Mega thread: masculine role model

[AION]

 

[Yimpa]

On 4/7/2025 at 2:57 AM, AION said:

 

                               

[AION]

 

Andrew Tate's Core Philosophy:

A central theme is the belief that everything in the world is a choice, including being overweight, broke, or even depressed. Adopting this mindset is seen as empowering, as it allows individuals to choose to change their circumstances, whereas believing things are not a choice removes power and responsibility.

The most powerful mindset, especially for a man, is one that allows him to be most competitive and win. What matters most is not necessarily objective truth, but adopting mindsets or strategies that lead to winning. Tate argues that his entire worldview comes from believing what makes him feel most powerful is true. His primary objective is to win all of the time, not to feel happy.

Happiness is described as being for women and children, not for men. Men are expected to be constantly stressed or annoyed, and pursuing happiness as a man leads to being unproductive and engaging in "unimportant narcissistic hedonistic garbage". Building something and being content with achievement is seen as the "masculine imperative".

Views on Society, "The Matrix," and the UK:

Tate frequently refers to "The Matrix" as a system that manipulates information and controls people. He claims the media softens people to ideas rather than reporting truth. The media is accused of lying and being a tool to prepare people's minds for what is about to happen.

He expresses strong views on migration in the UK, claiming it is the reason streets are unsafe and London is in decline. He states there is a deliberate effort to replace native British people with "third worlders" for political and financial gain, allowing leaders to rule with absolute force and steal without accountability.

The Netflix show "Adolescence" is criticized as a deliberate "scop" (setup or scam) designed to attack masculinity and blame native British youth for societal problems, deflecting from the issue of migration.

Tate believes the British government is corrupt and actively attempting to jail him without legitimate reason, seeing his legal troubles as part of a deliberate effort to silence him because he highlights systemic issues. He argues that being "law-abiding" is irrelevant if the government can lie and fabricate charges to target anyone they wish. Trusting the government to fix problems they created is seen as foolish.

Views on Personal Finance and Assets:

Saving money is described as the "most foolish thing a person does" due to currency devaluation through government printing and inflation. Only poor people save money; money loses value rapidly.

Real assets matter because they retain value as currency decreases, mentioning food and shelter as examples.

Buying assets using debt, where the interest rate is less than the asset's appreciation, is presented as a way to get rich, as inflation decreases the value of the debt while the asset's price goes up.

Regarding asset protection, Tate notes that while some Bitcoin and property were seized by the government, he was still able to live in the seized property while under house arrest. He suggests that trusts are more complicated for the government to seize assets from compared to owning them personally or in a company name. However, he also states that if truly attacked by the government, particularly with money laundering accusations, they can seize all associated assets regardless of structure.

Views on Personal Development, Effort, and Education:

In chaotic times, when predicting the future is difficult, the only thing one can predict is their own effort: working harder, getting up earlier, paying more attention, researching more. Going "all in on yourself" is an investment that will never backfire.

Adaptability is key to survival and success.

People who are losing often "deserve to lose" because they don't try. The ease of winning in the world today is attributed to the majority of people being unwilling to put in the effort.

Love without capability is meaningless, particularly for a man. A man's love only has value if he has the means to act on it, such as providing and protecting his family. Not trying to escape poverty or the system shows a lack of care for oneself and family.

Traditional education is described as a "complete scam" and a tool for the state to brainwash children with "poisonous ideologies" and condition them to "permafail". Children learn little of value in school compared to what they can learn from life, extracurricular activities, and the internet. Home education and focusing on interpersonal skills, confidence, and putting children through stress/tests are suggested alternatives.

Views on the Future:

The art of making money is predicting the future. This is becoming harder due to global disruptors like cryptocurrency, AI, and geopolitical issues.

AI is predicted to make the poor poorer and the rich richer, widening the wealth gap. The time to get rich is now because there is an urgency due to impending changes.

There is concern that "The Matrix" might eventually switch off the internet to maintain control over information and ideas. Planning for this could involve decentralizing assets and building connections with influential people.

History is questioned, with the COVID-19 pandemic used as an example where the reality experienced by individuals differed significantly from how it might be portrayed historically, suggesting that what is understood as truth or history might be a "scam".

Samuel Leeds also shares his experiences, including his weight loss journey inspired by Tate, the success of his business amplified by Tate's appearances, and his own financial practices involving property, debt, and asset protection. He agrees on the importance of making money and taking personal responsibility. He has pulled his own children out of traditional school for home education to avoid state brainwashing.Here is a structured summary based on the provided transcript excerpts:

This transcript captures a conversation, primarily between Andrew Tate and Samuel Leeds, covering various topics including personal development, financial strategies, societal issues, and critiques of media and government.

