AlphaAbundance

Are the choices slavery, (pursuit of) freedom or death?

44 posts in this topic

         I feel uninterested in putting in constant effort just to live. However, effort seems to be a fact of life. One must put in effort to achieve physiological needs, safety needs, etc. While in current times, one has to work for money to buy food, clothing, shelter, utilities, etc, in the past, one had to hunt and gather for food (basically there was always effort to live). And it seems that effort, when not coming from a place of passion or interest, is simply suffering. There appears to be (like many/all things) a spectrum consisting of enjoyable effort (like flow, video games, hobbies, etc.) <----->  suffering effort (like chores, work, taking out the trash)

        Anyway, basically all my life I have been suffering from the effort I've had to put in school. While in earlier grade school it wasn't that much effort, around mid high school, and right now in college, it's like the effort significantly increased. While before I was living financially dependent on parents, as that wanes I now have to start to support myself. This means I basically have to go to college and later have a job (i.e likely with sufferable effort of a dull, hard, and uninteresting nature). And this suffering seems unlikely to change in my life going forward as I am not that interested/passionate in any of the fields that have well-paying jobs. Furthermore, even if there was a career or job in a passionate field there would still be a heavy percentage of bullshit (dull, menial, chore-ish sufferable effort). So basically sufferable effort seems inevitable. So some of the options I have are here

SLAVERY

  • Wage Slavery
  • Homelessness, Insecure Basic Needs

     Obviously, not as bad as real slavery but it still doesn't meet the necessary thresholds. I don't know but suspect this is a common issue (consistent sufferable effort), it's not really depression (although it can cause it), self-esteem issues, or any of that. It's just simply suffering from having to drudge, menial, chore-full, laborious, boring, uninteresting work. It may be an inclination toward laziness or entitlement from a non-poor, first-world lifestyle. Nonetheless, the fact remains that I am suffering from having to put in boring/menial/uninteresting effort (to sustain my basic needs) in college right now and in a job in the future. It's not that I can't do the boring, pointless, stupid, sufferable effort, I have been working "hard" (pretty relative) at a magnet high school and to get a somewhat prestigious scholarship at a decent/okay university (Actually, maybe I can't anymore. I just basically missed a whole week's worth of assignments cause I don't think I can do it anymore). I've lost a lot of stage orange motivation after I realized it was all subjective, meaningless bullshit. (It's like I completely missed stage blue willpower and discipline, haha) To put it plainly: I HATE WORK. I FUCKING HATE WORK. ITS SO FUCKING STUPID AND HARD AND DUMB. However, it seems there are some solutions:

(PURSUIT OF) FREEDOM

  • Pursue Early Financial Freedom (FIRE) and do whatever you want
  • Create a Business / Work Self-Employed (and maybe even as an employee if the stars align) where you are making money doing what you want  

        The first option works to eliminate most of the sufferable effort (in sustaining your basic needs) by acquiring financial freedom early. This path likely means a lot of effort upfront (counterintuitive haha), some enjoyable effort (such as the meaning in knowing you are making progress to long-term freedom) but a whole of sufferable effort. The second option works to eliminate most of the sufferable effort (in sustaining your basic needs) by creating sources of income that derive from enjoyable sources of effort. I doubt anyone will find jobs that will allow you to do 100% (or even 60%) what you want but maybe this is possible as an entrepreneur. Other than having a windfall (or something of that nature), these options seem like the only reliable option for this major problem of consistent suffering from effort. Although there is one last option I haven't covered.

DEATH

  • Let go of need to live
  • End your life

These seem to be suboptimal options but I don't know if consistent suffering in college and work, having a slow death as a wage slave, is better than the fast option of just letting go of life. Right now, I don't think I will ever do anything to take my life due to some reasons concerning aesthetics (haha if you know, you know) and maximizing all options (just in case, the other option is always there, you know?) but still if I continue to suffer through this effort who knows what will happen. As of right now, it seems I will strive for the freedom options and if it doesn't happen within a reasonable time period I may follow the flowchart to the death options. However, even with the freedom option, there seems to be a lot of sufferable effort and uncertainty. Death really doesn't seem that bad considering the alternatives. If you made it this far, thank you for reading. Please share your thoughts (and any feedback on the post/writing). I may try again with a shorter post if nobody reads this. 

