Leo, do you think that Democrats should support right-wing economic policies?

[kbone]

First uncaused action done every morning is waking up.

As such, in life, start with waking up first.

Then, if so fortunate, stay conscious of when the one has slipped into the dreamstate in which 'this' battles 'that'.

Then, if so fortunate, one can see the battle for what it is,,, and there is no one-ended stick.

Then, if so fortunate, one need not, but can pick up that stick, knowing they have entered the dreamstate and can remain conscious, even while dreaming...maybe even wield it for effect, or just twirl it for a good show.

When things get 'too serious' and litigious, it's always nice to have a court jester around. They can be sincere in their efforts to lighten the load of the sticky thoughts of the dreamstate.

Edited May 8 by kbone

[kbone]

23 minutes ago, Nivsch said:

Equality doesn't contradict nature, but its an expansion of basic emotions which also found in nature, made possible through human cognitive abilities.

It's a distinction in the capacities for thought, yes. Emotions are born of thought/mind structure. One could say, that once the mind has been engaged with, it becomes responsible for it. Prior to that engagement of mind, one is already, ACTUALLY, Free.

[zazen]

@kbone @Nivsch 

Psychology is downstream from biology, and both exist within the ocean of spirit or consciousness. Biology survives, only a psychology can thrive for more. Biology operates through differentiation, hierarchy, specialization. It’s not concerned with fairness, only with efficient function that ensures its survival. 

Psychology is where the capacity for equality emerges. Because only the mind can reflect, empathize, and develop the conscience required to aspire toward fairness. Our psychology nurtures biology to transcend its raw mechanics of survival.

So equality is not a biological principle - its a psychological and spiritual one. It doesn’t grow against nature but from nature, through the flowering of consciousness.

If we Just look at ours hand - our fingers are un-equal. Thats nature and biology. But with a conscience and a brain, those hands engineer equality. Your psychology nurtures biology and nature to bring about equality.

Nature gives us the tools. Consciousness gives us the vision. Psychology is the bridge between the two.

 

[kbone]

25 minutes ago, zazen said:

@kbone @Nivsch 

Psychology is downstream from biology, and both exist within the ocean of spirit or consciousness. Biology survives, only a psychology can thrive for more. Biology operates through differentiation, hierarchy, specialization. It’s not concerned with fairness, only with efficient function that ensures its survival. 

Psychology is where the capacity for equality emerges. Because only the mind can reflect, empathize, and develop the conscience required to aspire toward fairness. Our psychology nurtures biology to transcend its raw mechanics of survival.

So equality is not a biological principle - its a psychological and spiritual one. It doesn’t grow against nature but from nature, through the flowering of consciousness.

If we Just look at ours hand - our fingers are un-equal. Thats nature and biology. But with a conscience and a brain, those hands engineer equality. Your psychology nurtures biology and nature to bring about equality.

Nature gives us the tools. Consciousness gives us the vision. Psychology is the bridge between the two.

 

You have a unique expression that I like. Yes, 'equality' is a value, necessarily involving mind/intellect to conjure. I'd agree that it does have a speerchal component to it, as one gets into the finer granularity of what the mind can conceive/perceive, as it necessarily involves 'otherness'.

I'd add that psychology is also the domain of 'self', as in the 'false self'. The false self is an outcome of the mind's limited identification as a separate volitional person (SVP) that is separate from the Whole that simply is, prior to mind, nature, and all its percieved qualities. The realisation of falsity of self, under the scrutiny of one's highest conscious faculties where the  'speerchal' realm of expansiveness opens up, is the only true Freedom from self. After all, what is higher in equality than 'no other'.

[Husseinisdoingfine]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You and this one image... I swear. 

Edited May 8 by Husseinisdoingfine

[Mannyb]

@kbone

Equality as the mind understands it does begin in otherness, but as you pointed out so clearly, there’s something deeper: the space where the illusion of separation dissolves.
The false self softens under the light of awareness, and what remains isn’t sameness, but a kind of luminous oneness.
A place where even the mind, with all its brilliance, gently bows to something it can’t contain.
And maybe that’s where true equality lives: not in ideas, but in the quiet presence of no other.

yay

May we keep returning to that gentle place, where being is enough, and all distinctions fade into love.

❤️‍🔥

[Husseinisdoingfine]

@Leo Gura

 

[kbone]

10 minutes ago, Mannyb said:

@kbone

Equality as the mind understands it does begin in otherness, but as you pointed out so clearly, there’s something deeper: the space where the illusion of separation dissolves.
The false self softens under the light of awareness, and what remains isn’t sameness, but a kind of luminous oneness.
A place where even the mind, with all its brilliance, gently bows to something it can’t contain.
And maybe that’s where true equality lives: not in ideas, but in the quiet presence of no other.

yay

May we keep returning to that gentle place, where being is enough, and all distinctions fade into love.

❤️‍🔥

Very nicely stated, and there's also the sense that comes through the expression that it is understood to BE a space that is not only immediately available, but Present. IT just HERE, prior to mind and all other appearances known as the UNIverse (one song).

As has been said, "The mind is a wonderful tool, but it makes a terrible master."

 

❤️‍🔥

Edited May 8 by kbone

[Husseinisdoingfine]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But the leftist party lost.

Who won is a neo-Lib banker. A Joe Biden type. The Canadian far left lost.

I went to Wikipedia to confirm if this was the case, and Leo is right.

The left-wing Social Democracy and Democratic Socialist hybrid party, the NDP, lost 17 seats in this most recent election.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Canadian_federal_election

They went from 24 seats to a measly 7 seats.

