The AI crash is impossible - Change my View

[bazera]

@VioletFlame The medal has two sides, right? Yes, I also think that people will get even lazier in their thinking if all they do is query LLM's for answers. But also, consider how easier it is to do the research into some field with LLM.

For example, if you want to learn gardening, or coding, cooking, anything, you have a personal assistant that can guide you.

I think you're a bit too focused on the negative and overlooking the positive. 

Again, TV's and smartphones can be used in positive and negative ways. You could use a smartphone to learn all kinds of things about the world, watch documentaries to expand your worldview, connect interneting people worldwide and have interesting discussions (like we do now ), etc.

Or you could scroll TikTok the whole day, order Wendys burgers and cheetos and binge watch some TV show on it. You get the point.

Having tools like AI burdens you with more epistemic responsibility to take. If you take it or not, it's all on you.

What I fear is that most people won't. Even I'm in the process of learning how to use AI wisely, haven't fully figured out yet. 

Also, I think you greatly overestimate current LLM capabilities. It isn't replacing anyone for a long time, if ever. The whole point of this discussion is to get clear about what this technology really is, correct our expectation, and learn to use it in responsible ways because it isn't going anywhere. It's not a technology like Blockchain or NFT's that where hyped up for a year and nobody talks about them since then. 

Look into Cal Newport's work (on YouTube), he has a pretty realistic discussions around this topic.

Edited 9 hours ago by bazera

[integral]

It takes months to build a quality product with AI coding.

I did not say it can autonomously write an entire app.

Its slop if you know nothing of building apps.

Edited 9 hours ago by integral

[LordFall]

1 hour ago, VioletFlame said:

This is exactly my point. Read my comment above. If we become too reliant on AI "solving the problems" for us, we will no longer feel it is necessary to use our own brains, our own critical thinking or decision-making skills. We will continue to use AI to "take the easy way out" or shortcut in life. Not everything can be learned in a matter of 3 seconds. Stop trying to cut corners. It takes hours of deep thinking, of reflecting on a topic, questioning it for yourselves, etc to truly understand something. And guess what, there's nothing wrong with that. Why do you want AI to do the thinking for you? Is it ignorance? Is it laziness? Are you actually trying to dumb yourself down? Because that's what AI wants from us. To become dumbed down slaves & zombies. It is trying to convince us all that it is more intelligent and superior to human beings, but that couldn't be farther from the truth. 

For someone who prides themselves on human intelligence I would argue that this is a pretty low intelligence comment.

Technology enhance our cognitive power, such as been its result since the dawn of time. You're writing because someone made tech that allowed us to transmit knowledge in written form as opposed to orally. People thought that would make us dumber. Not just random people. Socrates himself in fact. People thought the internet would ruin the world. Here you are making your arguments on it. 

An AI model can help you isolate the main ways in which the war in Iran will affect your local economy and how that will affect food prices and energy prices and how that will affect unemployment in your area. You can take this information and go talk to your city council and make an initiate out of it. Or you could turn off your internet access and try to become a world class economist in your bedroom by yourself. Good luck.

Ironically 90% of the comments that accuse AI of ridding humanity of critical thinking lack much if any critical thinking. Who whoulda thunk. 

[VioletFlame]

@LordFall You are delusional.

Go pursue your fake AI girlfriend, loner. Glad you found a creepy way of compensating for not knowing how to have an ACTUAL conversation with a REAL woman. 

Edited 7 hours ago by VioletFlame

[LordFall]

@VioletFlame See, you've proven that you not only lack critical thinking skills but are also antagonistic as well as lacking reading comprehension skills.

I have plenty of conversations with real women, I literally run a podcast around it. Because I find it necessary to call you out on your lazy point on AI doesn't mean you should get so mad. Attack the point not the person. 

[VioletFlame]

@LordFall You have demonstrated nothing but short-sightedness on this entire thread.

And although no one has to agree with everything I've said on this thread, it IS true that everything I've commented on this thread demonstrates insightfulness & critical thinking skills so you obviously don't know what critical thinking means. You disagreed with my comment, and then insulted my intelligence & accused me of lacking critical thinking skills just because you didn't agree with me, that seems pretty antagonistic if you ask me.

If you honestly believe an AI girlfriend is a good idea, then you have a highly skewed and delusional mentality, and it seems like many people on this thread would agree with me there. Godspeed!