Tl;Dr

I fucking hate work. I'm too lazy to do anything. I think I might drop my scholarship, drop college, and drop the urge to live as well. When the options are effort for freedom, the effort of slavery, and the easiness of death, what should one do?

Please share your thoughts and insights. Some questions to consider are

  • For those who don't want to work to live, is death the only path?  How do you have a purely effortless, if not low effort yet still rewarding and optimal life? If one is unable to put in the effort or any effort to survive should they kill themselves? 
  • If pursuing freedom is uncertain and a lot of suffering of effort, should one just choose death? If someone fails at pursuing freedom, should they just end it all?
  • What is the ranking of the paths of slavery, freedom, and death?
  • Are there other choices? Are there other paths/options?
  • Is this a common issue or just laziness/entitlement in not wanting to work?
  • What are your perspectives? What is best for people in general? What should I do? What is best for me to do? 
Edited by AlphaAbundance

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Good questions. 

Viewed from the perspective of the mind, life is basically a load of chores and suffering and then we die anyway. It is important to realise that this is not necessarily the highest perspective.

I totally relate to not wanting to work, and found that seeking the most affordable housing and aggressively paying down debts was a fairly safe way to improve independence. Keep in mind that not working can also cause mental issues, so the best outcome might be part-time work.

Death is not really an option as I understand it (sources like near-death experience reports and the Neale Donald Walsch book Home with God). It basically means having to come back and try again. This implies that life does have a legitimate purpose at some level.

There may be other options like living in other countries. But my best advice would be to put more energy into dis-identifying from the mind. It is essentially speaking on your behalf and causing untold misery. Liberation from it is possible.


"No teaching, no teacher, no student." - Papaji

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Welcome to the human world. 

You don't have many options. Either your own business or your job. In both you need to work. 


.

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Pursue what you love, bro. Don't make it complicated.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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36 minutes ago, AlphaAbundance said:
  • Let go of need to live
  • End your life

This is a bad ideology if you hate your life. Root yourself in your body and life. Escaping will lead you toward hurting yourself. 


Infinite Love to you 🙏❤

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@No Self Appreciate your response.

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Viewed from the perspective of the mind, life is basically a load of chores and suffering and then we die anyway. It is important to realise that this is not necessarily the highest perspective.

  • What would this higher perspective be? Being™? Enlightenment®? Flowing with the present moment? I guess that's always the solution to everything haha.
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I totally relate to not wanting to work, and found that seeking the most affordable housing and aggressively paying down debts was a fairly safe way to improve independence. Keep in mind that not working can also cause mental issues, so the best outcome might be part-time work.

Ok so focusing on the most affordable housing and paying down debts is key,

When I am financially free (If this is in my future) I would just do whatever I want. That would probably eventually lead to and allow more time for life purpose, altruism, consciousness work, personal development, and other endeavors.

  • Could you elaborate on what mental issues? What do you mean by that? (Like feeling bored, lack of purpose, lack of feeling "productive"?)
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Death is not really an option as I understand it (sources like near-death experience reports and the Neale Donald Walsch book Home with God). It basically means having to come back and try again. This implies that life does have a legitimate purpose at some level.

Yeah, but it might not be this world. Maybe I will be able to reincarnate into a paradise9_9? (Or maybe it will be a hell? :o) Holy shit this is a gamble. However, I'm not too concerned about this.

Yeah, I've heard about how life's "purpose" may be about raising your consciousness, developing to the point where you transcend this life, all carnate existence, and move up to the next form of life. However even this would be impermanent, wouldn't it? (Just food for thought)

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There may be other options like living in other countries. But my best advice would be to put more energy into dis-identifying from the mind. It is essentially speaking on your behalf and causing untold misery. Liberation from it is possible.

Ok so potentially live in other countries but most importantly focus on dis-identifying with the mind. 

