Review Ending unnecessary Suffering by Peter Ralston

[James123]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Tell that to a kangaroo.

Illusion is not can not lecturing to the kangaroo, illusion is imagining that there is a kangaroo that is not conscious enough to understand what enlightenment is.

The kangaroo is just a kangaroo, body is just a human body, enlightenment just enlightenment. No more than that. 

[Miguel1]

@Natasha Tori Maru @OBEler

Very interesting you both mention suffering right after waking up. What the hell! I suffer from the same.

For me, it doesn’t matter if it is morning or middle of the day. If I wake up from a long nap in the evening, the same flood of suffering is there.

What is the quality of your guys’ suffering?

For me, it is this existential hopelessness. It’s like the sleep is so peaceful, and I fall asleep fast, and get into deep sleep - but once I wake up, the whole unconsciousness, selfishness and survival of our human collectiveness hits me all at once.

Like Natasha, it passes once I start my day.

And this literally happens probably 9 out of 10 times I wake up. So weird. I can go to sleep at night fully at peace, but always wake up to some sort emotional wave of existential terror / crisis / hopelessness.

[Leo Gura]

Rather than trying to not suffer, be okay with your suffering.

[Mellowmarsh]

58 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Tell that to a lion when you're wrestling with him.

You are the lion. 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Miguel1 yes, you describe it very well. 

I don't know why, but I have always been this way. 

It is like some wicked cosmic joke to wake from the bliss of sleep. 

Once I have momentum for the day I am fine, I don't think and body just does it's thing.

If I am suffering from a hardship, the morning is much worse. Waking from a nap also sometimes. Very discombobulating which compounds the overall malaise.

[OBEler]

9 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

@Natasha Tori Maru @OBEler

For me, it is this existential hopelessness. It’s like the sleep is so peaceful, and I fall asleep fast, and get into deep sleep - but once I wake up, the whole unconsciousness, selfishness and survival of our human collectiveness hits me all at once.

For me its also existential hopelessness but my breakup is the reason for that feeling. Do you have a specific reason why you feel that deep? Is ist not having a good job or living in a place you dont like and want to move out but cant?

When did it start first time.

Edited 51 minutes ago by OBEler

[Inliytened1]

3 hours ago, OBEler said:

I suffer since 7 month. I learned my lesson, so now how can I stop that. Has Peter Ralston addressed that suffering in the Morning when cortisol is so high it wakes you up? I sleep less than 5 hours every day because of this stress. The first 3 hours in the morning after waking up are brutal. 

During the day I feel just a subtle suffering in the background. I can live with that. 

I had a breakup so bad I suffered for years but I believe it was a key factor in my enlightenment when I sat down to meditate.  It was deep deep suffering for years.  It is a form of spiritual growth. Go through it like Leo said.

It will grow you.

BTW it took me about 9 years or so to get over that person. Time helps.

Edited 47 minutes ago by Inliytened1

[Miguel1]

6 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Waking from a nap also sometimes.

For me, if it’s a 15-20 min nap, no problems.

But if it’s like 1-2h+ nap, then it hits

[Inliytened1]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Breakup pain is natural. You have to processs that loss, not zero it out.

This is why I dislike the whole notion of "ending suffering".

You can't just end suffering  you gotta live through it.

Couldn't agree more i am living experience of it. 

[Mellowmarsh]

14 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Rather than trying to not suffer, be okay with your suffering.

Who on earth is trying not to suffer, name someone or something?

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@OBEler for me it seems to be a genetic thing. Early morning upon waking does it. But it is very, very mild at present time as I have reached a beautiful state of life where I am in flow a lot. 

I accept it, surrender. I'm not fearing it. It passes quickly this way. Going down into it gets me out. 

For the above reason, I always do hard cardio in the morning. Zone 5/6. I find it is almost a charged overabundance of energy. The dawn light and movement help.

[Inliytened1]

2 hours ago, Mellowmarsh said:

This makes perfect sense.

