Leo Guras terrifying and disturbing views on consciousness

[Mmartinez]

Hello I’m a new member, my membership has just been approved. Here I’m going to present Leo Guras views and ideas about consciousness that I find terrifying and disturbing and I’ve suffered a great deal because of these views. My purpose here is to know if these views and ideas are definitively true and are true definitions of consciousness or are just philosophical views that it could or not be true and nothing more. Also are only primary foundational insights considered definitively true and secondary insights are open for debate? 

• consciousness knob that spins forever the nature of infinity.
• figments of imagination that grow forever in consciousness.
• Consciousness can zoom forever in the infinite fractal or infinity. 
• Consciousness can do what it wants since it’s unlimited that means I can do whatever I want, I can rape, commit murder and other crimes since I’m unlimited. 
• Regarding omnipotence, is the omnipotence insight of Leo Gura the same fundamental foundational insight that Advaita Vedanta presents. Or Leo Gura has made a new discovery of insight through psychedelics regarding omnipotence that goes beyond Advaita Vedanta teachings on omnipotence. Also is the omnipotence insight a primary insight or secondary derivative insight. 
• consciousness expands forever, is it a primary foundational fundamental insight or is it a secondary insight.
• the physical universe stretches on forever. 
• Also does consciousness exist beyond my ego minds perceptions, Leo Gura seems to say that nothing exists beyond the ego minds perceptions. 
• Forever locked in bubble of consciousness is it a primary foundational fundamental insight or it’s just narrative subjective view. 

Edited Wednesday at 10:16 AM by Mmartinez

[James123]

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

Hello I’m a new member, my membership has just been approved. Here I’m going to present Leo Guras views and ideas about consciousness that I find terrifying and disturbing and I’ve suffered a great deal because of these views. My purpose here is to know if these views and ideas are definitively true and are true definitions of consciousness or are just philosophical views that it could or not be true and nothing more. Also are only primary foundational insights considered definitively true and secondary insights are open for debate? 

You say you suffer because of certain ideas about consciousness and that ideas that are terrifying, disturbing. Why does an idea cause such deep suffering? Think very simply. When the mind clings to an idea, especially about something as vast, unknowable as consciousness, it becomes trapped in its own creation. And in that prison, it trembles.

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

• consciousness knob that spins forever the nature of infinity.
• figments of imagination that grow forever in consciousness.
• Consciousness can zoom forever in the infinite fractal or infinity. 
• Consciousness can do what it wants since it’s unlimited that means I can do whatever I want, I can rape, commit murder and other crimes since I’m unlimited. 
• Regarding omnipotence, is the omnipotence insight of Leo Gura the same fundamental foundational insight that Advaita Vedanta presents. Or Leo Gura has made a new discovery of insight through psychedelics regarding omnipotence that goes beyond Advaita Vedanta teachings on omnipotence. Also is the omnipotence insight a primary insight or secondary derivative insight. 
• consciousness expands forever, is it a primary foundational fundamental insight or is it a secondary insight.
• the physical universe stretches on forever. 
• Also does consciousness exist beyond my ego minds perceptions, Leo Gura seems to say that nothing exists beyond the ego minds perceptions. 
• Forever locked in bubble of consciousness is it a primary foundational fundamental insight or it’s just narrative subjective view. 

All these are beliefs. The idea that consciousness is infinite, that it expands forever, that one is omnipotent, these are still beliefs, stories the mind clings to. Even Leo, with all his experiences, is believing. And as long as one believe, one cannot see what is true.

Belief blinds you. It gives comfort, or fear, or excitemen, but never truth. Whether it's Advaita or Leo or any teacher, if they are operating from belief or from experience, they are still caught in illusion.

Just see yourself as you are, without a single belief, without a single conclusion.

Can you look at your thoughts, your fears, your desires, without naming them, without escaping, without judging? Just look.

Not Leo’s way, not Advaita, not any teaching filled with beliefs and experiences. As long as there is belief or experience, even in infinity, omnipotence, or expansion. you are lost. Leo is still believing. He does not see. He is still within the field of thought. He is not aware too. Therefore, don't judge Leo.

The only one way is this:

To be totally free of belief.

To look without conclusion, without identity, without any desire to become something. No guide, no path, no method, only pure observation. Quiet, clear, without the “me.”

That is the only truth. All else is illusion.

Moreover, your suffering is actually good.

It shows that the false is breaking. The mind is in conflict because it can no longer hold its illusions together. The ground beneath your beliefs is shaking and that is a sacred moment.

Don’t run from this suffering. Don’t cover it with new ideas or spiritual claims. Let it burn. Let it reveal that all you held as truth was just imagination.

In this burning, what is false dies. And what remains is not an idea. It is You.

Even to call it “Truth” creates distance.

The moment you name it, you separate You from it. you turn the nameless into an idea, a concept, something to seek, to grasp, to believe in. But it is not something apart from You.

No name, no image, no seeker, no sought.

You are.

That’s it.

[Jannes]

 

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

or are just philosophical views that it could or not be true and nothing more. 

Haha the mainstream understanding of philosopy. 

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

Also are only primary foundational insights considered definitively true and secondary insights are open for debate? 

Yes primary insight aka direct experience is king because it is absolutely true. Secondary insights aka concepts about direct experience are always open for debate. 

 

I havent verified most of these claims in my direct experience yet but I just want to comment on these two:

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

• Consciousness can do what it wants since it’s unlimited that means I can do whatever I want, I can rape, commit murder and other crimes since I’m unlimited.

Well consciousness allows this to happen obviously. 

But it would be a limit on consciousness if it only allowed that to happen. 

