Israel / Palestine News Thread

[Atb210201]

2 hours ago, Lyubov said:

The thing is they are dangerous to Israel because of Israel’s colonialism and breaking the two state solution. Iran I don’t think is inherently dangerous if Israel actually sowed for peace and spent decades actually trying to normalize relations like they did with Egypt and Jordan. So yes Iran is now a huge threat to Israel but why you think that is? 

I don't think Iran believes Israel has any right over that land or any right to be a sovereign state there.

Here we even have countdown billboards in some places that count the days to the annihilation of Israel according to what the supreme leader of Iran said years ago.

Edited October 2, 2024 by Atb210201

[Lyubov]

1 hour ago, Nivsch said:

Because this regime's ideology and set of values from them Israel seen to him as a total stranger that contradicts their religous perception for the region. At a similar way to ISIS that everyone who aren't soonies stand in the way of their religious vision.

Israel didn’t exist until the 1940s and before that it was a colonial refugee camp backed by the British Empire. It’s Europeans who kinda have distant ancestors that lived there over 800 years ago. Israel is the one ethnically cleansing the region of the natives. 

[Nivsch]

4 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

Israel didn’t exist until the 1940s and before that it was a colonial refugee camp backed by the British Empire. It’s Europeans who kinda have distant ancestors that lived there over 800 years ago. Israel is the one ethnically cleansing the region of the natives. 

Jews lived here for Millenia and than deportated to an another Millenia and a half.

Edited October 2, 2024 by Nivsch

[Raze]

31 minutes ago, hundreth said:

It does seem like only a matter of time until Iran eventually does get nuclear weapons. It seems Netanyahu and some higher up U.S. officials are pushing for regime change in Iran. This is what I think they are banking on. If they can delay nukes until a new regime is in place, it may not be as looming of a threat.

Do I think this will work? Not really. We've seen what regime change entails. Rarely does it end well.

It’s only a matter of time because both Israel and the US are constantly threatening them. Iran has offered to remove their ability to make nukes multiple times and been rebuffed. It’s insane to frame Iran as crazy when everyone can see what the US does to countries that don’t have nukes like Iraq or Libya. 

[Lyubov]

Iran is easily contained. I don’t deny states with resources and fundamentalist worldviews tend to turn towards conquest. I’m not trying to pain Iran as some saint that is above what Israel is doing. But that doesn’t excuse Israel and their constant undermining. It’s difficult to even argue in Israel’s favor except for the fact of creating a huge humanitarian crisis by moving all those people. And Israelis think Gaza is supposed to move all those people to Europe and other Arab countries. Insane what these people believe.

[PurpleTree]

3 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Jews lived here for Millenia and than deportated to an another Millenia and a half.

Christians lived there for Millennia too and originated there. They could also claim it.

[Lyubov]

6 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Jews lived here for Millenia and than deportated to an another Millenia and a half.

Jews were a minority there for hundreds upon hundreds of years. You have more in common genetically with Eastern Europeans than the Jews that lived in Palestine. You have a fairytale from the Torah called the kingdom of Israel and it existed in 1000 BCE. Just because you kinda sorta have some folks who share your religion living as a minority there doesn’t mean you can invite everyone from Europe over to displace the locals who have lived there for hundreds of years and build a make believe country. 

Edited October 2, 2024 by Lyubov

[Raze]

Removing Jews from Israel now would be the same as when they removed Palestinians, it’s just wrong to evict people based on race. 

[Lyubov]

I’m sorry it was longer ago than 800 years ago. Jews haven’t actually ruled that land since BCE. It’s been contested and been through all sorts of conquests since and it’s the most ridiculous fairytale to claim that somehow it’s your land. The people there have twisted the most ridiculous story and they really have convinced half the world that they were natives there. Not even close by any measure of the standard that we use to define ethnic groups and natives to lands. 

[PurpleTree]

5 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

 doesn’t mean you can 

Well they did though.

 

[Lyubov]

Just now, PurpleTree said:

Well they did though.