It teaches you how to die, gracefully, without resistance. All the non-human, non-speaking living creatures on earth are having to cope with a process of living and dying every minute of their lives,  without complaining, without the need for enlightenment

Animals do not have a concept of past or present, living or dying -they exist purely in the moment.   They also do not have the ability to self reflect. So yes they live more aligned with just Being but its not because of intelligence it's because they have less intelligence.  We should be more like them in trying to live in the present moment.  Us humans let the monkey mind run out of our control due to more intelligence. But this doesn't mean enlightenment doesn't exist. 

Edited 38 minutes ago by Inliytened1

[Miguel1]

2 minutes ago, OBEler said:

For me its also existential hopelessness but my breakup is the reason for that feeling. Do you have a specific reason why you feel that deep? Is ist not having a good job or living in a place you dont like and want to move out but cant?

When did it start first time.

@Inliytened1

It started for me from break up too. But it’s been 10 months and I feel like I have moved on from it quite well. Maybe like now, it has shifted from break up + lack of human intimacy to purely but strongly lack of human intimacy.

I have struggled with being a wage slave and not being able to fully express myself freely forever so I don’t think that’s the reason.

If anything, at least I had quite a deep intimacy on physical, emotional, psychological and intellectual with my ex partner, but now I don’t even have that.

And finally, I feel like on one hand I am so done with repressing my true self and just want to fully express myself via my art and making a proper career for myself - but at the same time I am aware that it will make it even Harder for me to get the intimacy I crave, as it is too threatening for normies.

The caveat is that I am much more likely to find the person I truly aligned with and can have authentic intimacy with, it I fully express myself publicly. I will lose 99% of people in my life, but I will open the doors for the right people to enter my life.

- - - - -

Overall, I think for me it comes down to lack of proper intimacy (I don’t count random sex with random people intimacy), and the lack of ability to freely express myself (with the fear of its consequences). Same reason I cant be on this forum with my real name.

But this all starts from the foundation that human consciousness is still so damn low. In many ways, we are still living deeply in the dark ages.

[Joseph Maynor]

4 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@OBEler for me it seems to be a genetic thing. Early morning upon waking does it. But it is very, very mild at present time as I have reached a beautiful state of life where I am in flow a lot. 

I accept it, surrender. I'm not fearing it. It passes quickly this way. Going down into it gets me out. 

For the above reason, I always do hard cardio in the morning. Zone 5/6. I find it is almost a charged overabundance of energy. The dawn light and movement help.

Interesting.  I tend to have peak energy at night.

[Miguel1]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Breakup pain is natural. You have to processs that loss, not zero it out.

This is why I dislike the whole notion of "ending suffering".

You can't just end suffering  you gotta live through it.

Yeah, it’s a chemical inbalance in our brain. Need to process it and give it time for our brain to find balance and harmony again.

Also why PUA is toxic in this regard. Pick up would say for you to numb it and go fuck 10 hotter girls to move on.

[James123]

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Rather than trying to not suffer, be okay with your suffering.

When suffering is unbearable, you will realize what I am saying.

As Osho said, enlightenment is not via force, but apple will fall when it's grown.

Peace.

[Miguel1]

The suffering for me has also neutralized a lot compared to 10 months ago when I broke up.

But I would have thought it would have passed by now as I am quite happy single.

It must be still here for the reasons I mentioned above.

I was able to express myself much better in my relationship because she accepted me and didn’t judge me, and we had a special bond. Now I have to play the social games way more, but I hate that too and need to really stop it. But then there is not much intimacy at all in my life anymore, however shallow.

There is clearly an internal, existential conflict within me.

[OBEler]

@Miguel1 it seems you are neurodivers and hate masking. It's a common problem. 

[Inliytened1]

4 minutes ago, James123 said:

 but apple will fall when it's grown.

.

You are talking apples to oranges here 😀.  

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

10 months is when you first start getting over a breakup.  It takes like 3 years honestly.

Yeah. The one that really got me took 9 or 10 honestly.