That is probably true, one of the solutions to this. However, it does seem that because I am disidentifying more that I am losing the drive for survival. It seems that this is leading me to suffer from the mundane, dull, uninteresting effort of working (and for now college work) to survive.

  • How would higher levels of consciousness help with this in particular? How would higher consciousness help with the feeling of suffering when exerting myself physically and mentally? (I think this might be something that isn't really connected with emotions just like how getting stabbed is just a direct bodily response)
Edited by AlphaAbundance

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@Preety_India Yeah sounds like a pretty shitty deal. I'm sure there is some other realities in absolute infinity that have effortless excellent living. Doesn't it make you want to just reset? xD

 

@Leo Gura Lmaoo

 

@DreamScape How is it an ideology? Why root yourself in body and life? What is meant by escaping? (Like killing yourself?) Who will get hurt when I escape? Wouldn't that mean I am dead? And my ego is evaporated into infinity? :/

 

@Hello from Russia  Здравствуйте, I'm from the USA

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What you describe sounds like depression. A while ago I had the exact same questions in my mind and the exact same points you had. It really surprises me that others are thinking this way too. And now I realize that's what the Buddha said about "Life is suffering".. interesting. However I let go of this way of thinking. How? Why? Because I realized it's just a perspective.

So the solution is to change your perspective. You basically talk about how hard it is to keep yourself alive. What you describe is a set of beliefs. 

  • Living is hard.
  • Living is unenjoyable.
  • Living is 60% chores and 40% fun. (or maybe you're thinking 90% and 10%, or 50% / 50%)
  • Living is about either satisfying needs or dying.
  • If you work for someone you are a slave.

It helps asking the right questions to get to the bottom of why you are suffering.

  1. Why is living hard? What makes living hard? When is living not hard? How to make the hard parts of living easy in a creative way? Is there a shortcut to things? Do I only want to do easy things?
  2. Why am I not enjoying life? What are the parts of life I am not enjoying? Why? What would make me enjoy them? Can I make them enjoyable? Why am I not allowing myself to be happy? What's keeping me from being happy? What makes me happy in life?
  3. Can I find happiness in doing chores? Can thinking of the the end result of the work I do or chores I finish motivate me to do them? What is the point of the work I do? Am I not motivated because I don't find meaning in the end result of my work? What is meaning? What do I find meaningful? Is meaningful work always fun? Are the fruits of my effort sweet or bitter? Is my goal in life to always have fun and only do enjoyable things? Why?
  4. Is there anything else to life than satisfying needs? What are the steps I need to take to the point where I don't need to consciously take care of satisfying my needs? 
  5. Am I a slave or am I a work partner? Is the work I do benefiting someone or me in a meaningful way, or am I just working towards a cause that I disagree with or don't find meaning in?

You don't need to answer these questions to me, it's just something to meditate on. I hope in the end you find meaning in life and all the suffering it causes. I genuinely want to help. 

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2 minutes ago, AlphaAbundance said:

Yeah sounds like a pretty shitty deal. I'm sure there is some other realities in absolute infinity that have effortless excellent living. Doesn't it make you want to just reset? xD

Yes life is a shitty deal. Not just for you, but for me and everyone. Just deal with it. 

No other reality exists. If you get those beautiful realities, just ping me and I'll come flying on my winged unicorn and take a hiatus from my actual reality and take refuge in your beautiful reality. I'll make sandwich and tea for you every day as a return favor. 


.

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@AlphaAbundance

Yes, the higher perspective is enlightenment/liberation or whatever one wishes to call it, but it is important to distinguish the mental idea of enlightenment with the actual experience. In simple terms, you distinguish the Self that is looking out through your eyes right now from the noisy little human self that is always grappling with problems to do with past and future. Only the present consciousness is real. This would change your entire outlook as you can imagine. Having more insights from the higher intelligence might give you a newfound purpose of some kind, or you might still prefer to chill out. There's no right or wrong, except be true to yourself.

