The Logic Behind the Mechanism of Self-Inquiry

[Preetom]

A question might arise why self-inquiry is the way that it is and not something else. Why is it particularly about awareness being aware of itself without conjuring up other things?

We can be clear about it if we ask, ''what is it that knows anything at all?''. It's ONLY Awareness that can know. It is NOT a thought, a model, a body, a brain, a sensation, a scientific theory, a complex logical argument, a spiritual belief etc that has the knowing capacity; Only Awareness possesses this knowing capacity. In fact, the very word 'Awareness' means presence of That which is aware or which is pure knowing itself.

So if Enlightenment is discovering the nature of Awareness, what can we rely on? ONLY Awareness can provide 'knowledge' about anything. That's why Awareness has to lock on itself to know itself for what it actually is; not what it imagines it to be. It's the thoughts and sensations that imagine Awareness to be what it is not. And during self-inquiry, we are seeing through that error exactly, over and over again.

Remember this point everytime you start getting lost in thoughts and clever arguments. Another corollary to this principle is, take your stand as Awareness to explore yourself in self-inquiry. It's not the body that knows, it's not the thoughts that know; it's ONLY Awareness that can know and all the above mentioned objects themselves are 'known' by Awareness. This is exactly why no thought or model or 'thing' can ever reveal the TRUTH of Awareness; they can only conjure their own judgments, opinions and limitations on Awareness.

It may sound so obvious when formulated like this but notice how many times we circle around the most common traps. See how this contemplation and line of reasoning melts all the gross and subtle identification with forms over time... 

Edited December 24, 2018 by Preetom

[seeking_brilliance]

It is very helpful. I'm beginning to see why a quiet mind is so crucial for self inquiry, because inquiry seems to be the simplest thing to 'do', but if the mind doesn't SHUT UP there is too much awareness on the story and not on awareness itself. In my awareness, there are endless trains of thoughts that won't shut the hell up and get out of the way.  But I can't do anything about it but accept it. Oh well....

[SoonHei]

@Preetom thanks that was nice

Not trying to take that as more content

But the mechanism is nicely explained there

 

 

I like to think of it this way also,

When listening to a song, a song you know...

The part of you which knows what's coming next. The part of you who knows the memory of what's to come (not the memory, but the knowing of it) ... That KNOWING is the true self. It can't be pin pointed cuz it will slip away the moment you try to pin it.. it will go meta to that action. Always. 

[Hellspeed]

12 hours ago, Preetom said:

A question might arise why self-inquiry is the way that it is and not something else. Why is it particularly about awareness being aware of itself without conjuring up other things?

We can be clear about it if we ask, ''what is it that knows anything at all?''. It's ONLY Awareness that can know. It is NOT a thought, a model, a body, a brain, a sensation, a scientific theory, a complex logical argument, a spiritual belief etc that has the knowing capacity; Only Awareness possesses this knowing capacity. In fact, the very word 'Awareness' means presence of That which is aware or which is knowing itself.

So if Enlightenment is discovering the nature of Awareness, what can we rely on? ONLY Awareness can provide 'knowledge' about anything. That's why Awareness has to lock on itself to know itself for what it actually is; not what it imagines it to be. It's the thoughts and sensations that imagine Awareness to be what it is not. And during self-inquiry, we are seeing through that error exactly, over and over again.

Remember this point everytime you start getting lost in thoughts and clever arguments. Another corollary to this principle is, take your stand as Awareness to explore yourself in self-inquiry. It's not the body that knows, it's not the thoughts that know; it's ONLY Awareness that can know and all the above mentioned objects themselves are 'known' by Awareness. This is exactly why no thought or model or 'thing' can ever reveal the TRUTH of Awareness; they can only conjure their own judgments, opinions and limitations on Awareness.

It may sound so obvious when formulated like this but notice how many times we circle around the most common traps. See how this contemplation and line of reasoning melts all the gross and subtle identification with forms over time... 