Edited 7 hours ago by VioletFlame

[Leo Gura]

@VioletFlame Take it easy. Don't personally attack him.

[LordFall]

No, I'm objectively right you're literally not using critical thinking and using your feelings not using any piece of data or actual structured argument to make a point.

Sorry this is gonna sound rude but a lot of the reason why a lot of people are offended by AI models is because humans don't use logic when making their points their just vent their feelings and hope people agree with them and get mad when they don't like you're saying.

But if you want we can go piece by piece and break down your argument and I'll prove I'm right. That's the whole point actualizing to deconstruct yourself and your ideas right? 

You use ad hominems and moving the goal posts. AI girlfriends was never the main point of my post, you're responding on a thread on an economic analysis of AI industry being in the state of a bubble and likely causing a crash. 

Even if I wanted to move my position back to defending AI companions I think I would probably do that successfully, feel free to make a specific claim around that industry and we can talk about it. 

 

[VioletFlame]

@Leo Gura Do you think it was right for him to personally attack me and my opinions before I said anything to him? I only "attacked" him in response to feeling personally attacked myself. Read his comments before mine. He merely disagreed with my comment and then deliberately targeted me and insulted me. 

[LordFall]

@VioletFlame

"You don't understand what AI does or what being human is being about. You're taking about substance not structure. All these things are all possible in an AI powered society and probably even more so. Remember that people thought electricity was gonna ruin mankind due to being a demonic force and the amish still don't use it today. 

AI is about automating labor. The rest is up to you my friend. "

I didn't mean to insult you with this. My point was actually basically a socialist point that human existence has been dominated by forced labor throughout history and if this AI technology does free us from that then that will not rob us of our human heart and soul but instead allow it to flourish. 

 

[VioletFlame]

2 hours ago, LordFall said:

I would argue that this is a pretty low intelligence comment.

You can take this information and go talk to your city council and make an initiate out of it. Or you could turn off your internet access and try to become a world class economist in your bedroom by yourself. Good luck.

Ironically 90% of the comments that accuse AI of ridding humanity of critical thinking lack much if any critical thinking. Who whoulda thunk. 

THIS insulted me. Therefore, that is why I reacted the way I did. You flat out insulted my intelligence and claimed that I lack critical thinking skills before I said anything rude to you and you think that's okay? I am sorry for getting rude, and I'm honestly not usually like this, but I am fed up with people blatantly disrespecting me and then trying to rationalize it. 

Edited 6 hours ago by VioletFlame

[LordFall]

Alright I accept your apology and I apologize as well. Do you like AI in general? I think if you find some cool uses for it personally it makes it less scary and more easy to adapt it as I seriously think it's gonna save us. Look at what the humans are doing to us they're taking us straight to WW3. AI helps gives power back to the people. 

[Leo Gura]

23 minutes ago, VioletFlame said:

@Leo Gura Do you think it was right for him to personally attack me and my opinions before I said anything to him? I only "attacked" him in response to feeling personally attacked myself. Read his comments before mine. He merely disagreed with my comment and then deliberately targeted me and insulted me. 

Please quote his insult. It is a long thread and challenging for me to find.

[LordFall]

It was my bad I should not escalate conflict on the forum but I mean if we are to really take this to a true epistemic battle I give you all permissions to put any of my arguments to the test and paste them into any LLMs and ask it if what I'm saying lacks critical thinking or logic and usually when I put effort into them they should stand the best but I say some dumb shit all the time too so who knows but it's all love from my side. 

[VioletFlame]

10 hours ago, LordFall said:

You don't understand what AI does or what being human is being about.

@Leo Gura ^^ That was his response to my post on the thread shown below (I simply expressed my opinion as I thought we're free to do on this forum) I said this:

Just stopping by to declare that AI is destroying humanity and will harm society in a myriad of ways. It poses serious threats to the spirit of mankind. The whole literal purpose of AI is to overthrow humans and REPLACE us. Why on earth does that sound like a good idea to anyone? The ultimate form of dehumanization is AI. And in my opinion, it is self-destructive to want to see AI dominate society. We are already massively devoid of true, authentic human connection. AI will only divide us further and grant us a greater excuse to:

1. Take the easy route & choose laziness and hyper-convenience over human agency, diligence, & real effort

2. Isolate & socially withdraw ourselves

3. (Most importantly) To no longer think for ourselves, & to expect machines and AI to promptly give us all the answers, AND worst of all, assume it's truth, when in all actuality, even AI is erroneous, BIASED, inaccurate, and makes mistakes! On top of that, we are already seeing an over-reliance and extreme dependency to technology in general. Just imagine if the world blacked out and we couldn't use our phones or social media anymore, what would we do? We would all go INSANE. Think for a second just how pathetic that is. 

