What would happen if all drugs were legalized?

[DefinitelyNotARobot]

@Devin I must disagree. The existence of these laws tells me that we're not developed enough as a collective. We're getting there, but don't see it working out anywhere in the near future.

[Devin]

7 hours ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

@Devin I must disagree. The existence of these laws tells me that we're not developed enough as a collective. We're getting there, but don't see it working out anywhere in the near future.

Bit if you use that logic, then we were developed enough for the last more than thousand years while these drugs including opioids were legal, in use, and actually used as medicine.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[integral]

They already are, prescription medication is every unhealthy garbage legalized and backed by bullshit studies. The reason some medication have been made illegal is because they became too popular in unregulated circles and used for recreational use. they had to control the unregulated businesses built on those drugs exploiting people for profit and addicting them. but cigarettes and alcohol those are fine! lol

What's the difference between a antidepressant and microdosing daily with mdma? They're essentially the same thing. what's the difference between heroin and morphine? Non besides cultural stigma. Micro dosing with psychedelics is now on the rise and will soon be made legalized and prescribable by doctors. The cultural view is changing and THC and things like it are legalized with it.

GHB what a shame that it became to popular out side of regulation, its useful. we need a better way to deal with recreational use, it made no sense that they removed it from prescription because people abused it.

Why aren't people abusing morphine like they do heroin? Because it's regulated. Maybe it's harder to manufacture morphine than it does heroin.

if all drugs became unregulated and legal I would put it in all the food that I manufacture and sell at the grocery store and addicted people to my food, exactly what cigarettes do with their product.

True freedom is regulated, naïve freedom is anarchy.

Edited July 19, 2022 by integral

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, integral said:

if all drugs became unregulated and legal I would put it in all the food that I manufacture and sell at the grocery store

Obviously no one is gonna allow you to put drugs in food. This is an absurd idea.

[Devin]

And look at the collective turning away from those addictive cigarettes

That's progress that banning would have retarded

Individuals know hard drugs are bad, they didn't tobacco, it was romanticized.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[integral]

46 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Obviously no one is gonna allow you to put drugs in food. This is an absurd idea.

What are edibles? lol Can we have a grocery store dedicated to edibles? Can we micro-dose does edibles? Where is the line? Would people buy micro-dosed groceries? 

The branding and culture behind it would be something like: Elevation Food.

But i was explaining a world where there where no regulations. There was no indication in the question about what "all drugs legalized" meant. It would have to be legal and regulated of course. Organized crime still needs to be managed while the substance is legal. Legal cocaine would come in a doctors prescription like it did in the past and not a cartel. 

Edited July 19, 2022 by integral

[DefinitelyNotARobot]

@Devin Development isn't a perfectly straight line that goes up all the time. Sometimes you loose something just to return to it later. You should know that dynamic from your own life. Sometimes as children we get punished for our behavior, so we move away from it and supress that part of ourselves, just to rediscover it at a later point in life. Right now we find ourselves in a period of suppression. It's all part of the game.

You're also comparing very different environments. I could ask: "Why can't I run around naked without being arrested? People back in the days would run around naked all the time and nobody cared!", but we don't live "back in the day". We live here. We live now. We live in a post-Christian world with Christian ideals still dictating a lot of our morals and values. Morals and values that stick around because enough people still resonate with them. That's just where we at right now.

[Devin]

6 minutes ago, integral said:

What are edibles? lol Can we have a grocery store dedicated to edibles? Can we micro-dose does edibles? Where is the line? Would people buy micro-dosed groceries? 

But i was explaining a world where there where no regulations. There was no indication in the question about what "all drugs legalized" meant. It would have to be legal and regulated of course. Organized crime still needs to be managed while the substance is legal. Legal cocaine would come in doctors prescription like it did in the past and not a cartel. 

You would kill your customers, killing your business

[Devin]

50 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

@Devin Development isn't a perfectly straight line that goes up all the time. Sometimes you loose something just to return to it later. You should know that dynamic from your own life. Sometimes as children we get punished for our behavior, so we move away from it and supress that part of ourselves, just to rediscover it at a later point in life. Right now we find ourselves in a period of suppression. It's all part of the game.

