Drama Alert! Another YTber is calling us a cult! 😈☦️

[Carl-Richard]

16 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

No one here can honestly say they have been manipulated for nefarious purposes, ie manipulated to be literally exploited in bad faith, ie financially, sexually or otherwise.

Does a feeling of superiority, ego, vanity, perhaps influence, more generally power, count? You know what rich people want more than money? Feeling like they're right, like their vision is being fulfilled. And if you can get there by making people feel inferior, by playing with their emotions, by denigrating their autonomy, that leaves a certain impression, imprint, on people dealing with it. I would bet the types of interactions you endure on here could be impacting how you deal with people in real life in perhaps not the best way.

 

16 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

Calling this place a cult is an insult to people who have been in real cults.

I've been in what I thought was a real cult and I felt less personally threatened, exploited and gaslit than I've been here. Do you see why I'm so curious about what a cult really is? Do you see why I disagree with Leo's cherrypicked definition from some random MD who (like me) had an experience of what he thought was a cult and decided to tell about it? Maybe step out of the cult a little bit and see that there are other perspectives on this issue than Leo's.

Edited 3 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[zurew]

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

You wanna accuse me of being a small brain cult follower? Go fuck yourself you complete moron. Fuck you. You can put me into a box in your own mind but I don’t frankly care. I’m gonna keep learning, studying, growing and maturing and I don’t give a fuck about morons who don’t get the fucking picture of what we are doing here. 

Completely normal and reasonable crashout especially given the fact that I qualified multiple times "under my light" and that you can have your own definition and in the other thread  I  said that I take cult to be a cluster concept and hence I take it that there are multiple different configuration of facts that can make something a cult and hence multiple different definitions are possible and reasonable.

[Wilhelm44]

2 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Does a feeling of superiority, ego, vanity, perhaps influence, more generally power, count? You know what rich people want more than money? Feeling like they're right, like their vision is being fulfilled. And if you can get there by making people feel inferior, by playing with their emotions, by denigrating their autonomy, that leaves a certain impression, imprint, on people dealing with it. I would bet the types of interactions you endure on here could be impacting how you deal with people in real life in perhaps not the best way.

 

I've been in what I thought was a real cult and I felt less personally threatened, exploited and gaslit than I've been here. Do you see why I'm so curious about what a cult really is? Do you see why I disagree with Leo's cherrypicked definition from some random MD dude who (like me) had an experience of what he thought was a cult and decided to tell about it? Maybe step out of the cult a little bit and see that there are other perspectives on this issue than Leo's.

You say you don't care to call this place a cult, but it sounds like you are.

I have never felt personally threatened here.

What made you feel personally threatened here ?

[Harikrishnan]

16 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

.

 

I've been in what I thought was a real cult and I felt less personally threatened, exploited and gaslit than I've been here. Do you see why I'm so curious about what a cult really is? Do you see why I disagree with Leo's cherrypicked definition from some random MD who (like me) had an experience of what he thought was a cult and decided to tell about it? Maybe step out of the cult a little bit and see that there are other perspectives on this issue than Leo's.

You being a moderator in this forum and you feel exploited and gaslight than when you where in a real cult.
Thats interesting. 
 

[Thought Art]

22 minutes ago, zurew said:

Completely normal and reasonable crashout especially given the fact that I qualified multiple times "under my light" and that you can have your own definition and in the other thread  I  said that I take cult to be a cluster concept and hence I take it that there are multiple different configuration of facts that can make something a cult and hence multiple different definitions are possible and reasonable.

It’s a general statement. If my learning from a variety of teachers is a cult to you, I think you are wrong, and I take offense to it after awhile. Sometimes people need to be told fuck you. 
 

But, time for me to step back from this thread and return to it later with more breadth. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Thought Art

[Natasha Tori Maru]

1 hour ago, UnbornTao said:

 I mean, you can see, by way of contrast, when people interact with him, who tends to be the defensive party and who tends to be the more "impartial observer." Do you need Leo to tell you what to pay attention to here?

Talk about truth-seeking.

Just watch who asks the leading questions... Telling

And the strawmaning of @zurew's position.

[zurew]

1 minute ago, Thought Art said:

It’s a general statement. 

In that case my bad

[Thought Art]

@zurew Yes, I wanna cut through other peoples opinions ultimately. It’s important to do so, and you bring up lots of strong points to consider.

Adding me to a list? Fuck off. 

Actualized should be deconstructed and questioned because if not it is a trap. 🪤 Even if not like intentional or malicious, cult like following of actualized should be questions and brought up. 
 

Claims like being the most awakened thing is the universe should be red flags to everyone. As well as Leo being an Alien, or whatever. Leo’s tendency to stand and tell people if there trips are accurate or not. All these things are murky and should be questioned. 
 

But, at the same time, anger is there for a reason. Sometimes it has to cut through. But, should be reflected on if it’s a deception mechanism. 
 

As a general rule, and to forum guidelines I don’t lash out like that. But, sometimes I express it. I’ve been here for a long time. I know I can be held accountable to swearing. But, also I choose this time to allow that expression. 
 

Whatever is true, is true. That’s a good thing I think. 🤔 

Edited 3 hours ago by Thought Art

[Carl-Richard]

27 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

You say you don't care to call this place a cult, but it sounds like you are.

