New War In Israel / Gaza

[zazen]

1 hour ago, Nivsch said:

@Raze I am for it but they got countless offers to have a state and refused.

 

[Danioover9000]

@zazen

4 minutes ago, zazen said:

 

   Very brave journalist. Even if someone isn't a body language expert, the mood in the room and their faces when he's talking says it all.

[Danioover9000]

If true, it looks bad:

 

[Nivsch]

@zazen That's why the offers said "with area exchanges" to provide them still the area that is as big as 67' lines just different (then no need to evacuate the settlements) so Gideon Levi doesn't prove anything here.

By the way he is roughly the most radical journalist in Israel. Not sure if his statements are reliable enough. Has to be taken with a grain of salt.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Nivsch

[Danioover9000]

   Another punchy video by him:

 

[Karmadhi]

@Danioover9000 Thanks for sharing. Amaizing video.

I would add one more layer of western disgusting hypocrisy

Today Ukraine launched an attack on civilians killing around 20 people in Russia.

Western leaders said it was Russia s fault for starting the illegal occupation of Ukraine.

Fair enough.

But when Hamas launches a similar attack on civilians in response to Israeli s illegal occupation of Southern Palestine, they are labeled as terrorists.

Ukraine attack on civilians today is not.

Disgusting double standards

Edited December 31, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Karmadhi]

46 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

That's why the offers said "with area exchanges" to provide them still the area that is as big as 67' lines just different (then no need to evacuate the settlements) so Gideon Levi doesn't prove anything here.

1947 borders are the real ones, anything else is purely stolen land. The UN decided to create Israel under the 1947 borders

[Nivsch]

@Karmadhi Yes but the Arab started the war because they didn't accept those borders. What proves to us - they are not satisfied even with 48' borders!

Edited December 31, 2023 by Nivsch

[kenway]

The full 84-page application to the registrar of the International Court of Justice by the government of South Africa:-

https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192/192-20231228-app-01-00-en.pdf

Very damning.

[kenway]

It's such a massive document it's almost impossible to digest but it's crammed with damning paragraphs:-

 

"29. The Commission found that there were reasonable grounds to believe that Israeli snipers “intentionally shot” children, knowing them to be children,114 and they also “intentionally shot” health workers and journalists “despite seeing that they were clearly marked as such”.115 It further found “reasonable grounds to believe” that Israeli snipers shot disabled demonstrators “intentionally, despite seeing that they had visible disabilities” and despite them not presenting an imminent threat."

"629. Taking into account the weapons used, and in particular the use of white phosphorous in and around a hospital that the Israeli armed forces knew was not only dealing with scores of injured and wounded but also giving shelter to several hundred civilians, the Mission finds, based on all the information available to it, that in directly striking the hospital and the ambulance depot the Israeli armed forces in these circumstances violated article 18 of the Fourth Geneva Convention and violated customary international law in relation to proportionality. . . ."

"114. Israel has engaged in and failed to prevent or to punish acts and measures which are genocidal, constituting flagrant violations of Israel’s obligations under Articles I, III (a), III (b), III (c), III (d), III (e), IV, V and VI of the Genocide Convention. As further evidenced in the materials set out in the application, the acts of genocide in question in breach of Articles II (a), II (b), II (c) and II (d), in particular, that collectively target the Palestinians in Gaza include, inter alia: (1) killing Palestinians in Gaza, including a large proportion of women and children — estimated to account for around 70 per cent of the more than 21,110 fatalities — some of whom appear to have been summarily executed;

(2) causing serious mental and bodily harm to Palestinians in Gaza, including through maiming, psychological trauma, and inhuman and degrading treatment;

(3) causing the forced evacuation and displacement of around 85 per cent of Palestinians in Gaza — including children, the elderly and infirm, and the sick and wounded — as well as causing the large scale destruction of Palestinian homes, villages, refugee camps, towns and entire areas in Gaza, precluding the return of a significant proportion of the Palestinian people to their homes;

(4) causing widespread hunger, dehydration and starvation to besieged Palestinians in Gaza, through the impeding of sufficient humanitarian assistance, the cutting off of sufficient water, food, fuel and electricity, and the destruction of bakeries, mills, agricultural lands and other methods of production and sustenance;

(5) failing to provide and restricting the provision of adequate shelter, clothes, hygiene or sanitation to Palestinians in Gaza, including the 1.9 million internally displaced people, compelled by Israel’s actions to live in dangerous situations of squalor, alongside the routine targeting and destruction of places of shelter and the killing and wounding of those sheltering, including women, children, the disabled and the elderly;

(6) failing to provide for or to ensure the provision for the medical needs of Palestinians in Gaza, including those medical needs created by other genocidal acts causing serious bodily harm, including through directly attacking Palestinian hospitals, ambulances and other healthcare facilities in Gaza, killing Palestinian doctors, medics and nurses, including the most qualified medics in Gaza, and destroying and disabling Gaza’s medical system; and

(7) destroying Palestinian life in Gaza, through the destruction of Gaza’s universities, schools, courts, public buildings, public records, stores, libraries, churches, mosques, roads, infrastructure, utilities and other facilities necessary to the sustained life of Palestinians in Gaza as a group, alongside the killing of entire family groups — erasing entire oral histories in Gaza — and the killing of prominent and distinguished members of society.

(8) Imposing measures intended to prevent Palestinian births in Gaza, through the reproductive violence inflicted on Palestinian women, newborn babies, infants, and children."

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2023 by kenway

[Nivsch]

1. "Reasonable reason to believe..." wow. What a proof.