Owning a home and having basic living costs covered is incredibly liberating, though is easier said than done unless there is access to a substantial sum. Even then, there can be all sorts of restrictions around money for everyday living and it can get depressing. As for mental issues, there can be a certain lethargy caused by a lack of positive engagement with people and challenges. But if you are involved with other goals, that would likely not be an issue. But the finances are hard to get right if there's no external source of support. Sometimes I say that surviving on part-time work is a more achievable goal.

Many near-death experiences end because people are told by higher powers that their mission here is not complete. If someone dies suddenly, even if by 'accident', it means their mission was complete. We are not all guaranteed to live 80 years. Suicides often have less pleasant after-death experiences because we are overriding the higher purpose when our minds make the clinical calculation that living is more painful than dying. My best advice is to take suicide off the cards and instead focus heavily on that higher purpose. People who live to old age often comment that the time passes crazy fast anyway.

For your last question, the error is in thinking that the suffering is caused by situations. Some masters have lived the most mundane lives, and been in bliss the whole time. They feel joy in even the dullest of chores. It is hard to even imagine or describe it, and it is something antithetical to the ways of Western society and its consumerism, competitiveness, etc. Personally I love the pure and direct teachings of Ramana Maharshi, but there are other worthy teachers also. I hope this helps!


"No teaching, no teacher, no student." - Papaji

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Love is the magic ingredient that makes work not feel like work.

You only call it "work" when you don't love what you're doing.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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@AlphaAbundance

Some practical tips 

  • Try to enjoy your work. See what aspects you love 
  • Engage in fun activities 
  • Take breaks 
  • Choose a job that is less stressful and suited to your needs 
  • Have additional sources of income 
  • Cultivate strong relationships with people for emotional support 
  • Take vacations 
  • Work in teams and groups 
  • Don't ruminate much 
  • If you love what you do, you won't feel like it's work. 
  • Focus on health. 
  • Find ways to enjoy life 

 


.

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48 minutes ago, Aquarius said:

What you describe sounds like depression. A while ago I had the exact same questions in my mind and the exact same points you had. It really surprises me that others are thinking this way too. And now I realize that's what the Buddha said about "Life is suffering".. interesting. However I let go of this way of thinking. How? Why? Because I realized it's just a perspective.

   Yeah, it might be probably is. It feels negative, saddening, dreadful thinking of having to work, thinking of having to do more fucking work next week or I lose my scholarship, go work at pizza hut, and end it all. Yeah, he may be right. Though I don't know if it's a matter of perspective, I sure hope so. I don't know if all the positive thinking and reframing in the world could eliminate the literal suffering of exerting themselves whether mentally or physically. Can one reframe the straining of doing math problems mentally? Can one reframe the exertion of running? Can one reframe the pain of getting stabbed? Can one reframe the deliciousness of a chipotle burrito?

It may have some thought-based components but I think effort is a physical or mental like sensation, not really a thought, its an experience. The physical components are definitely an experience. I do hope I am wrong though because that means it's able to be reframed, etc. Unless you mean having higher stages of consciousness, realizing no free will, or some other radical type of stuff?

48 minutes ago, Aquarius said:

So the solution is to change your perspective. You basically talk about how hard it is to keep yourself alive. What you describe is a set of beliefs. 

  • Living is hard.
  • Living is unenjoyable.
  • Living is 60% chores and 40% fun. (or maybe you're thinking 90% and 10%, or 50% / 50%)
  • Living is about either satisfying needs or dying.
  • If you work for someone you are a slave.

I do see how these beliefs, thoughts lead to emotions of dread, negativity, etc. It really does seem to be the case though, actually be true. This might help, thank you. I will try examining and letting go / dropping these beliefs.

 

48 minutes ago, Aquarius said:

It helps asking the right questions to get to the bottom of why you are suffering.