You should also be careful with how you integrate these absolute truths, because we deal with relative truths in everyday life. Its good that we as a society dont allow rape, murder or other crimes to happen.

1 hour ago, Mmartinez said:

• Also does consciousness exist beyond my ego minds perceptions, Leo Gura seems to say that nothing exists beyond the ego minds perceptions. 

Not sure what you mean by ego minds perception. All there exists are states of consciousness, if you think that all your experience is rendered by your ego, including mysical experiences, perhaps the experience of a cat, a tree an alien, 'free-love' , ... whatever then yes. 

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Mmartinez said:

I’ve suffered a great deal because of these views

No, you've suffered your whole life because you aren't conscious of these views.

Suffering isn't created by infinite consciousness but by finite consciousness.

[Mmartinez]

So these views are not definitively true ? That’s all I want to know. 

Edited Wednesday at 12:22 PM by Mmartinez

[Leo Gura]

39 minutes ago, Mmartinez said:

So these views are not definitively true ? That’s all I want to know. 

You can't know anything by asking anyone.

Realize that. Then some serious work can begin.

We are discussing extremely advanced things. This is not elementary school where you can just memorize answers.

[Mmartinez]

First of all I’m a newbie who got into self help I’m not trying to do consciousness work I just discovered Actualized. Org and I stopped watching Actualized org. So you are saying that these terrifying views are definitively true but I have to realized them for myself.  Leo gura you are terrifying me even more. Sometimes I’d rather not hear back from you. Because you’ll terrify me even more those views must be secondary insights open for debate not primary insights which are definitively true. 

Edited Wednesday at 12:53 PM by Mmartinez

[r0ckyreed]

If you’re not interested in consciousness work, then why do you care? Why not just monkey around like other humans do? You have to genuinely care about truth and stop asking others for answers that you could find out on your own.

[Leo Gura]

29 minutes ago, Mmartinez said:

Leo gura you are terrifying me even more.

There is no point in being terrified over truth. If it is true, then how you feel about truth is irrelevant. And if it is no true then there's no point even thinking about it.

You have a warped relationship to truth which will screw up your entire self-help process.

It would be wise of you to take this opportunity to change your attitude towards truth. Clinging to fantasies is not going to serve you well. Nor will negativity towards truth.

You wanted self-help, well, you found it. Now you're backing out.

Edited Wednesday at 01:12 PM by Leo Gura

[Mmartinez]

Well to begin with I was genuinely interested in psychedelics but then realized it wasn’t my thing so that’s why I got interested in consciousness topics. Again if these views are not definitively true which is what I want to hear then that’ll be the best news of my life because I’ve been suffering for months now. 

Edited Wednesday at 01:31 PM by Mmartinez

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, Mmartinez said:

Again if these views are not definitively then that’ll be the best news of my life

Again, this is the wrong attitude.

You shouldn't care to have truth turn out some way to suit you. You should love the truth whatever it is.

If Adolf Hitler is truth, you should love Adolf Hitler.

You're not understanding this.

You think you can manipulate reality to suit your emotional needs. This is a very wrong view which will create a miserable life.

It doesn't matter what the truth is. All that matters is that it is true.

Edited Wednesday at 01:33 PM by Leo Gura

[Mmartinez]

All I wanted to hear is if these views are definitively true or not. Leo gura no one has terrified me like you did. Are these views primary foundational insights which are definitively true or secondary insights open for debate. 

Edited Wednesday at 01:39 PM by Mmartinez

[Davino]

Why would you trust Leo or anyone to tell you the truth. That's not how truth-seeking works, with that epistemology 99,9999% of times you end up with falsehood and illusion, it just seems to be the rare case were you tripped over a pile of gold. Oh please tell me this is fake gold! You only know it's true Gold when you bite it; only you can test it for yourself.

 

[OBEler]

@Mmartinez they are primarily foundational insights. No philosophy.

But you didn't experienced these insights yet so for you it's philosophy.

Edited Wednesday at 01:59 PM by OBEler

[Mmartinez]

@OBEler That’s terrifying that they are primary foundational insights my suffering will continue thanks a lot. But again they’re not primary foundational insights, Leo gura does not present the views as primary foundational insights.  The primary foundational insights definitive answers are love, truth, infinity, consciousness, oneness, god etc.  These views are not primary stop misleading me. 

Edited Wednesday at 02:31 PM by Mmartinez

[Mmartinez]

@James123 ok thanks so the views are not primary foundational insights just beliefs. 

[Mmartinez]

@OBEler Leo Gura just said I am clinging to fantasies which he meant these views are fantasies. That just shows you he’s not treating these views as primary foundational insights. So stop messing with me . 

Edited Wednesday at 03:29 PM by Mmartinez

[r0ckyreed]

If you really want to avoid truth and focus on your emotional needs, then why are you here? Why not just turn off your phone and live your life? You don’t need Leo or Buddha to validate something for you. I recommend you turn off your phone and take a break from social media and actualized just to see if anything changes for you. Best of luck.

[Daniel Balan]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can't know anything by asking anyone.

Realize that. Then some serious work can begin.

I never intended to do a tattoo on on my skin, but one day I will tattoo this phrase on my forearm! This is one of the biggest pieces of wisdom I missed my entire life! Always I was asking other people for what is true or what is false, but once you realize you are the sole arbiter of truth... Man, only then the real work begins! 

[Dayo]

@Mmartinez. Start with basic self help. If you need coaching and therapy, go and do that too. Leo is teaching advanced personal development and spirituality right now. You need to go deep for a few years and be on a journey of self discovery before you start questioning and diving deep into what Leo is talking about these days .