Owen Cook & Marczell Klein Free Tour NYC Notes 9/26/25 - 9/28/25

[Twentyfirst]

Some teachers you are meant to just absorb their free content, binge it for some time, do the practices, share the videos with others, and then move on

Some teachers you go deep in their paid stuff and communicate and spend longer times with and take more seriously

It's not hard to know the difference 

[Jacob Morres]

good notes, theyre critical. just remember though, all (all) the value comes from theory -> practice -> iteration 

Edited October 7 by Jacob Morres

[Leo Gura]

11 hours ago, Cocolove said:

I honestly think he is yellow. Over the past couple years I've been going to his events. He basically uses orange stuff as part of his heavy handed marketing to meet people where they are at. But a lot of the speeches that he doesn't even post over the past few years are incredibly high level, it is very clear he is far above orange and green. He still has some blue and orange bits, but I think he is very integrated yellow. This comes from deeply studying spiral dynamics, ken wilber, susanne-cookgreauter, etc etc. It's in the way Owen thinks, not just some yellow posing. Also his buddy Sid who speaks at his events does 10 day meditation retreats al the time. Owen just has some holdups in blue because he has seen green censor his content, and in orange from addiction to his sex life and traveling. But overall that really is not much of him and I see him related to those parts of himself in a much more yellow way.

I don't buy it. He is still clearly hung up on Orange. Yes, his cognition is Tier 2, but he has strange Orange fixations.

Imagine how advanced he would be if he transcended the marketing stuff, sales stuff, pickup stuff, chasing status and luxury, Christianity, and regressive politics.

His politics scream Orange fixation.

He is a good example of how pickup will hold the mind back from full mature Tier 2 development. He's just too attached to pickup, which is inherently a low activity.

11 hours ago, Cocolove said:

Definetely still agree with a lot of this.

As far as psychedelics. What he says about personal growth and not needing psychedelics is actually pretty good. It's not a shallow perspective, but he talks about how to get the same experience from life itself.

No amount of life experience equals psychedelics. Psychedelics are orthogonal to life. He is too closedminded about them.

Edited October 7 by Leo Gura

[SimpleGuy]

11 hours ago, Cocolove said:

One final thing about sales. I do think there is value to using sales tactics when you really believe in something. If Leo used a bit more of sales and marketing for his life purpose course, thousands of people would have better lives and impacts on the world that just needed a bit of limiting-belief-busting-objection-handling, energetic state pumping to buy it. I personally felt foolish buying anything like it and waited like 6 months to finally buy it, and might not of if I wasn't such a fanboy. 

 

Also if anyone wants my extensive notes from the NYC freetour DM me. a bit of personal stuff mixed in so not gonna post here but I got a lot out of it.

 

I have been very sketpical about Owen for years but the more I learn from him the more I see there is incredible value in his work, its indispensible for life purpose and social life.

Sales tactics are basically manipulation. Some are more aggressive, some less. But would you be happy if you would be helping homeless animals thinking that you are doing great job, and then discovering that, actually, you were helping not animals but homeless people. I know that for most people would be good too, but for me I would constantly feel that I was tricked somewhere.

[nerdspeak]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I don't buy it. He is still clearly hung up on Orange. Yes, his cognition is Tier 2, but he has strange Orange fixations.

Imagine how advanced he would be if he transcended the marketing stuff, sales stuff, pickup stuff, chasing status and luxury, Christianity, and regressive politics.

His politics scream Orange fixation.

He is a good example of how pickup will hold the mind back from full mature Tier 2 development. He's just too attached to pickup, which is inherently a low activity.

No amount of life experience equals psychedelics. Psychedelics are orthogonal to life. He is too closedminded about them.

Do you have a theory about why he’s still so obsessed with pickup after all this time? With me, at a certain point it was enough. Did it take fifteen years and culminate in me running around post-Soviet countries dating up to ten women at once? Yes. Am I proud of it? No. Did I finally burn off the obsession at a certain point? Yes.