You're also comparing very different environments. I could ask: "Why can't I run around naked without being arrested? People back in the days would run around naked all the time and nobody cared!", but we don't live "back in the day". We live here. We live now. We live in a post-Christian world with Christian ideals still dictating a lot of our morals and values. Morals and values that stick around because enough people still resonate with them. That's just where we at right now.

I'm not saying we need to do this, I really don't care I was just talking.

I took what you said about "not being developed enough" to mean linear. 

If we had opiates, cocaine, free in the past, I don't see how we wouldn't cope with them now, of course there would be a crazy transition period, but that's with most growth.

But you could also say the backlash from the suppression will be more meaningful growth though as well.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[integral]

15 minutes ago, Devin said:

You would kill your customers, killing your business

Cigarettes are a multi trillion dollar business, killing is not a deterrent. lol I'm also talking about micro-micro-dosage.

[Devin]

10 minutes ago, integral said:

Cigarettes are a multi trillion dollar business, killing is not a deterrent. lol I'm also talking about micro-micro-dosage.

People catch on, cigarettes are no longer mainstream and the market is still shrinking.

Same with addictive foods, the market isn't shrinking because of laws

If your dosing didn't lead to death or despair of your customers how is it bad for them?

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[DefinitelyNotARobot]

@Devin We could say the same about guns. Have you seen how many school shootings there were this year? Here is a graph that shows the development from 1950 - 2018.

Guns have always been a part of the US and though there was violence, it was nothing like THIS. So how come something that has been around for so long suddenly seems to be generating such horrible results? It's what I meant when I said that you're comparing different environments. Just because something worked in the past doesn't mean that it's going to work now without any drawbacks. It's all about the relationship between a thing and it's environment. The school shooting crisis for example can be linked to the mental health crisis we're facing right now. Countries with stricter regulations aren't facing these problems, not to this degree at least. So even though I think that people shouldn't shoot up schools, not because they can't get their hand on a gun, but because they shouldn't shoot up fucking schools, I have to acknowledge that these regulations do prevent school shootings in the short term (even though it still doesn't adress the mental health crisis).

So I think that it really depends on the context of the society you're in whether legalization is a good idea.

[Devin]

8 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

@Devin We could say the same about guns. Have you seen how many school shootings there were this year? Here is a graph that shows the development from 1950 - 2018.

Guns have always been a part of the US and though there was violence, it was nothing like THIS. So how come something that has been around for so long suddenly seems to be generating such horrible results? It's what I meant when I said that you're comparing different environments. Just because something worked in the past doesn't mean that it's going to work now without any drawbacks. It's all about the relationship between a thing and it's environment. The school shooting crisis for example can be linked to the mental health crisis we're facing right now. Countries with stricter regulations aren't facing these problems, not to this degree at least. So even though I think that people shouldn't shoot up schools, not because they can't get their hand on a gun, but because they shouldn't shoot up fucking schools, I have to acknowledge that these regulations do prevent school shootings in the short term (even though it still doesn't adress the mental health crisis).

So I think that it really depends on the context of the society you're in whether legalization is a good idea.

You might not be surprised that I have a unique view on gun violence.

The affordability and availability for the guns being used has helped recently.

I'll first start with this because you're likely to think I'm a libertarian. I support gun control measures like Australia's.

I think our problem is what is causing these people to want to do this stuff, they've been treated cruelly. But as a result of gun violence the campaign for compassion is greater than ever, so we are actually tackling the root instead of retarding that development with gun laws.

The more mass shootings, the better people treat each other

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[DefinitelyNotARobot]

@Devin Maybe it does, which would be the anti-thesis to the current gun laws. It does come at the cost of individual lives lost, so it depends on what you value more, the egg or the omelet (neither being right nor wrong). I'm selfish so I'd take the egg, since I wouldn't want my future children to get shot either. I'm happy with the regulations in my country, since there are basically no guns here which makes life much more peaceful. But that's just me. I can respect the self-lessness in putting your and your potential childrens lives on the line for society.

