Raze

Israel / Palestine News Thread

5,211 posts in this topic

@Breakingthewall The thing is that the children in Gaza live in a cult under hamas rule, and are victims to its education system that infect their minds, so their life was miserable before the war too. But it isn't right for them to be punished (even indirectly because they weren't attacked intentionally) on something they aren't responsible for.

Edited by Nivsch

🏔 Spiral dynamics can be limited, or it can be unlimited if one's development is constantly reflected in its interpretation.

 

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26 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

@Breakingthewall The thing is that the children in Gaza live in a cult under hamas rule, and are victims to its education system that infect their minds, so their life was miserable before the war too. But it isn't right for them to be punished (even indirectly because they weren't attacked intentionally) on something they aren't responsible for.

26 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Agree, it's absolutely unfair, but inevitable. The Japanese children of Hiroshima weren't responsible for their country suffering from a collective delusional psychosis, but the bomb still fell. It seems that after that, the psychosis subsided.

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1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

In my opinion, after giving it endless thought and watching thousands of videos from each side, I would say that Israel's attitude has been simply perfect.

 

Lol

You have given absolutely zero thought, and not bothered to listen to any relevant arguments. 

I know this because, your comment is full of falsehoods I debunked to you multiple times, your reasoning is the exact same you started with because you refused to engage with any of the refutations of it.

I debunked multiple things you are “concluding” and you never acknowledged my arguments and just repeated AI slop idiotically for multiple pages. There really is no point in me repeating it to you for the fifth time because,

You have 0 ethics, 0 understanding of the situation, and 0 ability to process new information. I remember when I refuted something, you would literally quote part of my comment and just ignore what I said, then repeat your same claim I refuted again in a later comment with now addressing or countering the argument I gave you.

I am starting to think you don’t even believe what you are saying.

I’ll just add, your “new” end analysis is so stupid it begs belief.

Israels future and interaction with Arab states is worse than ever. Currently their emigration, cost of living, international approval, and diplomatic isolation, is the worst it may have ever been.

Arab states which previously normalized or were in the process of doing so, are moving away and getting closer to Iran.

 

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/middle-east-watch/israels-strike-on-qatar-is-a-disaster-for-us-gulf-influence

You don’t need to take my word for it, aside from this being all over Israeli media, even Netanyahu HIMSELF said it, he admitted in public he thinks they’ll have to become “super Sparta”, ie a isolated militarized economy. Literally the prime minister of Israel himself admits it, yet you are so dense you won’t budge on your conclusions.

Again, I’m not expecting any basic reasoning or factual information to shift you, since your mind is nothing but circular reasoning to get to the same position you always have - justifying killings of Muslims. 

Edited by Raze

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@Raze

12 minutes ago, Raze said:

Lol

You have given absolutely zero thought, and not bothered to listen to any relevant arguments. 

I know this because, your comment is full of falsehoods I debunked to you multiple times, your reasoning is the exact same you started with decide you failing to engage with any of the refutations of it.

You never acknowledged my arguments and just repeated AI slop idiotically for multiple pages. There really is no point in me repeating it to you for the fifth time because,

You have 0 ethics, 0 understanding of the situation, and 0 ability to think critically. 

I’ll just add, your “new” end analysis is so stupid it begs belief.

Israels future and interaction with Arab states is worse than ever. Currently they have record high emigration, cost of living, and international isolation. 

Arab states which previously normalized or were in the process of doing so, are moving away and getting closer to Iran.

 

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/middle-east-watch/israels-strike-on-qatar-is-a-disaster-for-us-gulf-influence

You don’t need to take my word for it, aside from this being all over Israeli media, even Netanyahu HIMSELF said it, he admitted in public he hints they’ll have to become “super Sparta”, ie a isolated militarized economy. 
 

Again, I’m not expecting any basic reasoning or factual information to shift you, since your mind is nothing but circular reasoning to get to the same position you always have - justifying killings of Muslims. 

54 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Sure man. keeps watching Al Jaazera every day and believing that the West is to blame for the suffering of Islam, that paradigm of perfection and justice.

As I said, you Muslims seem like a collective vulnerable narcissist. You can't see reality; you distort everything.

I'll give you a clue to clear your mind: if you don't realize that Islam is an absolutely toxic ideology that leads to individual and collective disaster and absolute misery, you're totally lost, incapable of understanding anything.

It's as if you were psychotic. From your psychosis, you think you see clearly, but you don't. You're living in a fantasy.

Let's wait a year, we will see who's right. We will see if the Muslim countries go close Iran or maybe the regime of Iran falls. Just wait. Many millions would be very happy if the Iranian Muslim Utopia ends. 

Edited by Breakingthewall

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@Raze Lets hope for a positive answer from hamas to the deal, a perimeter around Gaza, an international force in Gaza, a different education system and a Two State solution with a perimeter seperating them in the West Bank.

