Leo's Blog Discussion Mega-Thread

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

All I'm saying is: Is the burn mark on my skin not proof that reality didn't actually disappear while I was sleeping ?

All I'm saying is you are hallucinating the burn mark.

You are like the guy in the dream saying, "Look! This can't be a dream because I have a burn mark!"

Edited 5 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Wilhelm44]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

All I'm saying is you are hallucinating the burn mark.

[Davino]

God's imagination has to be intelligent enough to deceive itself, to limit itself, just take a moment to fathom how much that takes.

And now, to awaken God has to outsmart itself.

[Rilles]

2 hours ago, Wilhelm44 said:

All I'm saying is: Is the burn mark on my skin not proof that reality didn't actually disappear while I was sleeping ?

Why are you assuming you can't imagine continuity? Is coherence not a property that can be imagined? Can you yourself in your mind imagine falling asleep and then waking up? If you can do that it is not a leap to imagine the Self can do the same.

[Rafael Thundercat]

This conversations are interesting, but part of me sense that we are trying to unriddle the riddle, trying to solve a infinite imagination puzzle, using arguments here and there, and all we get are this dialetics, one say x Leo say Y and so on. There is always the sense that somethings goes not being understood, so the riddle goes unriddeled.

[zurew]

1 hour ago, Rilles said:

Why are you assuming you can't imagine continuity? Is coherence not a property that can be imagined? Can you yourself in your mind imagine falling asleep and then waking up? If you can do that it is not a leap to imagine the Self can do the same.

The problem is the wordgames.

You having perceptions is also imagined. When you close your eyes and don't see anything, that is also imagined. You having a specific set of experiences is also imagined. But for some reason, some people here want to tie "what exists" to "what is currently on the screen of perception."

An equivocation game is played with words like "direct experience" and "direct consciousness" --- sometimes these words are used in perception-dependent ways, and at other times they aren't used in perception-dependent ways.

 

You have an insight that you are God, you come back from the trip, and then you take that insight and conceptually superimpose it onto the perceptions your ego has right now. "Oh, but I have already deconstructed the difference between the ego and God," says the ego, which is currently not directly conscious that it is God and is mistaking its limited and imagined perceptual faculties for what is real or what exists.

Edited 1 hour ago by zurew

[gettoefl]

32 minutes ago, Rafael Thundercat said:

This conversations are interesting, but part of me sense that we are trying to unriddle the riddle, trying to solve a infinite imagination puzzle, using arguments here and there, and all we get are this dialetics, one say x Leo say Y and so on. There is always the sense that somethings goes not being understood, so the riddle goes unriddeled.

It's about doing the work, walking the walk. You get up in the morning and think there is a war going on today. God walks on the front line and sees peace all around. You are God too. War and peace are choices not circumstances. This is the work.

"Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists. Herein lies the peace of God."

[Wilhelm44]

1 hour ago, Rilles said:

Why are you assuming you can't imagine continuity? Is coherence not a property that can be imagined? Can you yourself in your mind imagine falling asleep and then waking up? If you can do that it is not a leap to imagine the Self can do the same.

True, would it also be possible to hallucinate that the hallucinated reality still continues in the background while I'm sleeping ?

[gettoefl]

26 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

True, would it also be possible to hallucinate that the hallucinated reality still continues in the background while I'm sleeping ?

There is two things: imagination and training. If you can imagine you can imagine. Can you train mind and body to manifest it? Well dogs seem to be able to sleep still perceiving with their senses the outside world. Says in the bible: For man these things are not possible but for God all things are possible.

[Rilles]

56 minutes ago, Wilhelm44 said:

True, would it also be possible to hallucinate that the hallucinated reality still continues in the background while I'm sleeping ?

Speculation takes you further away from your direct experience, go seek and you shall find, lad.

[r0ckyreed]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It literally does.

The colors and visuals disappear but the objects are still there only accessible by my other senses. I can close my eyes and my bed is no longer seen, but I can feel it and lay on it. The same with a lake, ocean, and with other people. I still have a visual concept in my mind of what a bed and lake look like. If another person closed their eyes, went blind, and said visuals cease to exist, I would tell them that they do for you but the visual world still exists for me, and the blind person is missing out on it. The same analogy can be applied to other senses and even to awakening. The whole world isn’t awake but yet awakening still exists. What is your objection to this?

Edited just now by r0ckyreed