Andrew Tate's Core Philosophy:

A central theme is the belief that everything in the world is a choice, including being overweight, broke, or even depressed. Adopting this mindset is seen as empowering, as it allows individuals to choose to change their circumstances, whereas believing things are not a choice removes power and responsibility.

The most powerful mindset, especially for a man, is one that allows him to be most competitive and win. What matters most is not necessarily objective truth, but adopting mindsets or strategies that lead to winning. Tate argues that his entire worldview comes from believing what makes him feel most powerful is true. His primary objective is to win all of the time, not to feel happy.

Happiness is described as being for women and children, not for men. Men are expected to be constantly stressed or annoyed, and pursuing happiness as a man leads to being unproductive and engaging in "unimportant narcissistic hedonistic garbage". Building something and being content with achievement is seen as the "masculine imperative".

Views on Society, "The Matrix," and the UK:

Tate frequently refers to "The Matrix" as a system that manipulates information and controls people. He claims the media softens people to ideas rather than reporting truth. The media is accused of lying and being a tool to prepare people's minds for what is about to happen.

He expresses strong views on migration in the UK, claiming it is the reason streets are unsafe and London is in decline. He states there is a deliberate effort to replace native British people with "third worlders" for political and financial gain, allowing leaders to rule with absolute force and steal without accountability.

The Netflix show "Adolescence" is criticized as a deliberate "scop" (setup or scam) designed to attack masculinity and blame native British youth for societal problems, deflecting from the issue of migration.

Tate believes the British government is corrupt and actively attempting to jail him without legitimate reason, seeing his legal troubles as part of a deliberate effort to silence him because he highlights systemic issues. He argues that being "law-abiding" is irrelevant if the government can lie and fabricate charges to target anyone they wish. Trusting the government to fix problems they created is seen as foolish.

Views on Personal Finance and Assets:

Saving money is described as the "most foolish thing a person does" due to currency devaluation through government printing and inflation. Only poor people save money; money loses value rapidly.

Real assets matter because they retain value as currency decreases, mentioning food and shelter as examples.

Buying assets using debt, where the interest rate is less than the asset's appreciation, is presented as a way to get rich, as inflation decreases the value of the debt while the asset's price goes up.

Regarding asset protection, Tate notes that while some Bitcoin and property were seized by the government, he was still able to live in the seized property while under house arrest. He suggests that trusts are more complicated for the government to seize assets from compared to owning them personally or in a company name. However, he also states that if truly attacked by the government, particularly with money laundering accusations, they can seize all associated assets regardless of structure.

Views on Personal Development, Effort, and Education:

In chaotic times, when predicting the future is difficult, the only thing one can predict is their own effort: working harder, getting up earlier, paying more attention, researching more. Going "all in on yourself" is an investment that will never backfire.

Adaptability is key to survival and success.

People who are losing often "deserve to lose" because they don't try. The ease of winning in the world today is attributed to the majority of people being unwilling to put in the effort.

Love without capability is meaningless, particularly for a man. A man's love only has value if he has the means to act on it, such as providing and protecting his family. Not trying to escape poverty or the system shows a lack of care for oneself and family.

Traditional education is described as a "complete scam" and a tool for the state to brainwash children with "poisonous ideologies" and condition them to "permafail". Children learn little of value in school compared to what they can learn from life, extracurricular activities, and the internet. Home education and focusing on interpersonal skills, confidence, and putting children through stress/tests are suggested alternatives.

Views on the Future:

The art of making money is predicting the future. This is becoming harder due to global disruptors like cryptocurrency, AI, and geopolitical issues.

AI is predicted to make the poor poorer and the rich richer, widening the wealth gap. The time to get rich is now because there is an urgency due to impending changes.

There is concern that "The Matrix" might eventually switch off the internet to maintain control over information and ideas. Planning for this could involve decentralizing assets and building connections with influential people.

History is questioned, with the COVID-19 pandemic used as an example where the reality experienced by individuals differed significantly from how it might be portrayed historically, suggesting that what is understood as truth or history might be a "scam".

Samuel Leeds also shares his experiences, including his weight loss journey inspired by Tate, the success of his business amplified by Tate's appearances, and his own financial practices involving property, debt, and asset protection. He agrees on the importance of making money and taking personal responsibility. He has pulled his own children out of traditional school for home education to avoid state brainwashing.

