2020 Vice Presidential Debate

[Forestluv]

Early polling of undecided voters is that Kamala was abrasive and condescending - and Pence looked composed and vice presidential. ? 

Many Americans have an aversion to truth and are persuaded by con men. Pence was full on gaslighting. It’s hard to see how undeceived voters can fall for it.

[tuckerwphotography]

She was a little condescending at times, like a mom scolding her teenage smart aleck son. Throwing mad shade (as the kids say). I loved it! Definitely played well with her base...too bad it didn't resonate with undecideds.

[Leo Gura]

Kamala and Biden are not taking Trump's monstrous administration to task enough. They are just giving neo-liberal talking points rather than ripping apart the Trump corruption and deeply unpopular and anti-democratic policies.

These kind of debates make the Trump admin seem normal and reasonal because it's hard to rip them apart in this 90 second format where you have to answer some given question.

The disastrous nature of the Trump admin is invisible in these debates. The Trump admin just seems like any other Republican admin. All Pence has to do to win is just seem chill and professional and act like a classic Republican.

Biden's whole campaign is so luke-warm. Like having sex with a fresh corpse.

[Forestluv]

To those that value truth, honesty and sincerity - that was super frustrating to watch because some people will fall prey to it. I would have unloaded on Pence. 

And he was able to get Kamala to attack the left at times to appeal to the center-right. Usually these VP debates don’t move the needle. And Kamala didn’t cause any damage. She just let Pence gaslight. launder and evade. Kamala and the moderator allowed Pence to non-answer wether they will allow a peaceful transfer of power if Biden is declared the winner. And a dozen other instances. 

Pence spoke calmly about how normal and prosperous America is right now.

[Preety_India]

I think the strategy was to not make Kamala look too angry because in that case Pence would have come out looking much better than how he did. 

That's a good strategy just to keep the scales balanced. But she could have scored some brownie points. 

 

[Preety_India]

 

What does this mean? 

 

[RendHeaven]

@Forestluv Yes, when Pence framed fracking as good ("for the economy," though it's apparent that he's saying that to please his billion-dollar fossil fuel industry donors) or when he framed the Green New Deal as an evil authoritarian movement that is out to "destroy the American economy," Harris sort of just let it happen. Would of LOVED to see her hold her ground with iron conviction and blow apart these pathetic, twisted perspectives, but you're right that she is absolutely appealing to "centrists."

[tuckerwphotography]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Kamala and Biden are not taking Trump's monstrous administration to task enough.

This is fundamentally the exact opposite of the Biden/Harris campaign strategy. They're sort of doing what Clinton did but to even more of an extreme: sitting back and hoping Trump implodes on himself. Didn't work in 2016, but somehow it's going to the magic winning formula this year? Doesn't seem entirely sensible to me, but who knows how it'll play out.

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

These kind of debates make the Trump admin seem normal and reasonal because it's hard to rip them apart in this 90 second format where you have to answer some given question.

The disastrous nature of the Trump admin is invisible in these debates. The Trump admin just seems like any other Republican admin. All Pence has to do to win is just seem chill and professional and act like a classic Republican.

Agree, that was the strangest part. It was like watching the Twilight Zone. I suspect some people even secretly missed Trump because at least he makes shit entertaining. I swear a good chunk of people vote for him primarily for entertainment purposes. 

Edited October 8, 2020 by tuckerwphotography

[tuckerwphotography]

3 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

@Forestluv Yes, when Pence framed fracking as good ("for the economy," though it's apparent that he's saying that to please his billion-dollar fossil fuel industry donors) or when he framed the Green New Deal as an evil authoritarian movement that is out to "destroy the American economy," Harris sort of just let it happen. Would of LOVED to see her hold her ground with iron conviction and blow apart these pathetic, twisted perspectives, but you're right that she is absolutely appealing to "centrists."

@RendHeaven She has nothing to gain by attempting to convince voters about the Green New Deal. It's already been branded by both sides. Pence bashing the GND just rallies Democratic voters - she doesn't need to waste time defending it. Fracking is a nuclear issue that she can't really touch because she personally doesn't support it, but Biden strategically does because he knows winning PA and Ohio depend on not screwing those blue collar voters.

[Forestluv]

Rather than address left wing issues, I think she should have prosecuted Pence. It’s like shooting fish is a can. And she is literally a prosecuting attorney. That’s her thing. She sounded like she was coached to be soft, just smile and get talking points across. She was prosecuted Biden harder in the primary debates. 

Yet this want stay long in the news cycle. By tomorrow afternoon there will be a new topic. 

Some early polls showing Kamala won. So she may have connected to viewers by talking about their struggles.

[Preety_India]

@Forestluv what does throwing the ballot mean? 

 

[Forestluv]

7 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Forestluv what does throwing the ballot mean? 

 

Having ballots discarded for some reason like they are fraudelent

[Preety_India]

 

2 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

Having ballots discarded for some reason like they are fraudelent

I think this is voter suppression

 

[Free Mind]

37 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Kamala and Biden are not taking Trump's monstrous administration to task enough. They are just giving neo-liberal talking points rather than ripping apart the Trump corruption and deeply unpopular and anti-democratic policies.

These kind of debates make the Trump admin seem normal and reasonal because it's hard to rip them apart in this 90 second format where you have to answer some given question.

The disastrous nature of the Trump admin is invisible in these debates. The Trump admin just seems like any other Republican admin. All Pence has to do to win is just seem chill and professional and act like a classic Republican.

Biden's whole campaign is so luke-warm. Like having sex with a fresh corpse.