No body/mind, no awareness . What are you talking about?  Self inquiry is a method of the mind. We rely on Breath, the focussed attention, the EGO into Breath, there no more about this. Conceptualizing outside of the body are just concepts, is not real. 

[Preetom]

@seeking_brilliance

No point in beating yourself up. During mind attacks, you can deliberately try neti neti which I found helpful.

Consciously watch your thoughts and label them as 'known', while 'you' remain aware of both that thought and labeling. No need to suppress the thoughts, just see the relationship of yourself with thoughts, which is You Awareness is untouched and unaffected by thoughts. That is dis-identicafcation developing...

@SoonHei Exactly! Actually that 'knowing' part of any experience IS the infinite Self

3 hours ago, Hellspeed said:

No body/mind, no awareness . What are you talking about?

This right here is the very heart of ignorance. Why do you automatically superimpose body-mind's limitations on Awareness? It's a thought that is conceptualizing changing mental states as the changing of Awareness.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Preetom

[ground]

Might also be called 'lucid emptiness that knows itself'. Actually every individual 'experiences' this state innumerable times on the fly, in different situations  but without registering it. Consequently there are also innumerable methods to 'get into it'. So that state is nothing special. It is natural. Special however is the challenge to integrate this state into daily life as 'vision' or 'contemplation' without slipping out of it.

[Preetom]

52 minutes ago, ground said:

Might also be called 'lucid emptiness that knows itself'. Actually every individual 'experiences' this state innumerable times on the fly, in different situations  but without registering it. Consequently there are also innumerable methods to 'get into it'. So that state is nothing special. It is natural. Special however is the challenge to integrate this state into daily life as 'vision' or 'contemplation' without slipping out of it.

exactly!

It's like when we watch a movie, we are looking at nothing but the screen. When we are told to notice the screen, no extraordinary event takes place. We were always looking at the screen, yet it seems so elusive 

[Sashaj]

How do you know this is the best way to practice self inquiry?

I think it would be better to let others go through the same maze using their own map otherwise you are just pre loading a concept into their minds in the hope that they will adopt the same concept when they get to the same question. A completely different answer may be just as beneficial ?

 

just a big thought bubble from me; no idea if it would work in practice

Edited December 24, 2018 by Sashaj

[Preetom]

22 minutes ago, Sashaj said:

How do you know this is the best way to practice self inquiry?

I think it would be better to let others go through the same maze using their own map otherwise you are just pre loading a concept into their minds in the hope that they will adopt the same concept when they get to the same question. A completely different answer may be just as beneficial ?

 

just a big thought bubble from me; no idea if it would work in practice

Whatever little question/strategy/formula you take, the purpose of self-inquiry is to take one to that stage of Awareness being aware of itself and staying there more and more with stable focus.

The questions, timing, discrimination process may and will vary from person to person. I ain't feeding anyone shit here 

Edited December 24, 2018 by Preetom

[purerogue]

15 minutes ago, Sashaj said:

How do you know this is the best way to practice self inquiry?

I think it would be better to let others go through the same maze using their own map otherwise you are just pre loading a concept into their minds in the hope that they will adopt the same concept when they get to the same question. A completely different answer may be just as beneficial ?

 

just a big thought bubble from me; no idea if it would work in practice

They will have to go trough their own maze anyway, but I think Leo last video was quite good to speed up process and to know how to get there, because even though you might come in  contact in different ways, it will be difficult for you to get back to that state and maintain it without technique like one he was giving in video. 

[tsuki]

27 minutes ago, Sashaj said:

I think it would be better to let others go through the same maze using their own map otherwise you are just pre loading a concept into their minds in the hope that they will adopt the same concept when they get to the same question. A completely different answer may be just as beneficial ?

That's a good point and I thought that as well for a very long time.
I think that the key observation is that we take the understanding of language for granted, and it is not such a simple matter.
After all - in order to understand what @Preetom says, one has to go through some of 'the path' and relate his knowledge to what Preetom wrote.
The important bit is 'relating his knowledge', or 'careful consideration'. Without it - it will become just another belief.

