Beyond Psychedelics: The Grace and Limits of Consciousness Expansion

[Davino]

One of the worst feelings a psychonaut, in the process of Awakening can have, is the following:

The substance(s) and doses are mostly irrelevant, hitting a new peak Awakening is at God's mercy and grace.

I'm reaching a plateau lately that how much 5meo I consume or be it a novel substance, it's unlikely I'll get the Consciousness I truly desire. I just want more and more.

It feels like maxing out with meditation and yoga, they can't bring more consciousness up to a certain point, what if I wante more?

Same exact thing with psychedelics.

Drop me in a bed and inject me drugs all you want, it's not the substance anymore, I've explored the landscape, I can have weird and exotic experiences, I can trip balls, I can get traumatized, I can overdose, whatever, but that's not the pure consciousness increase

Once a certain threshold, more consciousness is grace, it's a gift, it's almost acausal.

Your already Infinite Mind and boundless Conscioussness, digging itself out through all its holes to find an ace, to break the limit, to become more conscious, to hack itself out, as you are aware that you are both imagining the limit and the limit, how can I break myself out, self-liberation, this is the paradox.

The Truth is that it just keeps getting harder and harder to do so. Before a few meditations, some yoga, some trips. But after some point... You know all the tricks, you hit yourself with yourself and you play solitary to increase your level, in an infinite loophole just for its own sake. There's no more shortcuts, just an existential unexplainable unquenchable thirst for more Consciousness, more God, more Infinity...

[Davino]

I might have maxed peak consciousness for a while, probably hitting a plateau. 

I'll work on baseline consciousness.

I've also come to the conclusion that I'll need retreats moving forward to increase the peak.

[PenguinPablo]

@Davino I'm very impressed by your ability to handle these states, along with engineering education endeavors. 

[Davino]

@PenguinPablo Great news I wanted to publish, I've finally finished my two engineering degrees. Got a super nice job also, the best given my ambitions.

But it has been a rough journey. Before selecting a degree/university I was so close to drop all possessions, find a monastery (whatever religion) that handles my survival and just do spiritual practices forever. Every fucking year of my degree I hit rock bottom, I didn't like it. I was Awakening so high and the contrast with mundane life and one that I didn't like, was quite harsh. The only decent year was my international exchange, that was decent in the human domain, but I awoke to solipsism which made it hard in the metaphysical sense. However, I love the person I've become and moreover, I love the positioning and leverage that I have now. Many times we hear, you gotta enjoy the process. But maybe there's no way to enjoy the process, it's a fucking grind, BUT, you may love the result. And that's what has happened with me, it has been quite a revelation. I plan to do a post reflecting back on my university experience.

[ExploringReality]

I understand what you mean. 

There is something that happens to my mind when on LSD and Psilocybin that I look for and always receive. It's this very stoned, very alert, hyper alert but cleanly clear and smooth consciousness. It's like being in flow States ×10. Imagine squeezing a full months retreat state of mind into an order of a full day. I love deep trance hallucinations that completely break my senses of reality and I have also experienced states of cosmic Consciousness where I am absolutely petrified, terrified, crying and salivating on the floor praying for mercy, but the main thing that I love is having a smooth, alert, wakeful, non reactive, hypersensitive and hyperspacual perception. Think of a mind of a fucking Buddha!! That's the good shit. 

But also this mundane ordinary consciousness right now is also IT!!!!! Once you see it, you can never go back

[emil1234]

from my point of view, liberation is annihilation of even the desire for more consciousness. desire truly is the root of suffering, buddhism is right on this point. be it desire for food, sex, money or even increased consciousness, it doesnt matter. i say kill the desire

[Dabidoe]

My take on psychedellics might be contrary to the majority of the crowd.

If it's not within you then it's not real. Taking the experiences from psychedellics and making them part of the whole you seems to be the goal. I'm not sure how many drugs you have to take to do that, that probably varies on the person. There certainly are benefits but if you never incorporate into your sober life and rely on the drugs to "see" then it's temporary.

It's possible we can all find our way to non-duality in our own way, but ideally it becomes a new way of life rather than a fleeting moment.

[Rigel]

Beautiful writing.

[Asia P]

I understand you

[OBEler]

@Davino I am looking forward to your university experience.

You are on a plateau on psychedelics? This is interesting to hear that this is possible. Would you say you saw so many things it becomes somehow always the same? You got used to these experiences? Even the crazy breakthroughs on DMT or on whatever substance you take? 

