Tim R

Question on J. Peterson

39 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I could never understand why someone as intelligent as him doesn't understand that e.g. "evil" or "good" aren't actually real and just arbitrary attributions. You know how he's always out to "make things better". 

"You're wretched and horrible and useless and resentful, get your act together, bucko!" This sort of attitude.

How come he never heard of nonduality? (or at least never talks about it?) He even took some Psilocybin for god sake, he knows about psychedelics, he knows about DMT and the entities, he knows that mystical experiences are real (although I think he's afraid of the implications they bear). He's so well-read and knows so much, his knowledge and his philosophical position are almost contradictory. 

He knows that there's something very fishy about materialism. He even knows that consciousness is fundamental to reality!

So... Why is he not looking deeper into these topics? He's definitely smart enough to be a full-blown stage Yellow thinker, and yet he preaches that we are miserable worms who need to redeem themselves. Classic original sin guilt trip, why does he buy into this stuff?

Or am I not seeing something?

Edited by Tim R

"Love is all that I can give to you ❤ Love is more than just a game for two!"

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JErVP6xLZwg 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Tim R said:

I could never understand why someone as intelligent as him doesn't understand that e.g. "evil" or "good" aren't actually real and just arbitrary attributions.

Because he was indoctrined with a religious worldview.

The mind cannot just surrender the operating system it was programmed with any more than your computer can. This would require a painful and long jailbreaking of one's mind, which virtually no one is prepared to pursue.

The dude's who life hinges on duality. For JP nonduality would cause him a mental breakdown of epic proportions.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Video is a few years old, but David Pakman had by the far the best take I've seen as far as Jordon Peterson. In it, he goes into some of the problems with Jordon Peterson without demonizing him, and gives due credit to the helpful aspects that people have latched on to, while also highlighting the problematic ways that his academic work and self help advice have become entangled with a Conservative, religious worldview (and how Peterson is not honest about the fact that he clearly subscribes to a Conservative ideology).

 

Edited by DocWatts

The problem is one of opposition between subjective and objective points of view. 

So either the objective conception of the world is incomplete, or the subjective involves illusions that should be rejected.  - Thomas Nagel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If JP ever truly comprehended nonduality there is a good likelihood he might kill himself. So for his sake perhaps it's best he never discovers it.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you watch his lectures, you will notice that he takes too much pride in his understanding of reality.

The pride of a deep understanding of reality keeps you bound to the understanding. 

Also, he was/is too concerned with his image of a public intellectual and was surrendering too much power to the great psychologist of the past (Jung, Freud) and he wants to be perceived as their best student. 

When he was a professor at Harvard, he basically replaced Timothy Leary and if I had to bet, I would say that there is a 90% probability that JP has achieved some mystical states with or without psychedelics. Why he doesn't speak about them is beyond me...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

If JP ever truly comprehended nonduality there is a good likelihood he might kill himself.

@Leo Gura Oh man, that's a pretty grave position. Why do you go that far? I mean, he will have a severe existential crisis and whatnot for sure, but killing himself? Seems a bit too much.

1 hour ago, JosephKnecht said:

When he was a professor at Harvard, he basically replaced Timothy Leary and if I had to bet, I would say that there is a 90% probability that JP has achieved some mystical states with or without psychedelics. Why he doesn't speak about them is beyond me...

@JosephKnecht I also think he had some experiences, probably with psychedelics rather than without - his mind would've never shut up on its own, he's too caught up in concepts. But I also think that he interpreted them in a Judeo-Christian context. You know, how Christians drop acid and see Jesus Christ, I guess he had a similar experience, but as you said, he doesn't want to lose his respectability as an intellectual. Which is why he so ungracefully stumbles around ideas concerning divinity with his rational-scientific, existentialist and phenomenological approach. 


"Love is all that I can give to you ❤ Love is more than just a game for two!"

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JErVP6xLZwg 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that Green can serve as a ramp that leads you to non-duality. He is reluctant to go up that ramp. Green's more feminine and proto-holistic qualities unlocks key mystical aspects involved with emotional embodiment and opens up that deep intuitional longing towards unity. There is a reason why New Age spirituality is a Green phenomena.


