can execute someone immediately after the trial based on solid evidence, you have to be wary about people who are possibly convicted innocently since their evidence is not as solid, not like with a video tape. This double standard would require a large-scale overhaul of the legal system, which is not going to happen anytime soon.

8 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

Yellow would say it should be made available, but not forced on anyone.

This is the only acceptable answer.

Execution by suicide?

 

Honestly if you really want a shooter or a rapist dead you should just do it yourself and not hand them over to the government for them to deal with.

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Just now, AtheisticNonduality said:

Execution by suicide?

Euthanasia.

Once stigma around it disappears, I'm sure it will become an option for prisoners.

It's more humane, and saves money.

 

Just now, AtheisticNonduality said:

Honestly if you really want a shooter or a rapist dead you should just do it yourself and not hand them over to the government for them to deal with.

Well that's a very Red thing of you to say.

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3 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

Euthanasia.

Once stigma around it disappears, I'm sure it will become an option for prisoners.

It's more humane, and saves money.

How do you determine if there are options besides euthanasia?

3 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

Well that's a very Red thing of you to say.

The entire concept of killing people for things they've done is Red. It just takes the topic to its core which people are avoiding.

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1 minute ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

How do you determine if there are options besides euthanasia?

Well there are.  You just offer euthanasia on top of everything else.

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2 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

It's more humane, and saves money.

Quote

In the 32 states in the Union where the death penalty is legal, as well as the federal government, the death penalty has grown to be much more expensive than life imprisonment, whether with or without parole. This greater cost comes from more expensive living conditions, a much more extensive legal process, and increasing resistance to the death penalty from chemical manufacturers overseas. These costs could even become higher, pending the outcome of various lawsuits against various states for their “botched” executions. Each death penalty inmate costs approximately $1.12 million (2015 USD) more than a general population inmate.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/324804378_The_Death_Penalty_vs_Life_Incarceration_A_Financial_Analysis

Quote

A New York study compared a $1.4 million cost figure for each death penalty trial with $602,000 for the cost of life imprisonment for 40 years in noncapital cases. Florida has estimated that the true cost of each execution is approximately $3.2 million, or approximately 6 times what it would cost to keep the person in prison for life. 

https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/capital-punishment-or-life-imprisonment-some-cost-considerations

 

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1 minute ago, zurew said:

 

That's 100% a man-made problem, and who gets that money anyway? Just lawyers and whatever other Americans.

I'm not seeing a real problem here.

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35 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

By your logic no one should ever be imprisoned either. No system is perfect nor immune to corruption.

It's not like imprisoning an innocent person isn't awful.

It's not even clear that imprisoning an innocent person for 30 years is better than a death penalty.

You can easily find cases which are 100% obvious with all the video evidence now available. In the near future most serious crimes will have video evidence. Nobody is being innocently convicted of mass shootings. Get real here.

Does the criminal justice system have a way of making sure that a certain video evidence is not fake? A lot of videos can be easily doctored these days with methods such as Deepfakes.

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7 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

That's 100% a man-made problem, and who gets that money anyway? Just lawyers and whatever other Americans.

You can't in one breath say that its cheaper and in other breath say this: "Just lawyers and whatever other Americans getting the money anyway" .

I mean yeah fuck it who cares about any cost or spending, money will circle around anyway between people and the government , right? - This take literally means nothing, and no one would use this when it comes to financial questions.

Edited by zurew

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Just now, zurew said:

You can't in one breath say that its cheaper and in other breath say this: "Just lawyers and whatever other Americans getting the money anyway" .

I mean yeah fuck it who cares about any cost or spending, money will circle around anyway between people and the governemnt , right? - This take literally means nothing, and no one would use this when it comes to financial questions.

8 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

I'm not seeing a real problem here.

 

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10 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

I'm not seeing a real problem here.

You wanted to make an argument about it being cheaper, and when you are being confronted that its not, you reverted back to a point, that is ignoring everything about economics and finance.

You need to decide ,whether you care about the financial part or not.

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I'd like to offer a different perspective. If i was so mentally fucked up that I was raping, killing and torturing innocent people, I would want someone to end my suffering instead of keeping me locked in a cage for 40 years. The death penalty is euthanasia since you would have to be in such profound states of suffering to resort to killing people. From god's perspective its like waking yourself up from an extremely fucked up nightmare.

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As a certified yellow poster on this forum I do not support the death penalty. We can close this thread now, yellow has spoken. 

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Just now, zurew said:

You wanted to make an argument about it being cheaper, and when you are being confronted that its not, you reverted back to a point, that is ignoring everything about economics and finance.

You need to decide ,whether you care about the financial part or not.

Again, it's a man-made problem.  There is no reason euthanasia must cost millions.  How much does a bullet cost?  If it's voluntary then there should be no legal drama too.  Should cost less than $50 to have someone killed, any more than $1k is a complete scam and a product of corruption.

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Just now, Raptorsin7 said:

As a certified yellow poster on this forum I do not support the death penalty. We can close this thread now, yellow has spoken. 

Ohh I'm afraid your application to Yellow™ has been rejected, I thought you heard:(

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1 minute ago, thisintegrated said:

  If it's voluntary then there should be no legal drama too.

If its voluntary, then I agree with you.

39 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

It shouldn't be just because someone could be innocent.

Yeah, right that argument wouldn't work alone.

39 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

It should be because it's wrong at a high level. 

Okay if I ignore the finance part , and if I ignore the innocence part and i just purely focus on the morals here is my take:

I think taking a human life is morally the most serious or worst action someone could ever do, thats why it needs very strong justification, but I don't see a strong justification when it comes to death penalty. I just see killing a person, when it is not neccessary.

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8 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

As a certified yellow poster on this forum I do not support the death penalty. We can close this thread now, yellow has spoken. 

Shall I lock?  Yellow Indeed has spoken.  Nothing more needs be said. 


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

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