 

And thus we have forever wars now there

[Nivsch]

14 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

Jews were a minority there for hundreds upon hundreds of years. You have more in common genetically with Eastern Europeans than the Jews that lived in Palestine. You have a fairytale from the Torah called the kingdom of Israel and it existed in 1000 BCE. Just because you kinda sorta have some folks who share your religion living as a minority there doesn’t mean you can invite everyone from Europe over to displace the locals who have lived there for hundreds of years and build a make believe country. 

Jews were majority for many centuries before became minority.

Edited October 2, 2024 by Nivsch

[Lyubov]

2 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

This is wrong. They were majority for many centuries before became minority.

The last time Jews had any majority in that region was before the Roman Empire. That’s literally how ridiculous your fairytale is for the existence of your country. 

[hundreth]

23 minutes ago, Raze said:

It’s only a matter of time because both Israel and the US are constantly threatening them. Iran has offered to remove their ability to make nukes multiple times and been rebuffed. It’s insane to frame Iran as crazy when everyone can see what the US does to countries that don’t have nukes like Iraq or Libya. 

Two things can be true at once. Iran is crazy and the west's strategy might not be rational. 

[zazen]

Yeah, thinking that Israel is no longer going to exist is just as dangerous, delusion and unethical from the present moment of today as is the version of Zionism that dehumanises, denies and destroys Palestinian life and statehood.

It’s pretty disgusting seeing some of the comments from more pro-Palestinian social media of how Iran shouldn’t have stopped last night and go for another round etc. Revelling in revenge.

[Nivsch]

10 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

The last time Jews had any majority in that region was before the Roman Empire. That’s literally how ridiculous your fairytale is for the existence of your country. 

The fact you respond so cynically only strenghtening my point. You overlook half of the equation. I can also say that most of the Palesinians who live here are offsprings of work immigrants who came here only decades before Israel, but I choose to not dismiss the Palestinians roots here.

Edited October 2, 2024 by Nivsch

[hundreth]

11 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

The last time Jews had any majority in that region was before the Roman Empire. That’s literally how ridiculous your fairytale is for the existence of your country. 

 

The last time Jews had a majority in that region is now. It's not a fairytale if it's real.

Now we have to live with that reality and find the best path forward instead of continuously litigating the past.

[Lyubov]

32 minutes ago, Raze said:

It’s only a matter of time because both Israel and the US are constantly threatening them. Iran has offered to remove their ability to make nukes multiple times and been rebuffed. It’s insane to frame Iran as crazy when everyone can see what the US does to countries that don’t have nukes like Iraq or Libya. 

I’m not validating your fairytale lies. It is unequivocally false that Israel existed before the 1940s and was created off a fairytale and out of pity due to WWII. Truman signed it into existence cause he wanted a strategic outpost for the USA in the Middle East and he felt bad about what happened to the Jews during WWII. It was Ottoman Empire Muslim territory which had Arab natives living there as a majority since after the Roman Empire for over a thousand years ago. The people you base your fairytale on are not remotely close to or would be understood as the people who live in Israel today (Europeans). The only reason I believe your country should stay is because it would be wrong to move Israel citizens. But it’s time your country to recognize you are thieves, all settlements must be disbanded. And Israel needs to be brought to the peace table by cutting defense funding for the country. Any territory not deemed crucially strategic to Israel survival must be returned. 

[Lyubov]

14 minutes ago, hundreth said:

 

The last time Jews had a majority in that region is now. It's not a fairytale if it's real.

Now we have to live with that reality and find the best path forward instead of continuously litigating the past.

This is true. Jews now have a majority there. Through stolen land and colonialism. What to do about it? I have no clue. 

[Lyubov]

16 minutes ago, hundreth said:

 

The last time Jews had a majority in that region is now. It's not a fairytale if it's real.

Now we have to live with that reality and find the best path forward instead of continuously litigating the past.

I do agree we shouldn’t keep digging into the past but the entire existence of Israel is based on a fairytale about some promised land from the past. It would be one thing if Israel recognized the majority of their land is stolen and that could open up a dialogue to address the present issue. But Israel actively justifies and spins a fairytale to actively justify they stole almost their entire country. How can you ever forge an agreement with such liars? It’s not possible to make agreement with liars.