[Devin]

21 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

@Devin Maybe it does, which would be the anti-thesis to the current gun laws. It does come at the cost of individual lives lost, so it depends on what you value more, the egg or the omelet (neither being right nor wrong). I'm selfish so I'd take the egg, since I wouldn't want my future children to get shot either. I'm happy with the regulations in my country, since there are basically no guns here which makes life much more peaceful. But that's just me. I can respect the self-lessness in putting your and your potential childrens lives on the line for society.

Deutschland is a bit more culturally homogenous than the u.s., it's harder for us to communicate and understand each other; which I think requires more grace from us 

There's your different settings?

I'd prefer my children live in a free society with the risk of slaughter than in a peaceful cage. But yes it's disgusting our children are slaughtered at school. I support gun reform, only out of a show of compassion though not because I think it solves the problem.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[integral]

2 hours ago, Devin said:

People catch on, cigarettes are no longer mainstream and the market is still shrinking.

Same with addictive foods, the market isn't shrinking because of laws

If your dosing didn't lead to death or despair of your customers how is it bad for them?

Ah there's a misunderstanding people will want to buy it like they want to buy Marijuana edibles. It also depends on what drugs are put in the food and the reason. If the reason is to addict people to my product with out them knowing then most people will avoid that.

They will willingly choose to have there food reinforced with vitamins, minerals, supplements and drugs. Its a super Food revolution!  

Edited July 19, 2022 by integral

[Devin]

26 minutes ago, integral said:

Ah there's a misunderstanding people will want to buy it like they want to buy Marijuana edibles. It also depends on what drugs are put in the food and the reason. If the reason is to addict people to my product with out them knowing then most people will avoid that.

They will willingly choose to have there food reinforced with vitamins, minerals, supplements and drugs. Its a Elevation Food revolution! 

And if you don't kill them or hurt them to a point they can't afford your products I don't see how that's any worse than most marketed items. If they do die or cease to function, you go out of business, self regulation

Many people still choose to avoid legal marijuana edibles, I would

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[integral]

13 minutes ago, Devin said:

And of you don't kill them or hurt them to a point they can't afford your products I don't see how that's any worse than most marketed items. If they do die or cease to function, you go out of business, self regulation

Many people still choose to avoid legal marijuana edibles, I would

It depends the drug. Silicon value is experimenting with micro dosing LSD for enhanced creativity. Full edibles at full strength yes the general population would avoid it. Micro-dosing and micro-micro-dosing is a new domain that will attract the masses. No one dies from micros and it wont be linked back to the product just like cigarettes causing death doesn't implicate the cigarette companies. Nicotine is a powerful nootropic. Oh we have forgotten the world of nootropics.

Taking your morning drink of psychedelic or tryptophan will be as culturally accepted as coffee. A daily thing that "enhances" the day. What I'm talking about is what is going to happen and where the world is moving to right now.

Edibles are in there infancy, it has only begun. Coffee and Nicotine where the first 2. 

Edited July 19, 2022 by integral

[DefinitelyNotARobot]

@Devin Little fun fact on the side: Germany isn't actually homogenous at all. It's the rural areas and east Germany (excluding Berlin) that are homogenous. 27% of all Germans have at least one migrant as a parent. For west Germany (where I'm from) the number is like between 30-35%. And that includes all the older generations. For children below the age of 5 the number is actually like 40%.

 

[Devin]

16 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

@Devin Little fun fact on the side: Germany isn't actually homogenous at all. It's the rural areas and east Germany (excluding Berlin) that are homogenous. 27% of all Germans have at least one migrant as a parent. For west Germany (where I'm from) the number is like between 30-35%. And that includes all the older generations. For children below the age of 5 the number is actually like 40%.

 

Culturally though.

And you have school shootings and mass killings, and we're about the size of all of Europe.