[AION]

 

A contrast is drawn between the speaker's background and Tate's. The speaker suggests a general guide in life is to be nice or good. While the posturing of figures like Tate can be attractive to young men, particularly those who feel ineffectual or rejected ("incels"), as it might offer a pathway to toughen up and strive, monster is considered better than wimp, but the question is what is better than monster.

Narcissism and intense internal focus can help someone get "pretty far" or "close" to the top, especially in difficult fields like fighting, because it allows for specialization and drive. However, it is suggested that at the championship level ("the King"), athletes are almost universally disciplined, focused, and generally kind. They possess balance. An imbalance, while allowing someone to get far due to specialization, can lead them to "fall prey to the balanced man".

The drawbacks of narcissism and sociopathy are highlighted. Individuals with these traits often know they cannot be truly proud of themselves. They don't receive the positive feedback from true kindness to others and know their reputation is founded on sand. Rationalizing this by thinking "everyone does that" leads to not trusting or liking anyone, resulting in being "really alone". Even achieving success can feel hollow because of this isolation.

The source outlines a progression, likened to Carl Jung's concept of individuation, which describes a path of development for men. This progression starts with being ineffectual and rejected (e.g., an incel). The next step involves finding a "shadow figure" to sharpen and toughen up, leading to striving and becoming, in a sense, a "monster". The crucial subsequent stage involves the integration of the feminine part ("anima"), which includes discovering the utility of empathy, compassion, kindness, mercy, and care, while still retaining the ability to deal justice. This integration is described as what ultimately places individuals, even fighters, at the highest level.

George St-Pierre is given as an example of a highly successful fighter who embodies this integrated state. He is described as one of the greatest of all time but also one of the nicest people, curious, intelligent, well-read, always interested in new things, and still on a quest for improvement as a martial artist even in retirement. Talking to him, you would never guess he was one of the greatest fighters.

The audience drawn to the pathway Tate offers is noted as being particularly disaffected and quite angry, especially towards women. For these individuals, if it's a choice between being "hard on women" or picking themselves, they will pick themselves.

[AION]

All you need to know about bioenergetics which will help you to create a better relationship with your anima (which is your body). He provides exercises how to do it: when you change your relationship to your body (anima) you change everything. Especially for nerdy guys who neglected their body these exercises is the gordian knot.

 

[AION]

Bioenergetics (see video above) helped me more than 5 years of therapy. All those years of yapping with female therapists who don't know anything about anything. Fortunately I wake up but I wished I woke up faster. I hate to say it but Andrew Tate was the catalyst for me to stop listening to others. Most people are idiots but I still love them but that doesn't mean I will listen to them with all due respect.

To stop listening to others, you first need to fix your epistemology and work from first principles and direct experience. That is how I discovered about bioenergetics. I mean, how hard would it have been for therapists to forward me a 10 minute video about bioenergetics that would help me with accessing my emotions.

Most people operate from sheep mentality. They can't think for themselves. They just do what others do. And in a certain way, you need this ability too, which is called social collaboration: but don't expect these people to help you with anything. They can't even help themselves.  The antidote to a sheep mentality is what? What is the opposite of a sheep? I won't spell it out but that is the mindset you need to develop to get anything done.

Edited April 26 by AION

[Daniel Balan]

Jocko Willink is the best masculie role model nowadays! If you lack blue and red, read his book discipline equals freedom! It is my favorite book all time!

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Daniel Balan said:

Jocko Willink is the best masculie role model nowadays! If you lack blue and red, read his book discipline equals freedom! It is my favorite book all time!

Meh. Bryan Johnson tries to beat death himself, and he doesn't tell you to sleep less and ruin your health 

Edited April 27 by Carl-Richard

[AION]

10 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Meh. Bryan Johnson tries to beat death himself, and he doesn't tell you to sleep less and ruin your health 

Just looking at Jocko or that other black military guy. You can just tell they have couple of screws loose. I wouldn’t be listening to them. They don’t even look physically healthy. And I’m not even talking about the mental part. 

[EternalForest]

Guts from Berserk

Hank from Breaking Bad

Iron Man from Avengers

[AION]

 

Core Concept: Frame

The central concept discussed is "frame," described as a man's real strength, which is not just money or muscles, but includes his ability to lead a group and be a leader.

Frame is also your ability to hold your validation and be the dispenser of validation, making others chase your acceptance and approval.

Losing frame is when a man puts a woman before his mission for God, loses confidence, or becomes dependent on her validation.

How Men Lose Power and Why Women Leave

Women are described as being there to teach men the most incredible skills, but in a brutal way, through rejections, sadness, confusion, and breakups.

The speaker believes that women, on a core level, will "viciously say no" as soon as a man puts them before God.