You're literally viewing everything through Leo's definition of a cult, of course you think that. I'm saying you can be a cult without being exploitative. Then you want to ask for examples of exploitation, and then I give you that. But that doesn't change whether or not I'm calling it a cult. I was already calling it a cult 

 

27 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

I have never felt personally threatened here.

Say that to the 8 or more people who were banned in a short time frame for merely disagreeing on him being the most awake person in existence or his methods for getting there. Say that to @Consilience when Leo threatened him to kick him out if he didn't "wise up soon". Say that to people who were fond of non-duality like Nahm and were either kicked out on those grounds or threatened to be kicked out. Say that to these countless posts of abuse.

 

27 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

What made you feel personally threatened here ?

In this thread, I gave a definition of a cult and Leo said "you speak of things you don't even understand" and "it is shameful that I even need to explain this to anyone here". In the other cult thread, I asked him about his definition of a cult and what he thought mind control is, and he said I don't understand what I'm talking about and that I'm disrespectful for even considering entertaining the topic and that I don't deserve his teachings.

Any normal interaction would be like you're doing here, asking for clarification, going argument by argument, not denigrating, shaming, belittling, etc.

Edited 3 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[Thought Art]

@Carl-Richard “Say that to the 8 or more people who were banned in a short time frame for merely disagreeing on him being the most awake person in existence or his methods for getting there“

Is this for sure truly why they were banned? Was it truly that they denied him being the most awakened being? I’ve seen many people on here question that openly, and say many other things about him openly.
 

“In this thread, I gave a definition of a cult and Leo said "you speak of things you don't even understand" and "it is shameful that I even need to explain this to anyone here". In the other cult thread, I asked him about his definition of a cult and what he thought mind control is, and he said I don't understand what I'm talking about and that I'm disrespectful for even considering entertaining the topic and that I don't deserve his teachings.”

Could it be he really thinks that’s that case? That he does find it disrespectful given his definition of a cult and efforts to avoid this? 

Edited 3 hours ago by Thought Art

[Carl-Richard]

1 minute ago, Thought Art said:

@Carl-Richard “Say that to the 8 or more people who were banned in a short time frame for merely disagreeing on him being the most awake person in existence or his methods for getting there“

Is this for sure truly why they were banned? Was it truly that they denied him being the most awakened being? I’ve seen many people on here question that openly, and say many other things about him openly. Including this conversation. 

I went through every single ban reason and the context they occurred in, if you were curious.

[Wilhelm44]

@Carl-Richard   If your experience here has been worse than being in an actual cult, what has caused you to stay ?

[Thought Art]

@Carl-Richard I read your list of quotes and I don’t have an issue with them. I’ve seen and observed many of the minds in this forum and in society. They don’t hold up to Leo’s articulation of things. He is one of the smartest most profound people on earth. You can accuse me of being in a cult for that opinion… but it’s honest to me. His posts don’t seem abusive to me. I haven’t seen anyone who understands God, I don’t think anyone here is awake and based on what many spiritual teachers say they don’t seem to be awake either. But, I have to even question myself on this. Simply based on my experiences and the things those teachers teach they address many things but perhaps not awakening. Is that a problem?

 

Like I said, I learn and listen to many teachers. I’m willing to find someone who offers more than Leo on these subjects. I’m willing to prove Leo wrong. I’m willing to admit when I’m not sure. 
 

I just don’t see Leo’s post as abuse. If you are awake you don’t need Leo or someone else to confirm it. 
 

I’ve seen a lot of people get banned here over the years from arguing with Leo on these topics and showing closed mindedness. Is that abuse? 
 

Can you point me directly to those bans and their reasons?

Edited 3 hours ago by Thought Art

[Carl-Richard]

9 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Could it be he really thinks that’s that case? That he does find it disrespectful given his definition of a cult and efforts to avoid this? 

Now you're treating him like a retarded child and not the Tier 2 multi-perspectival construct-aware God that he is. He knows how to treat people with differing opinions, when he wants to.

[Osaid]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

"It was in the past, it's not a big deal, don't worry 🤗". Bro.

Lol. He was "absolutely" conscious of that in the past, but not anymore! Things change and get "deeper" or something, right?

[Osaid]

Dude, what are we expecting from a guy who was gonna become an alien on camera...

 

[Thought Art]

2 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Now you're treating him like a retarded child and not the Tier 2 multi-perspectival construct-aware God that he is. He knows how to treat people with differing opinions, when he wants to.

Maybe, 🤔… Yeah, he could rehash this all again for you. Or, he could choose not too…
 

I feel like he has made his views clear…?

 

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Wilhelm44 said:

@Carl-Richard   If your experience here has been worse than being in an actual cult, what has caused you to stay ?

I'm saying the experiences of personal abuse, belittling, etc. has been worse. There were other aspects of the cult that were more destabilizing (the very wacky beliefs and eventual doomsday ideations). I stay here for various reasons.

Edited 1 hour ago by Carl-Richard

[Thought Art]

@Carl-Richard Doomsday ideations? I’ve not come accross this here. Where is that from?

Edited 2 hours ago by Thought Art

[Carl-Richard]

Just now, Thought Art said:

@Carl-Richard Doomsday ideations? I’ve not come accross this here. Where is that from?

I knew somebody would hiccup on that sentence. I was talking about the Discord community I was a part of.