Latest Ukraine/Russia Thread

[BlueOak]

@zazen

1) If Russia is suffering so bad economically and militarily I don't see why they would escalate to that level by attacking a NATO country. 

I advocate for a regional focus, but in this context, Zazen you are need a larger one. If BRICS fights NATO, Russia can take Estonia. Because NATO will be busy all over the globe. Nuclear war isn't happening over an invasion. I am not even sure all countries would go to fight either, are you? Can you imagine Hungary going to fight Russia over Estonia? Collectivists need to understand NATO is many voices, and when pressed, they won't always align.

2) China and India couldn't care less about European security. No action they've taken even suggests it. I'm open for you to prove this otherwise with actions, not just words. Authoritarian countries speak through actions; their words are largely meaningless. At the moment, every action they've taken says the exact opposite.

Again - Russia didn't place itself in NATO expansions way, it was the other way round. 

3) Yes it did. After all this you still don't see the other side of this.
Russia project fear, threats and violence. Russia was directly responsible for other countries joining a defensive alliance to resist them.
Just like I can understand a larger power fighting against its decline to a regional power, and using all these tools to try and remake the USSR, or push their influence outward. I also understand that as Russia declines, it loses its sphere. You can't understand that. You think it's entitled to a sphere for its mere existence. No, not if it's too weak to project it relative to its neighbours. 

The EU should recognize its own security interests by dealing with a non-EU member like Ukraine hitting the Druzhba pipeline which provides energy to two EU member states.

4) Your logic doesn't make sense. Europe prosecuting the country directly responsible for ensuring and fighting for their security interests is like some twisted Russia state TV babble. I might as well say BRICS should prosecute Russia for dragging them closer to the brink of war, completely nonsensical when that's how BRICS aligning itself anyway, as a direct competitor to NATO.

This is war zazen. You take out your opponent's economy in war, its been a long time coming. Russia is acting like Germany, which tried to project it had a healthy economy all the way to the end of WW2, when in reality they were broke.

Given BRICS material and manpower support to Russia, the delay in really arming Ukraine to fully win, the only win state here for Europe. if Putin will not negotiate peace, is the destruction of the Russian economy. Otherwise, WW3 is a possibility, and that 'win state' could hardly be called a win for anyone.  - Though what's practically happening is steady economic pressure.
 

Edited 18 hours ago by BlueOak

[BlueOak]

Russian dirty bomb threats to the north of Ukraine and Sub threats against a US carrier group.

All tests to see the response. Just like the false flag against Estonia and others, just like the drones into Poland and the Baltics, just like the nuclear threats against everyone, just like the build ups in Kaliningrad. 
 

 

Edited 18 hours ago by BlueOak