Edited September 14 by OBEler

[Jodistrict]

I took psychedelics intensely for five years including 5-meo.   It gives a temporary state which wears off and then you just have a memory, but no long-term change.   But then you desire to have the same mystical experience again, so now you are chasing experience.   This is just more attachment, the opposite of liberation.  You can’t get liberation from drugs.  It requires a sober mind which can investigate the nature of self and an ongoing surrender and letting go moment to moment 24/7.  Drugs sabotage the spiritual path with self deception.

[Jowblob]

Drugs in itself is a realm that you access and is not god realization as Leo claims, yes it leads to awakenings if god wills so. But it's not a tool for god realization, remember that your higher self has access to all the events simultaneously. What makes you think that the script that you wrote for your human self, can be broken by some "psychedelics" from the human realm. Stop kidding yourself, only pray and thank god for the gifts or desires he might let you fullfill while you're in the human body.

[Davino]

 

On 7/9/2025 at 8:40 AM, emil1234 said:

Desire truly is the root of suffering, buddhism is right on this point. be it desire for food, sex, money or even increased consciousness, it doesnt matter. i say kill the desire

I'm aware 

I have no trouble suffering for what I love.

Being liberated from suffering is quite boring if you've accessed that state of consciousness. It's just plain equanimity, like the most plain boring vanilla ice cream, not good, not bad, not anything, but not nothing either. I just don't like the classic Buddhist freedom from suffering.

But hey you don't suffer, it's great but you also miss the pleasure, the joy, the sadness, the angry, the melancholic, the despair, the spark, the hope, ... You trade all of that for Equanimity. If you wanna take that deal go ahead and work for it.

In my case, I have no trouble suffering for what I love. And I do love Consciousness.

[Davino]

On 14/9/2025 at 4:56 AM, OBEler said:

I am looking forward to your university experience.

Hopefully soon I'll get down to write it, I'm going through many life transforming processes right now.

On 14/9/2025 at 4:56 AM, OBEler said:

You are on a plateau on psychedelics? This is interesting to hear that this is possible. Would you say you saw so many things it becomes somehow always the same? You got used to these experiences? Even the crazy breakthroughs on DMT or on whatever substance you take? 

It certainly is possible, if you read the book on Mastery from Leo's Booklist, you'll see that it's a common happening in any long term pursuit.

If you are working towards higher peak consciousness, in that process you'll experience plateaus. In this regard, psychedelics are a bit deceiving, because of how potent and efficient they are, you get too complacent with constant breakthroughs. They are too good in a way. So if you go on trying new psychedelics, higher doses and mixing them all up, just by chances you are likely to keep having breakthroughs, Awakenings and Peak Consciousness; however, this process is bound to plateau at some point. It's like hitting with the glass ceiling of consciousness, well to put it into context, my plateau is already Infinite Consciousness, but I see how much more I'm missing, more Infinite Infinity!

That regarding psychedelics for pure Consciousness. But on the psychonaut domain, I haven't plateaued yet, there are so many conscious experiences and states of consciousness and weird reality corners to explore. That is interesting and I do it to some extent, but I trip for Consciousness, Truth, Love, God and Infinity, those are my values.

The Good thing is that plateaus are temporary and with consistent work, the breakthrough will come.

Edited September 20 by Davino

[emil1234]

2 hours ago, Davino said:

 

I'm aware 

I have no trouble suffering for what I love.

Being liberated from suffering is quite boring if you've accessed that state of consciousness. It's just plain equanimity, like the most plain boring vanilla ice cream, not good, not bad, not anything, but not nothing either. I just don't like the classic Buddhist freedom from suffering.

But hey you don't suffer, it's great but you also miss the pleasure, the joy, the sadness, the angry, the melancholic, the despair, the spark, the hope, ... You trade all of that for Equanimity. If you wanna take that deal go ahead and work for it.

In my case, I have no trouble suffering for what I love. And I do love Consciousness.

but you can have both. it actually is possible to pursue things without desire, however paradoxical it might sound

[Davino]

10 hours ago, emil1234 said:

but you can have both. it actually is possible to pursue things without desire, however paradoxical it might sound

Is it, really?

Can you give me an example to under you better

[emil1234]

On 20.9.2025 at 10:37 AM, Davino said:

Is it, really?

Can you give me an example to under you better

yes, i recently confirmed this for myself. I recently started playing old school runescape ( (I know the example of oldschool runescape might sound silly, but stick with me, it applies to all areas of life) , and I got super into it and had myself "addicted" pretty quickly, desiring progress in the game above all.