When a guy loses frame, women have something called an "RA slip" or Reticular Activation System flip. They previously pedestalized the man, but upon losing frame, they focus on his bad sides and leave.

This can happen rapidly after just one instance of losing frame, described humorously as "die fucker".

Losing frame makes a man look pathetic, which can kill a woman's attraction.

Women may begin to "shit test profusely" if they sense a man is losing frame, emasculating him or making mean comments to test his weakness.

If a woman detects a man losing frame, she starts looking for backups.

The speaker uses a graphic analogy involving the shape of the penis and the function of sperm to suggest women are biologically driven to "plunge out" other men's sperm (representing a man who has lost frame) and find a new man quickly.

Relationships are very tough because external factors like Instagram, family, and friends often encourage women to leave. Instagram is seen as mocking relationships and brainwashing women.

Women today often brag about having a "roster" of men, similar to how men traditionally would. They enjoy their freedom and being single often means being sexually active with multiple attractive men.

Societal Changes and Loss of Frame Support

The speaker contrasts modern society with the past, where institutions like the church, community, and family helped hold frame for a man in a relationship by discouraging cheating and divorce.

Modern society lacks these external supports; there is less stigma around divorce and having sex with multiple partners.

Modern day marriage is seen as dangerous because these supporting structures are gone.

It's very difficult for one man to hold frame consistently for 50 years without societal support.

Young men today are seen as not having a "stake in modern society anymore".

The "Ick" Mechanism

Women have countless "icks" or minor turn-offs that can instantly destroy attraction.

It's impossible to avoid all the icks.

The only solution is to "transcend the ick" by being the one who is qualifying the woman, putting her in a "self-qualifying mode" rather than allowing her to qualify you down.

Maintaining Frame and Organic Attraction

In the absence of societal support, the only thing holding a relationship together is "organic attraction".

Organic attraction is generated and maintained when a man holds his frame and validation, becoming the dispenser of validation that the woman chases.

Maintaining frame requires a man to get his validation and frame from sources like God, his environment, passions, purpose, hobbies, friends, nature, and day-to-day life.

It is human to seek validation from a partner, and while it can build a bond, it becomes dangerous when there is no external support for frame, as the partner can withdraw that validation.

Being in a committed relationship can lead men to lose external validation sources like friends and hobbies, making them overly reliant on their partner's validation.

Dating multiple people can help a man effortlessly maintain frame because he is receiving validation from various sources and isn't overly invested in one outcome.

If a man wants monogamy and a traditional family in the current environment, he must become very good at maintaining frame and generating organic attraction without external support.

The speaker believes the single best way to build frame is to go out and socialize, getting real-time feedback on your frame.

This involves being grounded, centered, self-amused, having a plan, enjoying yourself, and not seeking reassurance from the woman.

Instead of trying to gain rapport, focus on owning your power and getting others to chase your acceptance.

Believe that your life, social skills, lifestyle, and vibe are so cool that others would be lucky to be a part of it.

This is not about being manipulative, but having self-control.

Consequences of Losing Frame

Losing frame leads to the man becoming a "pathetic pool of patheticness".

The woman feels good watching the man who used to chase her collapse.

After a breakup due to lost frame, the man is often left feeling numb and struggling to socialize while the woman is congratulated by friends and Instagram and has many new options.

Men often self-emasculate by making the woman their world and losing their external validation sources.

Learning from breakups is crucial, as the pain can drive personal growth and help men get better at maintaining frame.

Practical Application and Learning

The speaker demonstrates subtle frame control techniques, such as being inquisitive and driving the other person into a "self-qualifying mode".

This dynamic is similar to how high-end luxury brands make customers feel privileged to buy their products.

Women are often naturally good at this frame control in dating interactions.

The speaker runs training programs, including "infield training" where participants practice social skills in real-world interactions and receive feedback.

Learning these skills provides a return on investment (ROI) by improving communication, confidence, social skills, and potentially career prospects and financial success.

It's important to learn this early in life, especially for men who want to have a family, as delaying learning can lead to relationship failures and impact future generations.

True frame maintenance should ideally come from within, perhaps through spiritual practice or meditation, rather than becoming addicted to controlling the frame for external validation.

It's a challenging process that may take years, but accelerating the learning curve is necessary in modern society.

Edited May 7 by AION

[AION]

Best motivations for incels … full stop ✋🏾 

I don’t see anybody else care as much for incels as Andrew Tate and that is just heart warming  

 

[martins name]

Gandalf is #1

[Ramanujan]

marcus aurelius , khabib , andrew tate

[Kalki Avatar]

 

[archi]

Observing, adapting including many if not all men as a role model into myself to create my masculine uniqueness.