AI encourages us to NOT think for ourselves and discourages us to develop real skills; it discourages cognitive autonomy & critical thinking. If AI plans to do everything for us, then I predict we will develop learned helplessness, and we will lack the desire or WILL to do anything ourselves or to learn anything at all on our own. We will become conditioned to believe that AI is superior and that personal effort is futile or unnecessary. If something else is doing everything for us, why should we do it? The mentality of our future is "Oh well, AI will take care of it so, why bother?" It is human nature to choose convenience over challenge & difficulty, but that doesn't make it wise or right or beneficial for mankind. It only disrupts the process of growth, consciousness, and true human development.

I commented to a different user: If we become too reliant on AI "solving the problems" for us, we will no longer feel it is necessary to use our own brains, our own critical thinking or decision-making skills. We will continue to use AI to "take the easy way out" or shortcut in life. Not everything can be learned in a matter of 3 seconds. Stop trying to cut corners. It takes hours of deep thinking, of reflecting on a topic, questioning it for yourselves, etc to truly understand something. And guess what, there's nothing wrong with that. Why do you want AI to do the thinking for you? Is it ignorance? Is it laziness? Are we actually trying to dumb ourselves down? Because that's what AI wants from us. To become dumbed down slaves & zombies. It is trying to convince us all that it is more intelligent and superior to human beings, but that couldn't be farther from the truth. 

To then he responded: "I would argue that this is a pretty low intelligence comment." And proceeded to claim that I lack critical thinking skills!

But look, it's cool, we both apologized to eachother. I'm honestly never this rude and even surprised myself for reacting that way, but I genuinely felt personally insulted myself, as he was blatantly insulting my intelligence, when all I was doing was expressing my opinion. 

Edited 5 hours ago by VioletFlame

[Yimpa]

29 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I say some dumb shit all the time too so who knows but it's all love from my side.

Don’t stop believing in AI  

 

[Joshe]

9 hours ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Time will tell - totally unknown at this point.

Yes, it’s called a prediction.

Most people who have an opinion predict AI use will lead to cognitive atrophy. And maybe I am mistaken but it seems I’ve seen you lean heavily in that direction as well.

I predict it won’t. Most people who predict it will are making several errors, the first of which is having failed to think seriously about the issue for an extended amount of time, and they just parrot that which is most intuitive.

I can build a very strong case the common prediction is wrong, at which point confidence in it takes a nosedive. At least if you allow reason to update your models.

[LordFall]

@Joshe Totally agree with you man and if we split it into extremes and go full towards UBI then yes humans will not really be required to solve hard problems anymore. Individuals can lead their life how they see fit but really I don't think many people like to live in a what that requires high stakes cognitive problem solving regularly. And what exactly is supposed to be bad about having an advanced supercomputer assisting you in these cases anyway? 

Half of the side of my family doesn't talk to eachother because of an estate dispute. Should I really be glad that it was handled by the good ol human way or really if all the details had been entered into an algorithm and fair distribution would've been calculated then anyone opposing that would've had to build a credible case towards the contrary and there would've been an easier way to litigate it fairly instead of people flipping out, manipulating each other and ultimately breaking apart a family. 

That's just an anecdotal example but I completely will fight against the good ol natural way of humans being better in a lot of issues. There is a reason we invent tech because it solves real problems better than random humans can. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Joshe nah never heard of it. 

It's humans. No control. Especially during development. 

[LordFall]

https://www.tiktok.com/@awakenpodclips/video/7598246131771919671?_r=1&_t=ZS-94RxYzKCFlg

Idk who this guy is Darryl Anka but apparently he's a big fan of channeling and channels wisdom from a spiritual entity that calls itself Bashar? And here's what he had to say about AI. Makes a lot of sense to me. It's the new frontier of intelligence that will morph with humanity.