Getting to the next step in the game was all that mattered; I could feel the desire deep in my bones.

The way I approached the game was that I had a very clear long term goal that I wanted to accomplish. This meant that all progress along the way was simply means to an end, and I wanted to skip through it as fast as possible so that I could fulfil my desire, my ultimate goal in the game (the goal itself doesnt matter, however it was "maxing my account").

I thought to myself "Damn is it really not possible to play this game without suffering from the consumption of desire?"

I tried a couple of different things, and one of them worked. 

I dropped all the goals I had in the game, and simply started playing it for what it was, moment to moment. Nothing was a means to an end. The means was the end. I was not striving for anything; i was simply playing the game from moment to moment, while still progressing towards "maxing my account". 

The difference this made in my experience of the game was unbelieveable; beforehand I would literally feel like a crack addict, desiring PROGRESS PROGRESS PROGRESS in the game, like I could literally feel it in my bones. 

And now all of that is gone. No desire for anything but the present experience the game offers. 

Another example is that I write an intuitive journal every morning I wake up. I used to think of it as a drag that I wanted to get through; i desired to get done with it every morning i was doing it. Every word I wrote had me closer to my desire of finishing writing. These examples are identical; I dropped my goal of wanting to finish the writing, and instead I put all of my effort and focus into each word itself. 

Again, this enabled me to continue the same activity i was doing beforehand, but without desire

 

 

Edited September 21 by emil1234

[Davino]

@emil1234 Yes, now I understand better. Thanks for taking the time to explain it.

[Eskilon]

2 hours ago, emil1234 said:

yes, i recently confirmed this for myself. I recently started playing old school runescape ( (I know the example of oldschool runescape might sound silly, but stick with me, it applies to all areas of life) , and I got super into it and had myself "addicted" pretty quickly, desiring progress in the game above all.

Getting to the next step in the game was all that mattered; I could feel the desire deep in my bones.

The way I approached the game was that I had a very clear long term goal that I wanted to accomplish. This meant that all progress along the way was simply means to an end, and I wanted to skip through it as fast as possible so that I could fulfil my desire, my ultimate goal in the game (the goal itself doesnt matter, however it was "maxing my account").

I thought to myself "Damn is it really not possible to play this game without suffering from the consumption of desire?"

I tried a couple of different things, and one of them worked. 

I dropped all the goals I had in the game, and simply started playing it for what it was, moment to moment. Nothing was a means to an end. The means was the end. I was not striving for anything; i was simply playing the game from moment to moment, while still progressing towards "maxing my account". 

The difference this made in my experience of the game was unbelieveable; beforehand I would literally feel like a crack addict, desiring PROGRESS PROGRESS PROGRESS in the game, like I could literally feel it in my bones. 

And now all of that is gone. No desire for anything but the present experience the game offers. 

Another example is that I write an intuitive journal every morning I wake up. I used to think of it as a drag that I wanted to get through; i desired to get done with it every morning i was doing it. Every word I wrote had me closer to my desire of finishing writing. These examples are identical; I dropped my goal of wanting to finish the writing, and instead I put all of my effort and focus into each word itself. 

Again, this enabled me to continue the same activity i was doing beforehand, but without desire

Agree with this. 

People downplay buddhism here all the time. But it has deep, deep truths. Desire IS the root of suffering. And liberation from all desire might be substantially different from awakening itself. 

You can awaken, but that doesnt mean you are free from doing. I think Buddha nailed both ends, that's why its difficult to understand.

Edited September 21 by Eskilon

[emil1234]

1 hour ago, Eskilon said:

Agree with this. 

People downplay buddhism here all the time. But it has deep, deep truths. Desire IS the root of suffering. And liberation from all desire might be substantially different from awakening itself. 

You can awaken, but that doesnt mean you are free from doing. I think Buddha nailed both ends, that's why its difficult to understand.

in my experience buddhism is very right on the point of suffering. In terms of its perspective on Absolute reality im not sure.

Desire (AND clinging, which is very closely related) definetely is the root of all DISSATISFACTION, which in my experience is the most fundamental form of suffering. Desire is always a clinging to something that IS NOT CURRENTLY THE CASE. therefore desire is fundamentally dissatisfactory.

only if you cling to desire do you desire. and only if you desire your suffering to end do you truly suffer. after all, if you truly did not desire not to suffer; what would the problem be with suffering?

Edited September 21 by emil1234