Meditating 2 Hours Every Day - 1 Year Later (& Psychedelics vs. Meditation)

[impulse9]

Yeah I agree in principle @Leo Gura. I don't feel psychedelics are absolutely necessary for spiritual growth, but since our society and civilization is so damn materialistic and so lost in the ego identified mind, they can be a potent way to break that illusion. But once you break it, why insist on doing it? Just groove with the universe. If you get it, you got it.

[mandyjw]

@Consilience Awesome!

You don't need either psychedelics or meditation since you made them up for your own benefit. Nice to have though. 

 

[Zeroguy]

Psychedelics - high risk, high reward or high downfall. Extremly high price too. 

6 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

@Consilience Awesome!

You don't need either psychedelics or meditation since you made them up for your own benefit. Nice to have though. 

 

Adopted beleif systems for your own benefit without any actual work behind them. 

Truth is that you don't know. 

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by Zeroguy

[impulse9]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

 

 

 

Decent explanation. Basically all effort is God's effort, which makes it effortless.

You can enlighten yourself effortlessly, but it's going to take a ton of effort, LOL

[Zeroguy]

Still have only 3 points left better start crying and complaining. 

Who was actual truth seeker and was interested actual truth will swim out. 

Already knows what to do. 

[mandyjw]

2 minutes ago, Zeroguy said:

Adopted beleif systems for your own benefit without any actual work behind them. 

Work and need go together and feed one another endlessly, but freedom and love are the True Infinity. You get nothing Zero. 

[Consilience]

15 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

@Consilience Awesome!

You don't need either psychedelics or meditation since you made them up for your own benefit. Nice to have though. 

 

??

[Leo Gura]

33 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

But once you break it, why insist on doing it?

I have done over 150 trips and my depth of understanding of God has not plateaued. It keeps going deeper.

This stuff is way deeper than any teacher or school leads on.

If I had stopped after 50 trips, I would have been a fool.

[Matthew85]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I have done over 150 trips and my depth of understanding of God has not plateaued. It keeps going deeper.

In the same way astronomers will never find the end of the universe, I presume we can deepen our depth of understanding of god forever. 

[impulse9]

That's by design. It will never plateau.

I mean look, I've done at least a 100 mushroom trips, some of which were proper breakthrough experiences. Then I did a bunch of Salvia sessions with the last one being the one that finally broke me to my core, and then I decided to stop doing them because basically I've seen all I care to see. I know it goes infinitely deep, so why bother any further. Eventually you get to experience things that are absolutely impossible to integrate at any level, so what can you do at that point? Keep doing it forever? Towards what end?

The endpoint should be humbleness and riding on the wings of power. This is why I have infinite respect for people like Eckhart Tolle. He's simply grooving with the universe. Like a humble little Yoda.

[Consilience]

The object that wants to keep exploring these never ending, infinite depths is the very thing preventing the clear seeing of reality while in any and all states. 

Edit: And it’s actually incorrect to refer to it as an object, it’s an activity that’s completely void of ‘real’ substance. 

Edited October 3, 2021 by Consilience

[impulse9]

Also I would disagree that any teaching doesn't address these issues directly. For me the most profound books I've ever read by a considerable notch are the books by Castaneda. You may have a different opinion of those, but they have profoundly influenced me and shaped who I am today. Don Juan (the Yaqui shaman in those books) was very specific about these substances. He said basically that they are immaterial entities, essentially ally spirits. He was very clear that the magical domains they help you to enter are infinite and unknowable. He said there is no end to the mystery, and this is simply something a person on this path has to deeply and fully accept. He also said that after your initiation into non-ordinary states of awareness, you should work towards raising your own personal power, at which point you'll be able to heighten your consciousness enough to enter these magical domains with ease and without any aid. And until you can't do that, you are working with borrowed power, and you will never be able to tell whether or not these spirits are simply tricking you, or showing you the truth. This is the nature of their existence. They are tricksters.

[Leo Gura]

38 minutes ago, Consilience said:

The object that wants to keep exploring these never ending, infinite depths is the very thing preventing the clear seeing of reality while in any and all states. 

Edit: And it’s actually incorrect to refer to it as an object, it’s an activity that’s completely void of ‘real’ substance. 

What's being explored is not external forms, what's being explored is God itself. To claim this is some tangent or distraction is precisely incorrect. You cannot know what God is without exploring what God is. And it becomes extremely evident to me that Buddhists, Vipassana meditators, self-inquirers, Neo-Advaita folk, and their ilk do not understand what God is. Because they haven't explored it.

You cannot understand God simply by shutting down your mind and accessing some Jnana or cessation. That is not what God is. Nor can you understand what God is via Vipassana-like deconstruction of sensory experience.

None of that is it. Loss of ego is not it. No-self is not it. Nothingness is not it. Emptiness is not it. Liberation is not it.

29 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

Also I would disagree that any teaching doesn't address these issues directly. For me the most profound books I've ever read by a considerable notch are the books by Castaneda. You may have a different opinion of those, but they have profoundly influenced me and shaped who I am today. Don Juan (the Yaqui shaman in those books) was very specific about these substances. He said basically that they are immaterial entities, essentially ally spirits. He was very clear that the magical domains they help you to enter are infinite and unknowable. He said there is no end to the mystery, and this is simply something a person on this path has to deeply and fully accept. He also said that after your initiation into non-ordinary states of awareness, you should work towards raising your own personal power, at which point you'll be able to heighten your consciousness enough to enter these magical domains with ease and without any aid. And until you can't do that, you are working with borrowed power, and you will never be able to tell whether or not these spirits are simply tricking you, or showing you the truth. This is the nature of their existence. They are tricksters.