  1. Why is living hard? What makes living hard? When is living not hard? How to make the hard parts of living easy in a creative way? Is there a shortcut to things? Do I only want to do easy things?
  2. Why am I not enjoying life? What are the parts of life I am not enjoying? Why? What would make me enjoy them? Can I make them enjoyable? Why am I not allowing myself to be happy? What's keeping me from being happy? What makes me happy in life?
  3. Can I find happiness in doing chores? Can thinking of the the end result of the work I do or chores I finish motivate me to do them? What is the point of the work I do? Am I not motivated because I don't find meaning in the end result of my work? What is meaning? What do I find meaningful? Is meaningful work always fun? Are the fruits of my effort sweet or bitter? Is my goal in life to always have fun and only do enjoyable things? Why?
  4. Is there anything else to life than satisfying needs? What are the steps I need to take to the point where I don't need to consciously take care of satisfying my needs? 
  5. Am I a slave or am I a work partner? Is the work I do benefiting someone or me in a meaningful way, or am I just working towards a cause that I disagree with or don't find meaning in?

You don't need to answer these questions to me, it's just something to meditate on. I hope in the end you find meaning in life and all the suffering it causes. I genuinely want to help. 

1.

  • Living could be considered hard due to the fact that everyone has to work to live. I have to work to live
  • Living seems to be not hard when their is enjoyment, neutral-range level or slight-mild suffering experience, including experiences of enjoyable effort.
  • I can try to finish, be as efficient as possible in completing sufferable effort
  • Their aren't usually shortcuts but I can try to work toward financial freedom instead of late retirement which would be the greatest shortcut.
  • Yes I only want to do easy things. I might consider "working" for long periods on a project or something I am interested in as "easy" rather than hard. But also I hate all hard things. I only want easiness, easy things in my life, anything I find hard is likely something that I am uninterested in. I find watching leo's videos "easy" even though it can be considered hard. I find playing chess "easy" even though it can be considered hard. I find grinding out hours on a computer science project "hard", pointless and stupid. I find working on physics homework to be stupid and dumb and sufferable effort.

2.

  • Because I feel confused and lost. I don't know what to do
  • I hate school. I hate college. I hate having to work. I hate having to grind. I hate doing anything I don't want to do. I have been doing it for years and I am starting to think death will be a better fate. Maybe I am just lazy, maybe I am entitled but that is how it is.
  • Nothing. I fucking hate school, college, work.
  • No I can't make them enjoyable without some severe mental hoops for a little big of enjoyment (like trying to force the meaning of learning about the universe for its own sake, wait that actually might have inspired a little motivation)
  • Confusion, Uncertainty, Lack of meaning / Nihilism, Lack of understanding of meaning, Indecision on whether I should move forward with enlightenment
  • Nothing except whatever I assign meaning to make it so

3.

  • Maybe, it doesn't come naturally, probably cannot, I can try alot of mental gymnastics and mental hoops but probably not, I could accept it and feel the state but in the end I still have to exert put effort in, its like I can feel the state, accept the state but after that I got to put effort in. I'm probably not making sense, it would take longer to articulate fully.
    • I am checking, trying to make sure I am not being pessimistic, a downer in these replies, trying to check that I am not being pessimistic just to deny and whine and bitch and moan
  • Yes but that's just wage slavery, in that case everyone should just do anything. In that case anything can be justified, anything can be done just because of the end result. People don't have to enjoy something just because of the end result. However this might be a good coping mechanism
  • The point of the work I do is to simply survive. Just to satisfy basic needs, physiological + safety needs, anything else is mute or something I would naturally feel inclined to do, naturally feel interested or some motivation in doing 
  • Possibly, just surviving isn't that meaningful, anyway meaning is an illusion, a creation of the mind, meaning itself is pointless, couldn't I just make a meaning out of staring at the wall for the rest of my life
  • Meaning is a construct, a belief that if the verification is satisfied, your mind allows you to feel some sort of positive emotion, its a mind-game, its bullshit
  • No, but what is meaningful work? Meaningful work is bullshit, just do whatever comes naturally. I think I need to understand meaning greater, journal, contemplate on meaning some more
  • No fruits of my effort except survival which isn't that great because all I have left is more survival
  • No, I don't have some goal of life, I'm just existing
    • The answer to almost all of these questions is I don't know, Im just speculating
  • There is no reason to enjoyment, it seems that these are just pure ends to themselves, pure intrinsic motivations 

4.

  • No, everything else is bullshit.
  • Become financially free, which is a whole level of grinding itself

 

5.

