Women have wildly different interests than men

[Natasha Tori Maru]

3 hours ago, Alexop said:

No, those are your projections onto me, I never said that. We talk about men now. Men had the protectors provider role for millions of years, we have to figure out how we can forge them into maturity in our "artificial" environment we live now.

What is this 'artificial' environment? 

Is this something only men experience? This artificial thing? 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

6 hours ago, OBEler said:

So this is penis in use?

 

It could be that penis is linked to desire on a whole different scale than women. The desire to survive etc. but that's a strong generalization I make here.

An example with editing to create a spin - we cannot know the truth from this. It is another example of hearsay / bias with no direct experience.

And yes totally I think the penis is 100% linked to desire for survival - it's main job is to ensure the perpetuation of genetics into the next generation. Powerful force of creation and drive. 

My overall point was as @Xonas Pitfall raised - mens carnivorous sex drive acts to obscure understanding of women in some ways. 

Much like when you have a bunch of women on the forums completely unable to understand the issues of men being unable to access sex, and the preoccupation with the endeavour. Very hard to understand the opposite sex through the lens of the other.

Which is why I think generalisation about gender tend to be more accurate when it is a man generalising men, a women generalising women. 

 

Edited 6 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Adding to the below that I think a blend of both genders perspectives on the other would be more accurate. We are often blind to our own behaviour - so mens perspective on women is an asset. But both need to be considered if you really want to dig at the truth of it. 

To clarify I was adding in that women's perspective on women cannot be discarded.

16 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Which is why I think generalisation about gender tend to be more accurate when it is a man generalising men, a women generalising women.

 

[theleelajoker]

27 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Adding to the below that I think a blend of both genders perspectives on the other would be more accurate. We are often blind to our own behaviour - so mens perspective on women is an asset. But both need to be considered if you really want to dig at the truth of it. 

To clarify I was adding in that women's perspective on women cannot be discarded.

 

Bold marked by me.

I already said it once in another discussion - women's perspective on other women they are not emotionally connected to have been incredibly valuable for me.

Recently I told a story, a female friend commented and I had to pause for a few seconds because it felt that she hit bullseye with minimal information, minimal time and without knowing the other woman 

Some male friends had great input too. But it seems that - at least re hetero guys - that it's hard to exclude the sexual perspective on women the way woman can do it re other women. Which brings us back to thinking with the dick...

Edited 5 hours ago by theleelajoker

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@theleelajoker yes I think you are a prime example of a masculine male who has good, healthy connection to women in their life that isn't a sexual based relationship! From what you have described 

I think the cock getting in the way is similar to emotions getting in the way for women.

[theleelajoker]

Just now, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@theleelajoker yes I think you are a prime example of a masculine male who has good, healthy connection to women in their life that isn't a sexual based relationship! From what you have described 

I think the cock getting in the way is similar to emotions getting in the way for women.

Thanks. My theory is having good relationship with my sister is the main reason. 

So I learned from the start how to separate sexual interest and all other interests (exchange, connecting, learning,...) you can pursue with a woman. 

Doesn't mean I don't think with my dick sometimes too but less then many of my friends

[Vali2003]

Lately, I’ve opened up to seeing how narcissistic, and immature I (and other men) sometimes act in relation to women.

 This connects to the discussion about men/women being dramatic somewhere back in this thread. 

For example, sometimes, I would tell my girlfriend a potentially hurtful truth, like me having a crush on another woman. I act all stoic, and as though I’m simply a messenger of truth, and am there for her to cry on my shoulder, or hold space for her or whatever. In that moment, I feel like that’s just the truth, and she has to deal with the truth. Just like I would. It’s a really self-absorbed kind of perspective. In that moment, I’m completely disconnected from how I’d react if she told me she had a crush on some dude. I’d probably react “worse” than she does, but she’d likely be more considerate than me in how she told me, and less self-absorbed. I hope the comical nature of this comes across.

I don‘t want to idealize women, but it shows - at least in my experience, and I feel this applies to many men - the self-righteousness, men feel entitled to, simply due to centuries of being in a position of power over women or being seen as superior. Whether that‘s societally, academically, or in a relationship.

And it‘s fascinating how much I can feel this self-righteous, entitled belief that there‘s something about me that makes me better, smarter, more truthful etc., than my girlfriend simply because I‘m a man. And, boy, does it hurt when that belief gets shattered by reality. Waking up to this understanding makes me see feminism in a different light too. And it makes me notice how big of a dick I can be, and makes me very grateful for my girlfriend.

I think most men drastically underestimate - or are completely ignorant of - the chokehold that their need for power and superiority over women has on them. 

 

[aurum]

Feminine women in general will have less interests in STEM topics. It's not emotionally stimulating enough.

Feminine women want to feel and flow, not listen to some dry lecture and think about logistics.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

4 minutes ago, aurum said:

Feminine women in general will have less interests in STEM topics. It's not emotionally stimulating enough.

Feminine women want to feel and flow, not listen to some dry lecture and think about logistics.

This would be a balanced, accurate generalisation imo

Difficult to actually address the topic. I feel a 'general truth' is a way to assert a fixed essence or pattern to something inherently varied - almost an oxymoron: we are trying to squeeze infinite diversity into a tidy box and slap truth on it.