That said, I did psychedelic-assisted therapy, and started to see how my behavior was hurting the women I was seeing. Maybe without the psychedelics I would still be caught up in it. But he’s self-aware enough that he should be able to get beyond this absurd addiction. 

All of the discussion about whether there’s an ethical way to do pickup or whatever is sort of besides the point. The pickup mindset where you’re trying to maximize volume of experiences just gets boring and stressful beyond a certain point, and you just want to find one (or two or three) people with similar values that you collaborate with instead of chasing the rush of sex with new people all the time. 

Edited October 7 by nerdspeak

[Leo Gura]

44 minutes ago, nerdspeak said:

Do you have a theory about why he’s still so obsessed with pickup after all this time?

He made it his life purpose. He placed all his chips on that game. It gives him enormous meaning, ego-thrill, and I guess he just loves being out and being social. He loves the power it gives him. It feeds his ego a lot. He might have a sex addiction.

You gotta wonder, what else is there for him to do? It would be painful for him to do something totally different.

Serious pickup guys tend to have exceptionally high sex drives. They are basically consumed by sex. Otherwise there's be no point in it. Or they are extremely social. They feed off the socializing.

Edited October 7 by Leo Gura

[AION]

@Leo Gura he is a good little Christian though because he wears his cross all the time 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, AION said:

@Leo Gura he is a good little Christian though because he wears his cross all the time 

Another example of corruption.

But I don't want to judge him. He is helping many Orange guys develop so that deserves credit.

When I speak about Owen it's from a very high level. Most people don't need to hear my critiques of him.

You gotta take the good from people.

Edited October 7 by Leo Gura

[Terell Kirby]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You gotta take the good from people.

If it's one thing Owen taught me about attraction- is that social skills trumps limitations we place on ourselves from our physical appearance.

I can recall when I first started watching his content, it was mind blowing. His insights stick with me to this day.

Edited October 8 by Terell Kirby

[AION]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Another example of corruption.

But I don't want to judge him. He is helping many Orange guys develop so that deserves credit.

When I speak about Owen it's from a very high level. Most people don't need to hear my critiques of him.

You gotta take the good from people.

I think the same about Andrew Tate. If you go to his Instagram and listen to his reels. 80-90% is about motivating men to take action aka get into SD orange. Only small % of his attention goes to toxicity, woman hate, and political stuff. And he talks in a way that is very captivating because he is a hussler. Greatness comes from people who integrated the devil as Nietzsche said. I’m paraphrasing here. 

[Leo Gura]

17 minutes ago, AION said:

I think the same about Andrew Tate. If you go to his Instagram and listen to his reels. 80-90% is about motivating men to take action aka get into SD orange. Only small % of his attention goes to toxicity, woman hate, and political stuff. And he talks in a way that is very captivating because he is a hussler. Greatness comes from people who integrated the devil as Nietzsche said. I’m paraphrasing here. 

Tate is way more toxic than Owen.

Tate just called for a civil war. Tate is gross and Tate will absolutely corrupt young mens' minds. Owen's content is nothing like that.

Edited October 8 by Leo Gura

[AION]

@Leo Gura he didn’t call for a civil war. He said a civil war might happen if the divide between the left and right becomes bigger which is true. Neither side is going to buckle. 

[Leo Gura]

Tate is an idiot compared to Owen.

[nerdspeak]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Tate is an idiot compared to Owen.

I watched the first ten minutes of Owen’s recent “Society has gone feral” video. It’s pretty extreme. It’s still structured in a problem-agitate-solve framework (the solution is to buy his bootcamp) but the “problems” he claims are real and then agitates are basically straight from online incel/men’s rights ideology.

It’s not the same Owen from 2011, it is way more extreme. 

Society is more polarized now, so could say he’s adapting to his market lol but I think it’s pretty irresponsible to validate red pill ideology like that, even if it helps him sell more.