Edited by Nivsch

🏔 Spiral dynamics can be limited, or it can be unlimited if one's development is constantly reflected in its interpretation.

 

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@Raze lol when someone thinks 2+2=5 I’m at the point of just agreeing these days.

@Breakingthewall  Do you only have this one dimensional view of Islam being bad or do you think theirs different ways in which it can manifest? The same way in which Christianity, Judaism / Zionism can have their own fundamentalist and distorted versions.

Also - what’s your profile pic about, is that a Hindu god?

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11 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

@Raze

Sure man. keeps watching Al Jaazera every day and believing that the West is to blame for the suffering of Islam, that paradigm of perfection and justice.

As I said, you Muslims seem like a collective vulnerable narcissist. You can't see reality; you distort everything.

I'll give you a clue to clear your mind: if you don't realize that Islam is an absolutely toxic ideology that leads to individual and collective disaster and absolute misery, you're totally lost, incapable of understanding anything.

It's as if you were psychotic. From your psychosis, you think you see clearly, but you don't. You're living in a fantasy.

 

I have read multiple Zionist pro-israel historians, and none of them say shit this stupid. 

If you actually think the issue is Islam vs Judaism, that just proves my point that you have absolutely no understanding of the conflict. This isn’t even a child’s understanding because they can at least observe new information.

I’ve already pointed out to you Palestinians lived with Jews prior to Zionism, Christian Palestinians and atheist communist Palestinians used to be disproportionately involved in armed resistance, Israeli security officials themselves admitted the cause of the resistance and it isn’t religious.

But it literally cannot penetrate your head, you are worse than the Israelis on here. Completely uninterested in understanding anything about the situation, history, or anything beyond your default assumption which never even made sense.

Edited by Raze

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1 minute ago, Nivsch said:

@Raze lets hope for a positive answer from hamas to the deal, a perimeter, an international force in Gaza, a different education system and a Two State solution with a perimeter that will seperate between them.

You can see in raze that with the Muslims reasoning is impossible. Only the force works. They will cry and blame always, the center of their psyche is blaming west. Without west islam would be a paradise. But west is the obstacle to the muslim utopia. Some of them, those who are smart, realize the delusion and abandon islam. In Iran there are millions, it's quite dramatic in many cases because they have to deal with their families 

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7 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

@Raze lets hope for a positive answer from hamas to the deal, a perimeter, an international force in Gaza, a different education system and a Two State solution with a perimeter that will seperate between them.

Question, given you say you are for the two state resolution and against child brainwashing, what international response would you support when the israeli opposition parties say they are against Palestinian state recognition and polls find extreme anti-Palestinian views among Israelis such as “no innocents in Gaza”?
(Keeping in mind you support force even at harm to civilians against Palestinians who work against two states or instill hate in children) 

Edited by Raze

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5 minutes ago, Raze said:

No, you’re just a dimwit,

I have read multiple Zionist pro-israel historians, and none of them say shit this stupid. 

If you actually think the issue is Islam vs Judaism, that just proves my point that you have absolutely no understanding of the conflict. This isn’t even a child’s understanding because they can at least observe new information.

I’ve already pointed out to you Palestinians lived with Jews prior to Zionism, Christian Palestinians and atheist communist Palestinians used to be disproportionately involved in armed resistance, Israeli security officials themselves admitted the cause of the resistance and it isn’t religious.

But it literally cannot penetrate your head, you are worse than the Israelis on here. Completely uninterested in understanding anything about the situation, history, or anything beyond your default assumption which never even made sense.

Sure man, you are right, Hamas is great, and the Iranian regime too. Everything is caused by those evil Jews, that are so horrible. Anyway, where an Arab lives better than in tel Aviv, this horrible apartheid state? Maybe in Pakistan, where raping is legal and girls are sold? Seems a paradise. Poor Palestinian in tel Aviv, working as doctors and teachers , living with freedom and able to choose their sexual orientation without being killed. Seems horrible 

Edited by Breakingthewall

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6 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Sure man, you are right, Hamas is great, and the Iranian regime too. Everything is caused by those evil Jews, that are so horrible. Anyway, where an Arab lives better than in tell Aviv, this horrible apartheid state? Maybe in Pakistan, where raping is legal and girls are sold? Seems a paradise. Poor Palestinian in tel Aviv, working as doctors and teachers , living with freedom and able to choose their sexual orientation without being killed. Seems horrible 

It’s insane I can literally tell you that you ignore arguments that go against your point,

And in the reply to “disprove” me, you literally do it again. What exactly is game here? You aren’t interested in learning or changing anyones mind, so what do you comment for?