2. "Causing physcial and mental harm". Yes. This is war.

3. "Causing force evacuation and diaplacement." Yes. Whem hamas stick itself to them in super glue.

4. "Failing to provide shelter and medical needs". So now Israel is responisble to 2 millions people's health care too?

5. "Destroying palestinians life in Gaza" what a scientific claim. Yes people life are being destroyed on both sides. Including tens of thousands of young Israeli guys in their 20s and 30s who are now sacrifice their life in the almost or even most dangerous war zone in the world.

6. The only country who is never allowed to win a war, even in far better conditions - Israel.

[kenway]

4 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

1. "Reasonable reason to believe..." wow. What a proof.

2. "Causing physcial and mental harm". Yes. This is war.

3. "Causing force evacuation and diaplacement." Yes. Whem hamas stick itself to them in super glue.

4. "Failing to provide shelter and medical needs". So now Israel is responisble to 2 millions people's health care too?

5. "Destroying palestinians life in Gaza" what a scientific claim. Yes people life are being destroyed on both sides. Including tens of thousands of young Israeli guys in their 20s and 30s who are now sacrifice their life in the almost or even most dangerous war zone in the world.

6. The only country who is never allowed to win a war, even in far better conditions - Israel.

 

You're playing a very dangerous and stupid game. If successfully prosecuted then you would be effectively defending war crimes, ethnic cleansing and genocide.

It's funny - because I kind of suspected that me posting isolated snippets of the application would result in this response, so I recommend you read more of the actual document itself.

[kenway]

Relevant:-

As a historian who has researched and studied genocide in places like Indonesia and Timor Leste, I am deeply aware of the difficulties of determining when it seems clear that genocidal violence is unfolding. The Israeli annihilation of Gaza clearly meets that threshold.

In most genocides there is an information vacuum, and details trickle out because of the difficulties of reporting in real time and placing events in context. Even in well publicized genocides - Rwanda, Bosnia - reporters and diplomats were behind the curve in grasping events.

In East Timor and Indonesia, which I have studied well, a handful of voices characterized what was happening at the time as genocide (or politicide), but it took months or years before the international or scholarly community would generally acknowledge this.

The Israeli annihilation of Gaza may be the first episode in history of genocide unfolding in real time, in full view of the world, with the perpetrators proudly announcing their intentions every day, and other governments proudly trumpeting their participation.

The South African petition to the international criminal court will expose the total bankruptcy of international law, since the most powerful country in the history of the world is an open accomplice and has already announced that the perpetrators will get away with it.

~ Bradley Simpson
https://twitter.com/bradleyrsimpson/status/1741290160677867885

[Nivsch]

@kenway You are DECIDING that i am doing x or y because it fits you agenda.

No.

What I am doing is just what I wrote and for the raw words I wrote only for them I am responsible. 

The way you are interpreting my words is a totally different story.

But if you want to play the game of interpretations, then I feel behind your words that you are highly uncomfortable with my claims.

Maybe because it treaten your agenda to hear that 10,000s of Israeli young guys are also put their life on a stake right now fighting agaisnt hamas in thd horror land of traps and explosive charges all over and for two months now.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Nivsch

[kenway]

8 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

@kenway You are DECIDING that i am doing x or y because it fits you agenda.

No.

What I am doing is just what I wrote and for the raw words I wrote only for them I am responsible. 

The way you are interpreting my words is a totally different story.

But if you want to play the game of interpretations, then I feel behind your words that you are highly uncomfortable with my claims.

Maybe because it treaten your agenda to hear that 10,000s of Israeli young guys are also put their life on a stake right now and for months now.

 

Firstly, my only agenda is nothing other than basic empathy. It's not complicated.

Secondly, I'm not DECIDING anything in relation to your x y z thoughts in contrast to basic empathy. You DECIDED to respond to my post, which specifically relates to an 84 page application to the ICJ from an entire country - specifically South Africa.

I am not uncomfortable with any of your claims because what you are saying is 1) totally biased, 2) totally ridiculous and 3) totally in conflict with the overwhelming population of the planet, not least the representatives of the United Nations, who are consistently vetoed by agents that don't represent the spirit of ordinary people.

And in regards to the "10,000 of young Israeli IDF who are risking their lives in order to carry out such warcrimes", my advice is to simply stop doing that.

There are plenty of avenues for conscientious objection in Israel - there's an entire film dedicated to it.

[Vrubel]

3 minutes ago, kenway said:

South Africa

An insanely corrupt and dysfunctional country 

[Nivsch]

@kenway The discussion here is much more biased than I am.

I am at least admit mistakes and not totally demonizing the other side with childish claims based on cherry picking of the top 0.01% most extremist journalists.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Nivsch

[kenway]

8000 dead children.

60%-80% civilian to combatant ratio.

1.5 million people homeless.

 

You're defending genocide. STOP.

 

 

[Nivsch]

@kenway

1400 people died.

10,000s young guys sacrifice their lives for ~60 days in most dangerous and dense war zone in the world might die at any moment.

240 (now 130) hostages suffering ×100 more than any Gazan, for 86 days with a gun to their head can be executed at any moment.

100,000s displaced people in Israel.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Nivsch

[Vrubel]

@kenway It's not a genocide but it is something Hamas begged for on 7/10.

Copy-Paste* Consider that the alternative of Hamas staying in power in Gaza is worse than having this war. As destructive as this war is it will give the Palestinians a chance to obtain a healthy government that does not dehumanize them but looks after their basic needs and interests.   

Edited December 31, 2023 by Vrubel