So I think this balanced generalisation hits harder.

[Joshe]

3 hours ago, theleelajoker said:

Thanks. My theory is having good relationship with my sister is the main reason. 

Could be something to that. I grew up close to my sister, who was 2 years older. Grew up with her and mom, so spent most of my adolescence around females. 

[Joshe]

1 hour ago, Vali2003 said:

Lately, I’ve opened up to seeing how narcissistic, and immature I (and other men) sometimes act in relation to women.

 This connects to the discussion about men/women being dramatic somewhere back in this thread. 

For example, sometimes, I would tell my girlfriend a potentially hurtful truth, like me having a crush on another woman. I act all stoic, and as though I’m simply a messenger of truth, and am there for her to cry on my shoulder, or hold space for her or whatever. In that moment, I feel like that’s just the truth, and she has to deal with the truth. Just like I would. It’s a really self-absorbed kind of perspective. In that moment, I’m completely disconnected from how I’d react if she told me she had a crush on some dude. I’d probably react “worse” than she does, but she’d likely be more considerate than me in how she told me, and less self-absorbed. I hope the comical nature of this comes across.

I don‘t want to idealize women, but it shows - at least in my experience, and I feel this applies to many men - the self-righteousness, men feel entitled to, simply due to centuries of being in a position of power over women or being seen as superior. Whether that‘s societally, academically, or in a relationship.

And it‘s fascinating how much I can feel this self-righteous, entitled belief that there‘s something about me that makes me better, smarter, more truthful etc., than my girlfriend simply because I‘m a man. And, boy, does it hurt when that belief gets shattered by reality. Waking up to this understanding makes me see feminism in a different light too. And it makes me notice how big of a dick I can be, and makes me very grateful for my girlfriend.

I think most men drastically underestimate - or are completely ignorant of - the chokehold that their need for power and superiority over women has on them. 

 

Very nice articulation. Thanks for sharing. It’s a breath of fresh air to see someone admit it. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Vali2003 Appreciate your very personal anecdote. Some deep work involved there

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Joshe I'll echo this despite being a woman!

Some unfortunate circumstances meant I had the greatest hand raising my younger brother (I was there for his birth also). 

He went out into the world having a strong secure relationship with me, and all the women of my family.

It was a shock when he started to dip his whistle, seeing him return from nights out with 2, sometimes 3 women....

He is now in a committed healthy relationship with a woman who has a child to a previous marriage. But that phase where he went crazy sleeping with women was INSANE ! 

Edited 1 hour ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Joshe]

14 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@Joshe I'll echo this despite being a woman!

Some unfortunate circumstances meant I had the greatest hand raising my younger brother (I was there for his birth also). 

He went out into the world having a strong secure relationship with me, and all the women of my family.

It was a shock when he started to dip his whistle, seeing him return from nights out with 2, sometimes 3 women....

He is now in a committed healthy relationship with a woman who has a child to a previous marriage. But that phase where he went crazy sleeping with women was INSANE ! 

Lol. 

Yeah, it makes sense guys who acclimate to the female presence early on would be better adjusted. 

How did you feel about seeing your little brother raking them in? Some part of you was proud, right? Lol. He probably never would have had such luck if it weren’t for you. 

Edited 1 hour ago by Joshe

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Joshe It was a really weird ego moment bloody hell... on the one hand I was chuffed he was able to have a great experience, and on the other I felt like maybe he was using the understanding of women I gave him against them! But it wasn't the case at all - I ran into these girls next morning in the kitchen and usually had breakfast with them.

They just genuinely loved him because he was able to engage his own emotions authentically and expressively without putting the weight of them on the women. Which ties back in nicely to your topic the 'Job of the man is to be the rock'. For him it isn't about repressing or hiding emotions, its about expressing. Being comfortable doing so. Holding space for his OWN emotions as well as the women he was with. Helps he is always fucken laughing! And he just takes them on fun experiences. That's all - and they land all over his dick lol

He did tell me he has some tricks - like doing LOTS of things together in one night or day so it feels like there is more experience and bonding (generating trust faster). Also never pressuring the girls. If they don't want to go back to his, he doesn't care. He still treats them exactly the same. Later down the track they end up in his bed. LOL 

I work with him in construction so you can imagine how much of the inner carnivore of men I see (with my own eyes, and through him). The tradies sometimes ask me for tips. It feels like handing them weapons. I think it just comes down to emotional engagement and generating fun and laughter. Boom, done. I get treated like a dude on the jobsite, so I see a lot of this. But this is purely because I know how to navigate and work with men to make them feel comfortable. Lots of marriage counselling talk etc 

Gotta admit though, hearing my brother speak was enlightening - him talking about running through women, 'yeah bit of a phase, having fun, relationships are great but always like to explore'. He has always had a good balance of stable long term relationships with occasional periods of, in his words 'I need to slay slay slay for a bit'

 

[Joshe]

@Natasha Tori Maru haha, nice! Yeah, sounds about right. Sounds like my approach. Not much theorizing required. Just not being needy, not caring if they walk, and just being light-hearted and fun. Of course we pickup sly techniques along the way that increase chance of success. 

You sound like quite the entertainment on the job site. Lol. I bet you often hear them talking about you after you turn the corner.