The difference between enlightenment and awakening

[HMD]

7 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

If there is something defined, be it breathing, seeing, hearing, thinking, there is limitation. Experience means limitation 

Yup. We can end all other (in a sensory deprivation tank for example) but breathing will always keep you tied. 

[Osaid]

37 minutes ago, Someone here said:

So infinity can't appear as a human or future?

Imagination appears as imagination; about a "you" in the future which is less limited than you right now.

37 minutes ago, Someone here said:

The mere fact that Leo had that thought means it's part of everythingness /what is .

Imagination certainly is, as a unicorn or Santa Claus is.

37 minutes ago, Someone here said:

infinity isn't antithetical to anything otherwise it would be finite. 

Right.

Imagination is not antithetical or excluded. It is imagination.

Imagining unicorns isn't "unicorns", it is imagination.

Edited March 26 by Osaid

[Osaid]

28 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

It seems obvious to me

It seems obvious?

Because you think that you can be something else in the future?

Because you think that you were something else in the past?

Maybe it's just you thinking, nothing else?

[Osaid]

19 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

You can not tap into all Infinity while maintaining a body.

That is a limitation, which is finite.

"Infinity cannot have a body"

What you talk about is not infinite. Because you limit it in that sentence.

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beyond one's own current senses.

"Beyond current senses" means "beyond the absolute" or "what is not occurring yet."

It means there is an experience somewhere else in the future, which you can be. Which you currently aren't.

That can't be the case. Not in infinity.

Edited March 26 by Osaid

[DJ Comaschi]

13 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

I gotta be with Leo on this. You can not tap into all Infinity while maintaining a body. 

Body will break/won´t handle the energy soon once you open the "gates" of perception beyond one's own current senses.

You can peak a bit outside, but not too much, or the light might blind you and kill you 😂.

 

That’s why the bible says that If you look at God you’ll die (physically)

[HMD]

3 minutes ago, DJ Comaschi said:

That’s why the bible says that If you look at God you’ll die (physically)

Similar thing in the Quran: 

After Musa came to Us according to his appointment, and his Lord spoke to him, he said: “My Lord, let me see You.” Allah said, “You will not be able to see Me, but look towards the mountain; if it stays in its place, then you will be able to see Me.” When His Lord appeared in His glory on the mountain, it crumbled, and Musa fell unconscious as though struck by lightning. When Musa regained consciousness, he said, “Glory be to You! I seek Your repentance, and I am the first believer.

[James123]

4 minutes ago, DJ Comaschi said:

That’s why the bible says that If you look at God you’ll die (physically)

No body and nobody is here. 

[Breakingthewall]

15 minutes ago, Osaid said:

It seems obvious?

Because you think that you can be something else in the future?

Because you think that you were something else in the past?

Maybe it's just you thinking, nothing else?

 I just perceive the limitation, even with my mind in total silence. It's not about thinking or projecting, it's an energetic fact, a reality 

 

Edited March 26 by Breakingthewall

[DJ Comaschi]

7 minutes ago, James123 said:

No body and nobody is here. 

I can see that… there’s no such thing as “other”

[Osaid]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

I just perceive the limitation

A limitation is a relation between two things. 

For something to be limited, it is limited by a thing.

For limitation to occur, there is "Thing A", which is. And then "Thing B", which is not. The perception of a thing which is and a thing which is not, creates the perception of "limitation."

But how can something which is not, Thing B, ever be experienced? It can't. It is non-existence. It must be imagined and inferred.

Any single limitation you can think of, is simply just what you can think of. Mind. Imagination. Nothing else.

Do you experience yourself as two? Are there two experiences? Are there two experiences which can relate and limit each other? Or do you simply divide it through your mind, and mistake it for yourself?

[Javfly33]

50 minutes ago, Osaid said:

That is a limitation, which is finite.

"Infinity cannot have a body"

What you talk about is not infinite. Because you limit it in that sentence.

Infinity has everything. 

Quote

What you talk about is not infinite. Because you limit it in that sentence.

You are just playing with words and is becoming to get tired. You don´t seem to be conscious of who you are. 

50 minutes ago, Osaid said:

 

"Beyond current senses" means "beyond the absolute" or "what is not occurring yet."

It means there is an experience somewhere else in the future, which you can be. Which you currently aren't.

That can't be the case. Not in infinity.