  • I'm however I want to see haha, there are multiple perspectives here
  • There is no meaning, meaning is bullshit, meaning is a smokescreen, meaning is an illusion ? What is meaning? More research and contemplation needed, there is no cause to fight for, its all bullshit, subjective and "pointless"

See these questions felt some sorts of effort but they also felt interesting so it wasn't suffering per say.

48 minutes ago, Aquarius said:

You don't need to answer these questions to me, it's just something to meditate on. I hope in the end you find meaning in life and all the suffering it causes. I genuinely want to help. 

It did help somewhat. I will come back to these questions and contemplate/journal/ponder them. I have some questions for you

  • What is meaning to you? What the fuck is the meaning? What is all this meaning you keep talking about?

Also thank you for your response and intentions. Thank you for helping another Aquarius out.

Edited by AlphaAbundance

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Yes life is a shitty deal. Not just for you, but for me and everyone. Just deal with it. 

No other reality exists. If you get those beautiful realities, just ping me and I'll come flying on my winged unicorn and take a hiatus from my actual reality and take refuge in your beautiful reality. I'll make sandwich and tea for you every day as a return favor. 

@Preety_India No I will create a life that is acceptable.

How do you know no other realities exist?

Lmaoo I will let you know when I access them

Quote

Some practical tips 

  • Try to enjoy your work. See what aspects you love 
  • Engage in fun activities 
  • Take breaks 
  • Choose a job that is less stressful and suited to your needs 
  • Have additional sources of income 
  • Cultivate strong relationships with people for emotional support 
  • Take vacations 
  • Work in teams and groups 
  • Don't ruminate much 
  • If you love what you do, you won't feel like it's work. 
  • Focus on health. 
  • Find ways to enjoy life 

Ok I will investigate these tips. I appreciate the response

  • I hate college, even if there are some parts I enjoy I think its a load of bullshit that will only lead to more bullshit and dull, uninteresting, dreadful work in the future, its like 2% gold and 200% shit
  • But video games are harmful, Fortnite was the main thing getting me through the bullshit of this school work but then I stopped that cause it was bullshit aswell - Do you have some suggestions for fun activities? What do you do for fun?
  • Ok got it
  • Lol you mean being rich
  • Ill try
  • Emotional support = codependence, lol fuck that, all I need is my journal and the occasional actualized.org post
  • I'm not rich, I'm in college
  • Ok got it
  • Ok this is important, I need to work on this I think
  • Yeah I love doing nothing, just laying at home, I don't want to go through the effort of restructuring some of interests to make money. As of right now my main and only interests are understanding, development, consciousness, maslow needs, and some others. How can I make money providing zero value to others
  • Ok got it, this sounds important
  • Ok what are some ways to enjoy life? I'm assuming you mean like pleasure? What do you mean? Isn't this sort of enjoyment dumb and useless? Why not just focus entirely on consciousness and development

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@AlphaAbundance Like, come on, man, your country has the most opportunities for whatever work you want to be doing and the best ratio of self-made people across the world. You seem to be too complacent and spoiled by your country and conditions that you were born in

Edited by Hello from Russia

Design your life, design your future

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@No Self

56 minutes ago, No Self said:

@AlphaAbundance

Yes, the higher perspective is enlightenment/liberation or whatever one wishes to call it, but it is important to distinguish the mental idea of enlightenment with the actual experience. In simple terms, you distinguish the Self that is looking out through your eyes right now from the noisy little human self that is always grappling with problems to do with past and future. Only the present consciousness is real. This would change your entire outlook as you can imagine. Having more insights from the higher intelligence might give you a newfound purpose of some kind, or you might still prefer to chill out. There's no right or wrong, except be true to yourself.

Ok, I see, thank you. Also, I do have a sort of purpose, idea of a purpose, and some goals but they aren't really profitable. Basically understanding, consciousness, development, Maslow needs, etc.

Quote

Owning a home and having basic living costs covered is incredibly liberating, though is easier said than done unless there is access to a substantial sum. Even then, there can be all sorts of restrictions around money for everyday living and it can get depressing. As for mental issues, there can be a certain lethargy caused by a lack of positive engagement with people and challenges. But if you are involved with other goals, that would likely not be an issue. But the finances are hard to get right if there's no external source of support. Sometimes I say that surviving on part-time work is a more achievable goal.