To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Yali said:

why?

ego backlash


 "If you showed a caveman our technology, he would think it was magic. And if you showed a modern man magic, he would think it was technology." - Outlast (video game)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If he were treated as a talented psychologist rather than a dubious messiah, his incomplete development would not be considered a problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Tim R said:

Why do you go that far?

Because he's already in a fragile state.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, JosephKnecht said:

When he was a professor at Harvard, he basically replaced Timothy Leary and if I had to bet, I would say that there is a 90% probability that JP has achieved some mystical states with or without psychedelics. Why he doesn't speak about them is beyond me...

He has had mystical experiences both with and without psychedelics, but he gets stuck with the framing. It all gets clouded by intellect and fear.

 


To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

He has had mystical experiences both with and without psychedelics, but he gets stuck with the framing. It all gets clouded by intellect and fear.

 

Haha, he was tripping in his living room listening to Mozart, great!😂😂

It's a real pity that he doesn't just come right out saying that he dropped 150µ or however much it was.

Boy the world would benefit so much if he'd become a bit more of a hippie, I already said it and I'll keep saying it goddammit! 


"Love is all that I can give to you ❤ Love is more than just a game for two!"

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JErVP6xLZwg 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

If JP ever truly comprehended nonduality there is a good likelihood he might kill himself. So for his sake perhaps it's best he never discovers it.

If psychedelics are so dangerous, it would have been more responsible if gave bigger warnings to people with psychological issues who want to take psychedelics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, StarStruck said:

If psychedelics are so dangerous, it would have been more responsible if gave bigger warnings to people with psychological issues who want to take psychedelics.

People don't believe and skip all the warnings anyways. And I'm sick of giving out warnings all the time. Half my videos are warnings about traps.

Spiritual work will fuck your mind up bad no matter how you slice it. That's the nature of the game. If you don't want to face death, don't do spiritual work.

Spirituality = facing your own death head-on and coming out the other end. Anything shy of that is not serious spirituality, it's delay tactics.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

People don't believe and skip all the warnings anyways. And I'm sick of giving out warnings all the time. Half my videos are warnings about traps.

Spiritual work will fuck your mind up bad no matter how you slice it. That's the nature of the game. If you don't want to face death, don't do spiritual work.

Spirituality = facing your own death head-on and coming out the other end. Anything shy of that is not serious spirituality, it's delay tactics.

Yea, but there is a difference between giving warnings about losing wealth/health and losing one's life. You do give warnings about the danger of death but some people might not be conscious enough about their psychological issues/past traumas and think they can take psychedelics like somebody who had a healthy childhood.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@StarStruck Just taking a psychedelic is not really gonna do much for ya. What I'm talking about requires deep contemplation and probing. Weak people will stop long before they get that far. Psychedelics tend to be self-regulating. You go too deep, you freak out, and you swear them off forever because you're not serious about Truth.

But yeah, psychedelics are dangerous for sure. Extreme caution required. You could seriously fuck up your mind if you don't know what you're doing.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@StarStruck Just taking a psychedelic is not really gonna do much for ya. What I'm talking about requires deep contemplation and probing. Weak people will stop long before they get that far. Psychedelics tend to be self-regulating. You go too deep, you freak out, and you swear them off forever because you're not serious about Truth.

But yeah, psychedelics are dangerous for sure. Extreme caution required. You could seriously fuck up your mind if you don't know what you're doing.

I freak out about my life situation when I take psychedelics. I went into therapy to sort things out before I go back to psychedelics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, StarStruck said:

You do give warnings about the danger of death but some people might not be conscious enough about their psychological issues/past traumas and think they can take psychedelics like somebody who had a healthy childhood.

And what's Leo supposed to do about that?o.O

In the end it's completely their own responsibility.


"Love is all that I can give to you ❤ Love is more than just a game for two!"

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JErVP6xLZwg 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Tim R said:

And what's Leo supposed to do about that?o.O

In the end it's completely their own responsibility.

It is like giving a gun to a monkey and asking "what is wrong about that? It is their own responsibility".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now