Not sure what is your point exactly. 

The absolute is Infinite. It is not confined to any perception or experience. 

Edited March 26 by Javfly33

[Osaid]

2 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

Infinity has everything. 

But not a body?

3 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

You are just playing with words

Pointing out contradiction is "playing with words"?

Quote

You can not tap into all Infinity while maintaining a body. 

4 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

Infinity has everything. 

?

5 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

The absolute is Infinite. It is not confined to any perception or experience.

Right.

[Javfly33]

9 hours ago, Osaid said:

But not a body?

Sure, it has a body, but not only that I mean 😅

Quote

Pointing out contradiction is "playing with words"?

?

I guess you can, but the price might be human life. 

[Osaid]

11 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

Sure, it has a body

Quote

You can not tap into all Infinity while maintaining a body. 

?

11 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

but not only that I mean 😅

Not only that, but something other than what you are right now?

I know what you mean. You mean the future. The you which isn't here with us right now.

But when you get there, it won't include a body. And then we'll say "it's not infinite because it's excluding a body."

Maybe infinity can't be "imagining other experiences"?

Maybe your idea of infinity has trapped you in a logical catch-22 which points to absolutely nothing? And you chase that "nothing" like a hamster in an infinite wheel?

11 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

I guess you can, but the price might be human life. 

Hahaha is this a threat to signify your annoyance or am I misinterpreting?

Edited March 27 by Osaid

[Ishanga]

Insight into something within You that You did not have before is an Awakening, Perception of it is akin to Insight, what You did not perceive before but now You Perceive is Awakening. 

Enlightenment is when a defined Space between what is You and what is not You is now within Your Perception and Awareness, as much as You perceive the Sun, Wind, Rain, Pain, Pleasure that you do now. 

Awakening is the beginning of the process, when I read Tolle's New Earth book, I had an Insight into my Ego, it was now within my Perception, that never leaves You, I recognize the voice in my head and the constant judgements going on, mixing with certain emotions at times, making unstoppable at time or controllable at times, karma plays a role here, your tendencies which are all over Your system, within Your Body, Mind, Emotions and Energy systems, basically control You and Your behaviour, thinking and way you live Your life, and what comes into Your life via where You take it.. Awareness is like another sort of Intelligence, when You get it then Enlightenment happens, via that You feel very Blissful, even Ecstatic at times!

Edited March 28 by Ishanga

[Javfly33]

12 hours ago, Osaid said:

Maybe infinity can't be "imagining other experiences"?
 

It can. Is doing now with You. 

 

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Maybe your idea of infinity has trapped you in a logical catch-22 which points to absolutely nothing? And you chase that "nothing" like a hamster in an infinite wheel?

'I' can not chase nothing. Rather 'I' can surrender Truth can appear. But is hard because there is a lot of conditioning in the ego. Surrender takes time but I hope I finally surrender. At the end 'I'm just playing a falsehood game I can not win with Life. 

 

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I know what you mean. You mean the future. The you which isn't here with us right now.

I´m not talking in the future. Not at all. 

 

Quote

Hahaha is this a threat to signify your annoyance or am I misinterpreting?

No lol you are cool 

Edited March 28 by Javfly33

[Artsu]

There are many awakenings on the path to enlightenment,

And many enlightenments on the path to awakening.

[Breakingthewall]

On 26/3/2024 at 10:04 PM, Osaid said:

A limitation is a relation between two things. 

For something to be limited, it is limited by a thing.

For limitation to occur, there is "Thing A", which is. And then "Thing B", which is not. The perception of a thing which is and a thing which is not, creates the perception of "limitation."

But how can something which is not, Thing B, ever be experienced? It can't. It is non-existence. It must be imagined and inferred.

Any single limitation you can think of, is simply just what you can think of. Mind. Imagination. Nothing else.

Do you experience yourself as two? Are there two experiences? Are there two experiences which can relate and limit each other? Or do you simply divide it through your mind, and mistake it for yourself?

Agree, limitation means 2 things, necessarily. But there are 2 things, your body and the exterior. Now you could say that this is just a thought, but it's a thought created by a reality. A new born baby, in the moment when he's out and starts crying, he is realizing the duality. 

You can collapse the duality with meditation (in some extent) and be the undivided reality that ultimately you are, but then you will be again in the duality. Now the duality is real, denying is fool ourselves.