Israel launches attack on Iran

[zazen]

28 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

You take them at their word? Were you born yesterday?

The world just observed how not to take the US or Israel at its word.

Edited Sunday at 07:31 AM by zazen

[Inliytened1]

5 minutes ago, zazen said:

The world just observed how not to take the US or Israel at its word.

Stop evading the question.  It's quite simple if you remove all of your bullshit.  Is Iran trying to build nukes to destroy Israel.  Oh my.  Answer - yes- have they lied about it? ANSWER - big surprise- YES.

Edited Sunday at 07:37 AM by Inliytened1

[zazen]

@Inliytened1 They’re building to deter Western misadventure, not destroy.

On 17/06/2025 at 11:09 PM, zazen said:

It's like a chicken or the egg situation of who caused it. Timeline wise it looks more like Iran is reacting to the West than the other way round.

Mossadegh was couped by CIA/MI6 in 1953 because he nationalized Iranian oil, then came the Western backed Shah who was known to be brutal (his secret police SAVAK was trained by the CIA and Mossad), he was overthrown in the revolution, then US backed Saddams invasion of Iran in the 80's, post 2000's US bases encircle Iran in Iraq and Afghanistan, besides already existing along the gulf.

Iran seems to be responding to imperialism more than being imperialistic itself. Its more reactive than offensive. Its forced to play asymmetrical defense and deterrence via proxies because it doesn’t have the military or economic weight to match the US / Israel alliance. The US doesn't need proxies because its muscle does the job directly with its own bases, fleets and carrier groups.

Why didn’t the US stick to the JCPOA? Trumps talking about peace now when it was already in place. Such gaslightery.

Answer this: does Israel have nukes or not?

Edited Sunday at 08:39 AM by zazen

[Wilhelm44]

58 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Stop evading the question.  It's quite simple if you remove all of your bullshit.  Is Iran trying to build nukes to destroy Israel.  Oh my.  Answer - yes- have they lied about it? ANSWER - big surprise- YES.

The bullshit part was attacking them a few days before negotiations were to resume. Distraction from genocide in Gaza.

[zazen]

The world is hip to the game. Anyone still making excuses or rationalising Western imperial action is ignorant at best, or a supremacist imperial bootlicker at its worst.

“Deterrence for me but not for thee”

https://www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/06_iran_strategy.pdf

[sholomar]

To be honest I'm neutral on this whole thing. Iran  and Arab cultures are a lower spiral dynamic stage of development, the global freedom index, and they tend to be autocracies, so it's probably good they don't have nukes however the main reason they dislike us is because we've been meddling in the Middle East whether it's been for Israel or oil for decades literally decades so we're not guiltless in this whole thing either. Bottom line it's just human nature playing itself out in the global stage.

If we did nothing and they did develop nukes then they would end up like North Korea so who knows if that would be better or not. Who knows if this attack even accomplished anything as they were expecting it and probably moved all the sensitive material off-site before it occurred. 

If you notice it's autocracies that tend to help other autocracies and democracies that tend to defend democracies. Israel is supposedly a democracy and embraces a lot more Western and progressive values than any of the Arab Nations and the vast majority of their population don't even seem to support this war or their government's actions either.  If Iran did somehow develop nukes and launch them at Israel  we'd be blaming everybody for not being proactive. Seems like a damned if you do damned if you don't situation when dealing with autocracies and lower spiral Dynamics cultures and human nature in general. 

There are no Innocents here when it comes to global leadership we all share the same genetic makeup with the same general tendencies it's only the cultural development that separates us. The one mistake of stage greens is they think they can handle lower spiral dynamic stages from the perspective of a green and think that those lower stages will listen and it usually doesn't work that way.  This is one of those situations where there's perhaps no easy answer and no statistical analysis you could run  to say one course of action is definitely 100% going to work over another.

The real danger now is retaliation on aircraft carriers or us installations in the area and potential allies supplying Iran with weapons and escalating the situation. Escalating to a global world war is generally a no win situation even for the money changers and big corporate interests that generally profit from war but there are plenty of psychopaths and sociopaths in positions of global leadership. Enjoy the show.

 

Edited Sunday at 09:45 AM by sholomar

[PenguinPablo]

@zazen Bro they were building weapons of mass destruction! 

😂 

Wait I'm confusing it with Bush.

Woops.

We did it again.

Straight from the playbook.

 

[Twentyfirst]

2 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

You take them at their word? Were you born yesterday?

There is no international law against them enriching as far as I know

[Twentyfirst]

20 minutes ago, sholomar said:

To be honest I'm neutral on this whole thing. Iran  and Arab cultures are a lower spiral dynamic stage of development, the global freedom index, and they tend to be autocracies, so it's probably good they don't have nukes however the main reason they dislike us is because we've been meddling in the Middle East whether it's been for Israel or oil for decades literally decades so we're not guiltless in this whole thing either. Bottom line it's just human nature playing itself out in the global stage.

If we did nothing and they did develop nukes then they would end up like North Korea so who knows if that would be better or not. Who knows if this attack even accomplished anything as they were expecting it and probably moved all the sensitive material off-site before it occurred. 

If you notice it's autocracies that tend to help other autocracies and democracies that tend to defend democracies. Israel is supposedly a democracy and embraces a lot more Western and progressive values than any of the Arab Nations and the vast majority of their population don't even seem to support this war or their government's actions either.  If Iran did somehow develop nukes and launch them at Israel  we'd be blaming everybody for not being proactive. Seems like a damned if you do damned if you don't situation when dealing with autocracies and lower spiral Dynamics cultures and human nature in general. 

There are no Innocents here when it comes to global leadership we all share the same genetic makeup with the same general tendencies it's only the cultural development that separates us. The one mistake of stage greens is they think they can handle lower spiral dynamic stages from the perspective of a green and think that those lower stages will listen and it usually doesn't work that way.  This is one of those situations where there's perhaps no easy answer and no statistical analysis you could run  to say one course of action is definitely 100% going to work over another.

The real danger now is retaliation on aircraft carriers or us installations in the area and potential allies supplying Iran with weapons and escalating the situation. Escalating to a global world war is generally a no win situation even for the money changers and big corporate interests that generally profit from war but there are plenty of psychopaths and sociopaths in positions of global leadership. Enjoy the show.

 

Arabs and Persians can't govern themselves? Since when?

Prove it

[zazen]

It’s called “counter-intuitive”. Something that flies over the heads of Western arrogance. This isn’t the 20th century anymore where the West is the only player in town in a uni-polar world, demanding others dance on its pole.

The multi-polar world is here - which explains the West acting in aggression towards it. Israel, Ukraine and Taiwan being their Trojan horses on each continent.

Iran said they wouldn’t negotiate until Israel stops attacking, why would they negotiate now after the US itself has attacked - they even decapitated the key negotiator. This is the level of stupidity on display.

“We bombed you during negotiations and killed your key negotiator, but please return to the negotiating table - the one you never left but we portray to the world as if you did in a bid to make you look like barbaric backwards Middle Easterners who are incapable of diplomacy”

Edited Sunday at 11:41 AM by zazen

[chess_king]

Despite my hate for israel I always get good dreams about them like in the dream I explore the country make friends etc etc its really weird , just some personal exp outside of the conversation. lol

[Lyubov]

Medvedev is full of shit. I highly doubt Russia would supply Iran with nuclear weapons.