For financial freedom, I would likely pursue dropshipping, without these starter online businesses it seems like financial freedom would be near impossible. I kind of felt unmotivated thinking it is unconscious bullshit and selling crap to others that people don't need. It might still do it anyway and try to make it as conscious, non-harmful as possible. 

Quote

Many near-death experiences end because people are told by higher powers that their mission here is not complete. If someone dies suddenly, even if by 'accident', it means their mission was complete. We are not all guaranteed to live 80 years. Suicides often have less pleasant after-death experiences because we are overriding the higher purpose when our minds make the clinical calculation that living is more painful than dying. My best advice is to take suicide off the cards and instead focus heavily on that higher purpose. People who live to old age often comment that the time passes crazy fast anyway.

For your last question, the error is in thinking that the suffering is caused by situations. Some masters have lived the most mundane lives, and been in bliss the whole time. They feel joy in even the dullest of chores. It is hard to even imagine or describe it, and it is something antithetical to the ways of Western society and its consumerism, competitiveness, etc. Personally I love the pure and direct teachings of Ramana Maharshi, but there are other worthy teachers also. I hope this helps!

Ok, I see. I understand the thinking, beliefs surrounding a situation causing emotions. However, I think effort and doing college work, doing work in general is more akin to a direct physical feeling/sensation. I don't think much reframing or different perspectives could help it, possibly higher states of consciousness where even getting stabbed is pleasant could help.

  • What do you think?

However, I could be wrong. I do think future fear of effort has to be rooted in beliefs and thoughts about the situation. Maybe I can go deeper

  • Do you think the only way or the main way I stop feeling suffering when doing effort, having to work is through enlightenment, increasing my stage of consciousness?

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@AlphaAbundance being in the body is required for what leo teaches. Not being in the body leads to disssociation. Yes, the ego "doesn't exist," but it is best to build yourself up from the ground up, and not any other way. spirit needs a body to incarnate into, a body doesn't incarnate into a spirit. 

Edited by DreamScape

Infinite Love to you 🙏❤

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@Leo Gura That resonates deeply. Now I just need to find the next step to making that ideality ---> reality.

 

@Hello from Russia Yeah, I'll be the first to say I'm a lazy fuck. I'm smart asf though, that's why I've been able to last so long with zero work ethic. I'm already so used to being financially dependent and hitting necessary thresholds in school. Having to financially support myself and work harder in college and jobs? Yeahh that's a tough sell.

I don't want to be working at all although maybe I should look into what other jobs I can pursue. Like gun to my head what jobs would I pick and pursue. I blame spirituality  myself for allowing spirituality to zap away all my stage orange motivation. Before this it was like I ma be out here, making money and ya know

But don't think I'm just messing around. I've been slaving away on track to a good cushy tech job this fall semester as well as in the summer semester. Its just not worth it. I slave away now so that I can slave away later in a job till I die? Hell nah. Its financial freedom or a sufficiently passionate career or its a wrap.

What is the solution? Also, what is the solution to the suffering of effort? What is the solution to sufferable effort? (This is the hard problem of effort) How do I make everything effortless?

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@DreamScape Ok, I see. Some questions answered and more questions arise

  • What do you mean, by what Leo teaches? ( Raising consciousness? Leaving the reincarnation cycle? )
  • What happens when you aren't in the body? I'm still confused. There is no ego outside the body, Isn't it gone?
  • Please elaborate

@Proserpina  ?

 

Edited by AlphaAbundance

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@AlphaAbundance Actually, one good hint might be that you're just too motivated to do all other kinds of stuff that saps your brain chemicals.

Such as (indeed) videogames, too much sex\masturbation, alcohol (if it applies), too much sugar, too much food indulgence in general, consuming too much media (especially social media), recreational drugs (weeds included), too much partying/gossipping

All this shit numbs you and takes a toll on your motivation levels

Edited by Hello from Russia

Design your life, design your future

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