I agree! I think Kamala seemed very weak here and I actually think Pence did a far better job in preparing for the debate. Pence came across as more articulate and was able to provide examples and support for his claims whereas Kamala's performance consisted of very vague, general, and lazy points for her defense. Of course, we see through Pence's tactics and know he's absolutely full of shit but the general audience may not pick up on that. It doesn't matter though, I think the majority of Americans don't give a fuck about the debates and know that Trump has got to go, period. 

[hoodrow trillson]

23 minutes ago, tuckerwphotography said:

This is fundamentally the exact opposite of the Biden/Harris campaign strategy. They're sort of doing what Clinton did but to even more of an extreme: sitting back and hoping Trump implodes on himself. Didn't work in 2016, but somehow it's going to the magic winning formula this year? Doesn't seem entirely sensible to me, but who knows how it'll play out.

Agree, that was the strangest part. It was like watching the Twilight Zone. I suspect some people even secretly missed Trump because at least he makes shit entertaining. I swear a good chunk of people vote for him primarily for entertainment purposes. 

LOL what the fuck are you guys talking about?  Trump IS imploding on himself.  After that coronavirus diagnosis, he is coming off as a meek, incompetent president.

If anything, holding back is doing the Biden admin wonders to not portray themselves similarly as Trump and company portraying desperation and pointing fingers at each other.

IMHO, they took the good middle approach of pointing out the Trump admin’s failure in a succinct way that’s easy for the Normie viewer to understand.  They didn’t (thank god) go full Democrat “they go low, we got high” moral horse shit that got their asses ate up in 2016.  This was very tactical and a chess move.

Normie/mainstream psychology is very easy to crack and they’ve done it.  Did we watch the same debate?  Lmao.

 

 

 

[Free Mind]

2 minutes ago, hoodrow trillson said:

LOL what the fuck are you guys talking about?  Trump IS imploding on himself.  After that coronavirus diagnosis, he is coming off as a meek, incompetent president.

If anything, holding back is doing the Biden admin wonders to not portray themselves similarly as Trump and company portraying desperation and pointing fingers at each other.

IMHO, they took the good middle approach of pointing out the Trump admin’s failure in a succinct way that’s easy for the Normie viewer to understand.  They didn’t (thank god) go full Democrat “they go low, we got high” moral horse shit that got their asses ate up in 2016.  This was very tactical and a chess move.

Normie/mainstream psychology is very easy to crack and they’ve done it.  Did we watch the same debate?  Lmao.

 

 

 

Hm, your point on Kamala's soft and passive approach is pretty solid. I was disappointed that she didn't hone in on the obvious corruption in the Trump administration but it makes sense if this was deliberate planning by Kamala's team to avoid such moralistic identity seizing and other such errors.

[hoodrow trillson]

2 minutes ago, Free Mind said:

Hm, your point on Kamala's soft and passive approach is pretty solid. I was disappointed that she didn't hone in on the obvious corruption in the Trump administration but it makes sense if this was deliberate planning by Kamala's team to avoid such moralistic identity seizing and other such errors.

Me too but I saw what she was doing.  I’m sorry if my post came off as brash and rude but seriously:

I noticed from the Biden/Trump debate that Biden did not meet Trump at the same “tempo” of debate (finger pointing, nonstop talking and interruption, yelling, etc) and it portrayed Trump as the unhinged large man baby on stage and it just looked extremely bad for Trump.  

Then Trump caught coronavirus.

The only thing I wish Harris touched on was the current White House coronavirus catastrophe literally being the laughing stock of the entire world and the USA’s “adversaries” whomever people think they are.

It was also jarring to see an actual debate after last week’s shit show.  Wild times my friends.

[Forestluv]

Apparently a lot of women were turned off by Pence’s mansplaining. I didn’t see him like that. I saw him as gaslighting and evasive.

 

[tuckerwphotography]

33 minutes ago, hoodrow trillson said:

LOL what the fuck are you guys talking about?  Trump IS imploding on himself.  After that coronavirus diagnosis, he is coming off as a meek, incompetent president.

If anything, holding back is doing the Biden admin wonders to not portray themselves similarly as Trump and company portraying desperation and pointing fingers at each other.

IMHO, they took the good middle approach of pointing out the Trump admin’s failure in a succinct way that’s easy for the Normie viewer to understand.  They didn’t (thank god) go full Democrat “they go low, we got high” moral horse shit that got their asses ate up in 2016.  This was very tactical and a chess move.

Normie/mainstream psychology is very easy to crack and they’ve done it.  Did we watch the same debate?  Lmao.

@hoodrow trillson I was speaking more broadly to their overall campaign strategy, not specially Harris' debate performance. As I said in an earlier post, I thought she did exactly what she needed to do (and I think Pence did as well).

Maybe consider that your perspective is coming from only one vantage point and that the entire country doesn't see things the exact same way you do. You say authoritatively that Trump is imploding on himself and is "coming off as a meek, incompetent president." That is your perspective, but literally millions of other Americans have the exact opposite perspective as you, and they have the same voting power as you do: one vote. This isn't about some objective truth, it's about how the 200+ million voters in America subjectively feel about the candidates. After 2016 when the media and polls and most Americans were somehow left shocked, we should perhaps humble ourselves before proclaiming such definite declarations, IMO. These are uncluttered waters the country is swimming in, and nobody knows how it will play out. There's still an entire month before the election - anything could happen.

Edited October 8, 2020 by tuckerwphotography

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Forestluv said:

Apparently a lot of women were turned off by Pence’s mansplaining. I didn’t see him like that. I saw him as gaslighting and evasive.

 

Amongst CNN female viewers, sure Kamala won.

The folks who like Pence left the CNN chat back in 2016.