Leo you misunderstand Hitler completely

[Leo Gura]

@OBEler Why do you distinguish between right-wing and conservative?

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[Mormegil]

To divide these complex movements only into the categories "liberal" and "conservative" is way too simplistic in my opinion. Here in germany in political debates we mostly use the terms "right" and "left" which also misses a ton of nuances.

People are a mix of both, left people can be conservative (to a much lesser degree than right people tho) and right wingers can be liberal (at least economically).

A TRUE Christian should disagree with Nazism. My history teacher told be this story how his fundamentalist catholic grandfather hated Hitler, because Nazis ignore fundamental christian values obviously and their leader becomes some weird God-like figure (same in North Korea for example).

I always saw it that their is a ton of overlap between conservatives and Nazis, so Nazis have to be conservatives as well by nature. But they have perverted the conservative world view (just like they perverted anything else they touched) and took it too a degree where a normie conservative (even a right one) should not follow them. 

Edited March 26 by Mormegil

[Leo Gura]

29 minutes ago, Mormegil said:

I always saw it that their is a ton of overlap between conservatives and Nazis, so Nazis have to be conservatives as well by nature. But they have perverted the conservative world view (just like they perverted anything else they touched) and took it too a degree where a normie conservative (even a right one) should not follow them. 

Of course! That's what extremism entails.

A very moderate Nazi is just a friendly conservative.

A TRUE Christian is rare as a hen's tooth. So that doesn't mean much in political discourse, which deals with large averages.

Since most people do not think, they follow, they are easily seduced by extremists.

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[Yimpa]

13 minutes ago, Mormegil said:

But they have perverted the conservative world view (just like they perverted anything else they touched) and took it too a degree where a normie conservative (even a right one) should not follow them. 

Reminds me of this

 

[bebotalk]

Hitler was as are most fascists socially conservative. The OP is splitting hairs. There are also various strands of conservative thought but the Nazis did believe in traditional values, even if Hitler said one shouldn't be wholly wedded to the past. 

 

[Mormegil]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

A very moderate Nazi is just a friendly conservative.

This austrian dude Martin Sellner is a great example for this I think.

I was just thinking how it's a shame that religious people today need to be the boring conservatives that they are.. if they would actually follow Jesus teachings (or whoever elses) they should be cool hippies!! Every religious leader used to be liberal / progressive.

[Leo Gura]

@Yimpa Getting nearly hung has a way of sharpening one's vision 

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[OBEler]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@OBEler Why do you distinguish between right-wing and conservative?

Because right-wing is a much broader term which can include conservative.However while the Nazis operated on the far-right of the political spectrum with its authoritarian and nationalist policies, its radicalism, totalitarianism, and racial ideology place it outside the bounds of traditional conservatism.

It's essential to recognize these distinctions to understand the specific nature of Nazi ideology. That's what I try here to point out the whole time.

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, OBEler said:

Because right-wing is a much broader term which can include conservative.However while the Nazis operated on the far-right of the political spectrum with its authoritarian and nationalist policies, its radicalism, totalitarianism, and racial ideology place it outside the bounds of traditional conservatism.

It's essential to recognize these distinctions to understand the specific nature of Nazi ideology. That's what I try here to point out the whole time.

You can achieve that same result by having degrees of conservative.

There are psycho-conservatives.

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[Nemra]

The Nazis must have been angry at relativity. 

[Leo Gura]

Conservative vs liberal is actually a much deeper category than most people assume.

We could scan people's brains and determine whether they are one or the other.

[Husseinisdoingfine]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

A TRUE Christian is rarer as a hen's tooth. 

What do you mean by TRUE Christian? Mystics like Meister Eckhart?

[OBEler]

@Leo Gura while it's possible to discuss varying degrees of conservatism and liberalism, placing Nazism within this framework as merely a more extreme form of conservatism oversimplifies and misrepresents both the ideology itself and the broader spectrum of conservative thought. The fundamental differences in principles, goals, and methods necessitate distinguishing between extreme right-wing fascism and conservatism, even at its most traditional or reactionary.

[Leo Gura]

7 minutes ago, OBEler said:

The fundamental differences in principles, goals, and methods necessitate distinguishing between extreme right-wing fascism and conservatism, even at its most traditional or reactionary.

You can distinguish them, but there is an obvious pipeline from one to the other. And it works so effectively precisely because most people are not good at distinguishing the two.

It's hard to create a pipeline from leftists to Nazis. Ask yourself why.

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

What do you mean by TRUE Christian? Mystics like Meister Eckhart?

Wherever @Mormegil meant. That is his language.

[Mormegil]

@Yimpa 

The german nazis had the audacity to use footage of soccer fans as well as Rammsteins song "Deutschland" (which is ironically about their conflicted relationship to the country and why they cannot love it!) for their anti-gay propaganda! 

[Phil King]

12 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Conservative vs liberal is actually a much deeper category than most people assume.

We could scan people's brains and determine whether they are one or the other

Where does Libertarian fall on this spectrum?

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Phil King said:

Where does Libertarian fall on this spectrum?

There a right-wing and left-wing libertarians. Most American libertarians are moderately conservative, stage Orange. Most of them are very naive about how society actually works. They are like children.

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura

[OBEler]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You can distinguish them, but there is an obvious pipeline from one to the other. And it works so effectively precisely because most people are not good at distinguishing the two.

Yeah I want to distinguish them and hope others will do also. Even if there are pipelines, It's important to maintain clear distinctions between different ideologies. The Nazis were not conservatives in the traditional sense but represented a distinct, extremist form of far-right fascism.

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, OBEler said:

The Nazis were not conservatives in the traditional sense but represented a distinct, extremist form of far-right fascism.

Relative semantics.

What you call far-right fascist I call extreme conservative vs traditional conservative.

Edited March 26 by Leo Gura