Again here’s an argument which you will no doubt ignore, when the PLO said they supported a single binational state with equal rights for all, why did israel not agree to it since as you say they treat Palestinians in Tel Aviv so well? Instead they killed thousands in conflicts with the PLO, including facilitating mass rapes at sabra and shatila, of course it was Christian’s raping Muslims with support from Jews in that case, so I’m sure you don’t care or support it since warcrimes are only a problem to you when Muslims do it. 

I know I know, since they fight the apartheid and they’re Muslims they must be in apartheid forever and saying otherwise is brainwashing and unreasonable. But also you can’t complain about apartheid because some Palestinians in Tel Aviv aren’t under apartheid.

Edited by Raze

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8 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

You can see in raze that with the Muslims reasoning is impossible. Only the force works. They will cry and blame always, the center of their psyche is blaming west. Without west islam would be a paradise. But west is the obstacle to the muslim utopia. Some of them, those who are smart, realize the delusion and abandon islam. In Iran there are millions, it's quite dramatic in many cases because they have to deal with their families 

BJP Zio bot detected. The wrath of Kali with the barbaric head of Islam depicted in the profile picture most likely.

So many bigoted false assumptions one can’t even be arsed to begin untangling them all.

Even attempts at doing so have been responded to with zero critical thinking so no point lol

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18 minutes ago, zazen said:

Do you only have this one dimensional view of Islam being bad or do you think theirs different ways in which it can manifest? The same way in which Christianity, Judaism / Zionism can have their own fundamentalist and distorted versions.

Also - what’s your profile pic about, is that a Hindu god?

My profile pic is Kali, the goddess of destruction, that kills the falsehood. 

No, I think that islam is inherently evil. The sufis were great, over all Al Hallaj, but they weren't Muslims. They were heretic very smart who insert real mysticism in the core of a ideology of exclusion and punishment 

Btw, Al Hallaj was tortured and crucified by the Islamic authority in Iran. Paradoxical right?

Edited by Breakingthewall

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3 minutes ago, zazen said:

BJP Zio bot detected. The wrath of Kali with the barbaric head of Islam depicted in the profile picture most likely.

So many bigoted false assumptions one can’t even be arsed to begin untangling them all.

Even attempts at doing so have been responded to with zero critical thinking so no point lol

The head is not of islam, don't be more victimist that the usual in a Muslim. I exposed my view, we will see in a year who's right. Just remember this conversation. 

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@Raze try to see the world without the Muslim filter. Do it like a real experiment. I listen many Palestinian that are awake, they preach the right of the Jews to be in Israel and the peace and adaptation to Israeli way of life. They are extremely brave. Some were terrorist imprisoned, others become Christians. Extremely brave people . Samer sinijlawi for example.

Edited by Breakingthewall

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1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

The head is not of islam, don't be more victimist that the usual in a Muslim. I exposed my view, we will see in a year who's right. Just remember this conversation. 

Obviously not - but you’d love it to be as your on some crusade against “evil Islam”.

How do you explain Muslims living relatively peacefully for many centuries with Jews before hand?

Is Hindutva not an exclusionary ideology? The idea of Hindu Rashtra? What about the caste system where you have literal untouchables?

 

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6 minutes ago, zazen said:

Obviously not - but you’d love it to be as your on some crusade against “evil Islam”.

How do you explain Muslims living relatively peacefully for many centuries with Jews before hand?

Is Hindutva not an exclusionary ideology? The idea of Hindu Rashtra? What about the caste system where you have literal untouchables?

 

There has been horrible violence and injustice in every religion. The worst in Christianity. The number one sons of bitches in history. But it wasn't caused by Christianity itself. Christianity is a philosophy of love and forgiveness that points to the divine.

Islam has perhaps been more peaceful than Christianity throughout human history, but the Quran points to violence, exclusion, terror, and punishment (not to mention issues involving minors). Christianity is timeless. Islam expired in the 14th century.

Btw, a lot of Muslims are becoming christians. Did you know that? There are forums of ex Muslims very active. They have to be brave, independent spirits.

Edited by Breakingthewall

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7 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

@Raze try to see the world without the Muslim filter. Do it like a real experiment. I listen many Palestinian that are awake, they preach the right of the Jews to be in Israel and the peace and adaptation to Israeli way of life. They are extremely brave. Some were terrorist imprisoned, others become Christians. Extremely brave people . Samer sinijlawi for example.

Nice. There is a hope.


🏔 Spiral dynamics can be limited, or it can be unlimited if one's development is constantly reflected in its interpretation.

 

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@Raze The opposition parties (even part of Likud) were all for a Palestinian state before oct7 and from following them I believe they still do, but can't declare on it now as it is publicly sensitive today. Let the collective trauma cool a little bit. 

Edited by Nivsch

🏔 Spiral dynamics can be limited, or it can be unlimited if one's development is constantly reflected in its interpretation.

 

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