So - even if Preetom presents knowledge, this knowledge has to be understood.

Edited December 24, 2018 by tsuki

[Sashaj]

1 minute ago, Preetom said:

Whatever little question/strategy/formula you take, the purpose of self-inquiry is to take one to that stage of Awareness being aware of itself and staying there more and more with stable focus.

The questions, timing, discrimination process may and will vary from person to person. I ain't feeding anyone shit here 

I sense you have felt like my question was an interrogation. It wasn’t. I am asking questions very directly to drill out all doubt wherever it lurks in you and in myself, please don’t confuse this for adversarial behaviour. Thanks

[Sashaj]

4 minutes ago, tsuki said:

That's a good point and I thought that as well for a very long time.
I think that the key observation is that we take the understanding of language for granted, and it is not such a simple matter.
After all - in order to understand what @Preetom says, one has to go through some of 'the path' and relate his knowledge to what Preetom wrote.
The important bit is 'relating his knowledge', or 'careful consideration'. Without it - it will become just another belief.

So - even if Preetom presents knowledge, this knowledge has to be understood.

Yeah, that’s clearer language than I am capable of, thanks for clarifying 

[Preetom]

@Sashaj @tsuki

I understand your concerns. We pretty much all know that no 'practice' can lead to Enlightenment, yet we must play this game called self-inquiry to realize that.

Self-inquiry is a 'game' and so one should play it by the rules. Or else, as Leo mentioned in the video, people can waste a lot of time and effort doing stuff technically wrong and then giving it all up and Worse, starting a crusade against the game.

To make this game called self-inquiry effective, you must start with experience; not with a belief or assumption(however grand that scientific or spiritual belief is). That premise is acknowledging the supremacy and irreducible nature of Awareness. 

It's not a phenomena that knows, it is ONLY Awareness that knows. And the very purpose of self-inquiry is to harness this discrimination process over and over again.

One's attitude while doing self-inquiry should not be like, ''I , this body-mind named such and such is now gonna practice self-inquiry''; that person will get lost in all sorts of thoughts and delusion.

One's attitude should be like, ''I, Awareness am the only knowing element here and I'm gonna explore my experience through self-inquiry now WITHOUT referring to thoughts and beliefs as they are clearly not the knowing element here''.

One can easily waste tons of hours doing spiritual practices in the wrong manner. That's why most gurus of the direct path pop the cherry from beginning and instruct students to sit in meditation as Awareness; not as a body-mind with a personal history.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Preetom

[tsuki]

I don't have any concerns, I was clarifying the question that @Sashaj asked.

[Preetom]

@tsuki @Sashaj

And knowing all this, we will still fall into traps and circle in the maze as @purerogue mentioned. It is inevitable and part of learning this game.

But I was talking about building this infallible premise where one can come back over and over again, no matter how many times he is lost in the maze. Hope that made sense 

Edited December 24, 2018 by Preetom

[Preetom]

3 minutes ago, tsuki said:

I don't have any concerns, I was clarifying the question that @Sashaj asked.

If you think about it, there is actually no way to verify if we are EVER on the same ground when communicating through language. We pretend that we are..

freaky stuff indeed...

[tsuki]

3 minutes ago, Preetom said:

If you think about it, there is actually no way to verify if we are EVER on the same ground when communicating through language. We pretend that we are..

Funny that we can always immediately tell that we're not on the same page though .

[Preetom]

4 minutes ago, tsuki said:

Funny that we can always immediately tell that we're not on the same page though .

Other times, it's just that we might be executing that pretending act better 

[Hellspeed]

@Preetom  Are you awakened? I speak from that perspective. You speak from a perspective of the EGO. Apparently you confusing awarness. Anything in existance is aware at some level, the basic level, the fractal level, but the human body is the cherry on the cake of awarness. The enlightenend human being can be more aware than any living animal on earth. 

Edited December 24, 2018 by Hellspeed