That said, even in 2011, this was always a big problem with him. At least half of what he said even then was designed to make guys feel insecure and paranoid to put them in a buying state. 

You might say, what can you really expect from an influencer—it’s a funnel to sell high-ticket coaching, he’ll say anything to make the funnel work better. But there was a time when I took him seriously so it’s disappointing. 

Edit: One thing I’ll give him is that sometimes he’ll explain how he’s manipulating his audience. Which is a common tell—manipulators like to gloat about it—but if you’re interested in being an info marketer, you can learn the basics from him if you focus on tactics not content.

Edited October 8 by nerdspeak

[Twentyfirst]

You guys are forgetting Owen lives in Hollywood/LA. Everyone he hangs out with has also been living in Hollywood for a long time. That bubble is probably the biggest thing holding him back. He hangs out with weird celebrities too all for the sake of climbing some bs status ladder

[Leo Gura]

12 hours ago, Twentyfirst said:

You guys are forgetting Owen lives in Hollywood/LA. Everyone he hangs out with has also been living in Hollywood for a long time. That bubble is probably the biggest thing holding him back. He hangs out with weird celebrities too all for the sake of climbing some bs status ladder

That's exactly the Orange stuff which I am talking about. He does that by design because his ego needs it.

Imagine if I was busy trying to befriend billionaires and celebrities. How twisted would my worldview be?

Owen is still chasing money, sex, power, status, fame, success, luxury, elitism. This distorts his spirituality and development. That stuff needs to be let go. Letting that stuff go is not optional because it is part of the illusion of Maya.

The reason I am able to get so high is because I let that go.

Edited Wednesday at 08:27 PM by Leo Gura

[Zen LaCroix]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Another example of corruption.

But I don't want to judge him. He is helping many Orange guys develop so that deserves credit.

When I speak about Owen it's from a very high level. Most people don't need to hear my critiques of him.

You gotta take the good from people.

I think your audience doesn't understand this.  They just take the idea that pursuing sex is inherently bad

[AION]

The thing with teachers is that they have to market to their customers. You can't feed pearls to pigs. So if they start teaching that studious shit he would be replaced by somebody else. Even on this forum the level of consciousness is very low. I discovered this after couple of posts and the quality of replies so I will distance myself from this forum a lot more. And outside of this forum it is even worse. Today I pulled up in a Porsche and people from all ages and walks of life just treat you different. I would never treat somebody different base on their car but that is just me. And that is why people give me stuff I guess. There is no greater pleasure than pulling up in a sports car, looking slick like a G in slick leather jacket and bruising the regular's guy ego and wetting some pants. So I do get Owen and others. If he upped his teachings most of the guys that he is teaching wouldn't even get it. They barely understand the shit he is teaching right now. Transcendence how to come from the people themselves. You can't bestow it upon people.

Edited Wednesday at 02:55 PM by AION

[Recursoinominado]

55 minutes ago, AION said:

The thing with teachers is that they have to market to their customers. You can't feed pearls to pigs. So if they start teaching that studious shit he would be replaced by somebody else. Even on this forum the level of consciousness is very low. I discovered this after couple of posts and the quality of replies so I will distance myself from this forum a lot more. And outside of this forum it is even worse. Today I pulled up in a Porsche and people from all ages and walks of life just treat you different. I would never treat somebody different base on their car but that is just me. And that is why people give me stuff I guess. There is no greater pleasure than pulling up in a sports car, looking slick like a G in slick leather jacket and bruising the regular's guy ego and wetting some pants. So I do get Owen and others. If he upped his teachings most of the guys that he is teaching wouldn't even get it. They barely understand the shit he is teaching right now. Transcendence how to come from the people themselves. You can't bestow it upon people.

That's a low consciousness thinking.

If your focus is money, sex, fame, that's how you justify any corruption.

A high-consciousness teacher would not compromise the quality of their teachings to make more money. 

There are high-conscious "dating coaches". This is not impossible; it is just less lucrative.

[AION]

@Recursoinominado I don’t care about money or status