Examples:

Arnold for determination in gym for instance, own father for staying in marriage, my son for todo lists or other son for creativity, mom for energy (perpetum mobile in her ass :)) , Leo for bringing new perspectives etc.

It would be interesting to sort all models into spiral dynamics stages ...

 

Edited May 23 by archi

[AION]

Summary:

Fake Confidence Always Wins (And Why Real Confidence is Overrated)

Let me hit you with some real talk that’s gonna piss off the "authenticity" crowd: Fake confidence destroys real confidence in social settings 99% of the time.

Yeah, I said it. And just like fake food outsells real food, garbage music tops the charts, and Instagram models with filler get more attention than natural beauties—social dynamics reward the illusion over the substance.

The Delusional Confidence Hack

You ever see a dude with a fake iced-out watch getting more female attention than the guy wearing a real Rolex? Or a loudmouth club promoter (who still lives with his parents) out-socializing doctors and lawyers? That’s delusional confidence at work.

Here’s why it dominates:

• Real confidence is fragile. It’s tied to achievements—your business, your status, your Super Bowl ring. But what happens when someone outdoes you? When your revenue drops? When you get injured? Your confidence crumbles because it’s conditional.
• Fake confidence is bulletproof. It’s based on nothing. No achievements, no validation, just pure, unshakable self-belief. And because it’s not tied to reality, it never goes down.

The Two Audiences That Matter

Now, before you call me a sociopath, understand this:

For yourself and God: Be competent. Be authentic. Build real self-esteem. This is your internal world—where integrity matters.

For the external world (bars, clubs, parties): Leave that authenticity at home. Social dynamics aren’t about truth; they’re about perception, vibes, and frame. Walking into a club with "real confidence" is like bringing a sword to a gunfight. Naive.

Swagger: The Unfiltered Mindset

The magic sauce is swagger—the art of being unplugged from group think. Most people are NPCs (Non-Player Characters) regurgitating societal scripts. Swagger means:

Seeing the world through your own lens.

Speaking, joking, and moving unapologetically.

Having zero neurotic holding patterns (no overthinking, no fear of saying the "wrong" thing).

Being in your own energy, not seeking validation.

This is why corporate drones struggle socially. They’re trained to filter themselves, to follow rules, to fear backlash. That shit kills attractiveness.

The God-Level Mindset

Pure swagger comes from delusional certainty rooted in:

Knowing you’re a child of God (or the universe, if you’re woo-woo).

Believing your existence is infinite ("you’re not going anywhere").

Living in depth, not breadth—milking the present moment instead of chasing external validation.

Most men are out here trying to build empires to feel worthy. Pathetic. Confidence isn’t something you earn—it’s something you claim.

Frame Warfare

Social interactions are battles of frame. Your "frame" is your reality—the rules you set for how others perceive you.

Example: Donald Trump doesn’t debate on his critics’ terms. He redefines the criteria ("I’m the best because I say so"). Weak men try to qualify themselves in others’ frames. Strong men force others into theirs.

The Death of the Provider Male

The "protector-provider" role is obsolete for attraction. Optimizing for provisioning turns you into:

A societal Oompa Loompa (worker bee, invisible to women).

A group thinker (paranoid about perception, stuck in the matrix).

A 15-year grind for results a swagger-heavy dude gets in 15 minutes.

Instead, become a provider of vibes and seeds.

Mental Strength = Social Strength

Holding frame requires rejecting societal shit tests:

"Toxic masculinity."

"Be a nice guy."

"You need money to get women."

These are tests to see if you’ll fold into group think. The mentally weak comply. The strong see through the bullshit (like knowing a red card is red even when everyone calls it yellow).

Why This Isn’t Actually Delusional

The ability to hold an unshakable frame—despite ridicule, rejection, or logic—is real potency. NPCs can’t do it. That’s why swagger works: It signals higher status than looks or money ever could.

For the average man, frame is the only viable battlefield. You won’t out-rich Bezos or out-look Chris Hemsworth. But you can out-swagger them.

The Takeaway

Fake it till you make it isn’t a meme—it’s the cheat code.

Swagger > substance in social settings (but keep substance for yourself/God).

Frame control is the ultimate social skill.

Reject group think. Society’s rules are designed to keep you mediocre.

Final thought: Babies are the ultimate swagger masters. They scream, laugh, and shit themselves without apology. Reclaim that energy.

 

 

Edited Thursday at 08:59 AM by AION