 

This new Prime Minster, Mark Carney, was a former Goldman Sachs banker. 

But why? People on the surface are fed up, and yet they vote for the same Liberal twats that brought them into this situation. The nickname for the Liberals in Canada is the "natural governing party", because they're most likely to be in power for the longest duration. 

People on the surface shout form the rooftops for change, and how they're pissed, and yada yada yada... But then vote for the same Liberal Party, or maybe switch it up by voting for the Conservative Party, that's been always consistently in power and never for the NDP. 

[The Crocodile]

@Leo Gura You can have equality and freedom in a post-scarcity society, especially if people have been genetically engineered or paranormally affected to be more benevolent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-scarcity

[Husseinisdoingfine]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Which is why socialism failed.

I would have to politely disagree with this view. To say that socialism simply failed or simply succeeded I think is too big of a grand narrative. Sure, maybe state-socialism has failed, and even that take is too reductionistic. 

But I would love to submit historical and economic evidence on this forum as to why I sincerely believe that a non-centrally planned socialism is the way forward for society.

I want to keep my disagreements as polite as possible, and I don't want to take this on as an ideology, but I do completely disagree with Leo when he says that socialism is this or that. And if asked by Leo, I would love to submit my evidence from history and economics and books I've read explaining why I think this way. 

Thank you.

[Daniel Balan]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Canadian men are such pussies they literally need free tampons by law. 

The jokes write themselves.

I would argue that Canadian men are 10 times that of the United States. All that wood that those men work to produce ain't done by pussies! The wood industry in Canada is the heart of their economy!

[Husseinisdoingfine]

23 minutes ago, Daniel Balan said:

I would argue that Canadian men are 10 times that of the United States. All that wood that those men work to produce ain't done by pussies! The wood industry in Canada is the heart of their economy!

Yeah, but which way do those types of men who produce wood vote? Are Canadian Lumberjacks voting NDP? Liberal? Or Conservative?

[Mannyb]

@kbone

Beautifully put—and yes, precisely 🙏 

That Presence is so immediate, so quietly radiant, it almost feels absurd we ever searched for it elsewhere. 😃 

Before thought, before identity—it’s just Here, humming like the background note of existence, the “one song” indeed. 🎵 

And when the mind bows to that, it finally becomes the brilliant servant it was meant to be. 🤲🏼 

Grateful for this resonance. 👋🏼 

 

[Daniel Balan]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Truth is more fundamental that human life. Obviously. Because a human life is worth no more than the ant you stepped on on your way to work. But what do you care? As long as you got your life you don't care. That's how corrupt you are.

This! This is how I viewed things since I was at least 7 years old! I've always understood that my life is as meaningless as that of a snail I accidentally crushed with my foot. I understood than human life is not more important than that of a worm or cockroach! The only reason I am allowed to live and the other creatures die all the time is because I live in a society designed by a species that could physically overpower all other creatures on this planet. Next time you eat your beef, remember that if on earth there would still be more powerful creatures like dinosaurs you the human would be on the dinosaur's plate the same way your cow is now on your plate. Be grateful human for your life because in the eye of god we are all like insects!

[Daniel Balan]

Well regarding the left wing vs right wing debate! Right now Canada is the best example of left wing and Russia is the best example of right wing! In which of these 2 countries would you like to live? I'd say Canada.

[Mannyb]

2 minutes ago, Daniel Balan said:

Well regarding the left wing vs right wing debate! Right now Canada is the best example of left wing and Russia is the best example of right wing! In which of these 2 countries would you like to live? I'd say Canada.

That’s a compelling way to frame it—and it really highlights how different values manifest in governance and daily life.

 

Canada, with its emphasis on inclusivity, public healthcare, and personal freedoms, might feel more livable for many—especially if you value openness and social support.

Russia, on the other hand, often represents a more rigid, nationalist, and authority-centered model.

 

But beyond left or right, maybe the deeper question is: Where does life feel most aligned with one’s core values and spirit? That might differ person to person, but for many, Canada’s current ethos resonates more with compassion and liberty.

 

[Daniel Balan]

I totally agree that leftists have many bad policies and are way too utopian with their policies, but man, it is totally unfair to criticize the left without criticizing even harder the right! At least the left wing makes you pay taxes for tampons in men's bathrooms but the right wing will shoot you with their AR if you say you are gay or that you hate religion. Plus the right is hella more corrupt than the left, ant that is by a huge margin. The left will confiscate your land to share it with the ones who have no land, but the right will confiscate all your land to build a concentration camp for migrants on it. Talk about differences.

[Mannyb]

@Daniel Balan

A fiery take, I get where you’re coming from. Both wings absolutely deserve scrutiny, but in different ways.

 

The left can veer into idealism that sometimes disconnects from practical realities, while the right often wraps its flaws in the language of tradition, order, or “freedom,” even when that leads to repression or systemic harm.

 

What’s tragic is how both sides, when unbalanced, lose sight of basic human dignity. One might overreach in trying to fix the world, the other might actively deny there’s anything to fix—unless it benefits power obviously 🙄 

 

The deeper issue, maybe, is this:

What kind of society actually honors both truth and compassion?
Neither extreme seems to fully embody that right now.

 

[Daniel Balan]

@Mannyb There is a reason why the left wing defeated the far right in ww2! Had the nazi regime been more centrist, Russia would be beyond the urals today! But no those far right lunatics instead of befriending the Ukrainians and the Russians that hated communism the nazis tried to exterminate them! This attitude of hatred and corruption ultimately led to the downfall of the right wing! History demonstrated us that the left is better than the right! The best position is to be a wizard on the political spectrum and adopt different policies based on the problems that need to be solved!