I love Casteneda's work, but God-realization it is not, like at all.

[impulse9]

@Leo Gura I guess not. Since I've had my mind blown by those books as a teenager, I've been struggling to find some kind of middle ground between that, the nondual teachings, Zen, Tao, your teachings, etc.

I've found none.  Reality seems to work at too many levels at once. And what do I know, maybe your realization is the highest, I have no way to empirically test it. I know that my Salvia trips have shown me without a shadow of a doubt that there is no end to mystery, all I can do is theoretically say, ok so maybe it's God simply playing tricks with me through all these various methods and ways.

Honestly the more in harmony I feel with reality, the less I tend to even ask any questions about it. The scent of a flower is self-sufficient. It doesn't need explanation.

[Leo Gura]

@impulse9 Are you conscious that you are creating yourself? That reality is your Will?

[impulse9]

Nope. I've had trips like that on mushrooms and Salvia though. Where oneness of everything and the fact that my perception is the only thing that exists was so apparent that it simply couldn't be questioned. But in my daily life, I have no such awareness. Nor do I think I would be able to even survive if that was my continuous perception

[Consilience]

14 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

What's being explored is not external forms,

If what's being explored is not a quality of this very moment, as the actuality of this moment, it is not going meta enough if the goal is Enlightenment. End of story. If the goal is to explore the depths of consciousness, absolutely with you. 

But Enlightenment is too a process, but a process that is inclusive not exclusive. The work you describe with psychedelics feels incredibly exclusive. 

Edited October 4, 2021 by Consilience

[impulse9]

Also you said Castaneda isn't about God realization, but Don Juan was very specific about this very point. So ok, he didn't mention solipsism. But he did absolutely mention that YOU are creating your reality right now. And the method to stop it is to stop talking to yourself. Everything you know, hear, see, experience, is basically YOUR own creation. This is a very fundamental lesson in those books.

[Ora]

26 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

What's being explored is not external forms, what's being explored is God itself. To claim this is some tangent or distraction is precisely incorrect. You cannot know what God is without exploring what God is. And it becomes extremely evident to me that Buddhists, Vipassana meditators, self-inquirers, Neo-Advaita folk, and their ilk do not understand what God is. Because they haven't explored it.

well this is self evident in that Buddhism specifically states there is no God or creator being. I cant remember where i read it, but i read something someone posted about how the brain works and how something with neurons communicating with each other and synapses firing or other and how the brain doesnt actually experience reality as a continuity and how it merely infers different memories are related creating an experience of relativity where in reality each moment is merely its own moment and has no continuity to the next. this is similar to buddhism and how each mind moment is only made up of its individual part and while one moment influences the next there actually is no continuity to it, no soul behind it, no god existing in between. literally the matrix, just numbers in combination which create relative reality. almost like computer code. like how a picture on your computer is only the code that made it up but yet we see form because we try to associate it to something. 

i wish i saved that post by someone, it very elegantly explained it in very scientific terms of how the brain functions and perceives. something i cant do because i dont have that depth of scientific understanding.

when a person becomes a noble one, they no longer have doubt and wrong view of rights and rituals. this includes the belief in a creator being/god being.

i also want to add your understanding of jhana is a bit off the mark. jhana is used as a tool to do vipassana, contemplation of suffering, impermanence, and nonself on mentality and materiality. when you come out of jhanas its like the come down on psycs, where you get this EXTREME processing capacity. normally you have millions of mind moments in a snap of the fingers but you arent aware of these processes going on, but after coming out of jhana you can see every single mind moment going on and do vipassana on it. that is the only purpose of jhana. buddha expressly states jhana does not lead to nibanna. its merely a microscope for your brain so you can process every single nano second of reality, whereas in daily life you count your awareness of existance in seconds minutes and hours when in reality theres so much going on even within every nano second.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Ora

[Ilan]

Why mahasamadhi Then? In your 30outrageous exploration in consciousness. You say, if you go deeper you are death. Nevertheless. You keep going deeper. To me it is just that in your 30outrageous exploration you started really to unground yourself. You maybe could have gone insane If you did not resist the infinite light but I highly doubt you would have destroyed the whole universe Leo. I believe if you go deep with psychedelics, take  the time to integrate, ground yourself and go deeper as you yourself say. You can do deeper and deeper. And in fact you are as far away as infinite understanding as you were when you were a baby cause it is infinite. You can make fiber distinction forever with your mind. To me mahasamadhi does not make sense. Why masamhadhi when you can Always go deeper ? You can play the game of ground—>unground yourself forever as long as you want as a human. Mahasamadhi sounds just like a waste to me.

why is there something rather than nothing?

does free will exist ?

what am I ? 
 

this question can be explore forever. I would bet you are the one on earth who has found the deeper response to this questions. But you can go deeper. There is no definitive answer as you often claim to me. And yes anyone that claims there is no definitive answer so I stop searching is a fool. But I think they have this point right that there is no definitive answer nor will there ever be. It is the nature of reality.  
(waiting for Leo to confront this and show me what I’m missing)