Neither Monism, Nor Duality

[Dodo]

That's why both "Oneness spiritual people" and dualists have beef with nondualists! Nondualists appear so damn paradoxical to both the monist and the dualist, because it includes both sides of the coin. Mmmmmm

 

I think many of us confuse Nonduality with Monism, me personally I had never even heard about monism before this video I'm not going to lie. Pretty good stuff. 

Edited October 3, 2020 by Dodo

[LarryW]

Interesting ... I came across non-dualism after the others, although initially confused because if you're being literal and pedantic (a fault of mine sometimes  ), it also covers 0, 1, 3, -1, 0.5 well, any other number except 2. I'm currently contemplating an idea I read in Don't Cupitt's book 'The Religion of Being', he says that pure Being is uncountable because it is prior to language, prior to numbers and maths etc. Maybe that's what nondualism is getting at? But what the heck, all names for Reality are flawed, even Reality, so go with what works at your stage of development and helps you move on, until you jump out of abstractions like these altogether and discover viscerally that you are It. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by LarryW

[Leo Gura]

Nonduality = Monism

Reality is ONE. And One/Many are identical when seen with absolute consciousness.

The chief delusion here is thinking that one vs many are someone inherently different.

One vs many is a duality which you must collapse.

If things are not-two, they one. And if things are one, they are also many.

One = Many

You can't have many without one, and you can't have one without many.

The problem these sorts of philosophy videos on YT is that they tend to be created by people who don't have direct consciousness of what they are talking about. So they treat these different philosophies in a purely academic sense. But of course Oneness is not a philosophy at all. It's absurd to frame it that way.

[zeroISinfinity]

@Leo Gura Glad that you recovered. ?

Only option "we" are left is to Love. 

Take care be well. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by zeroISinfinity

[Dodo]

@Leo Gura I would argue that reality is not one, it can be said that more accurate is to say reality is zero. No? 

[zeroISinfinity]

14 minutes ago, Dodo said:

@Leo Gura I would argue that reality is not one, it can be said that more accurate is to say reality is zero. No? 

@ZeroInfinitynuff said. 

[Leo Gura]

46 minutes ago, Dodo said:

@Leo Gura I would argue that reality is not one, it can be said that more accurate is to say reality is zero. No? 

If it was zero, that would be one.

[Tim R]

52 minutes ago, Dodo said:

@Leo Gura I would argue that reality is not one, it can be said that more accurate is to say reality is zero. No? 

@Dodo Show me the difference between 1 and zero

[Dodo]

12 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If it was zero, that would be one.

But zero is a bit more mysterious than one... Zero can also be 0+0+0+0+.....0 , added as many times as you wish. So it can appear to be many. While 1 cannot split itself in such a way by using itself only. But zero is also nothing, so there might appear to be 1 or many but in reality there is nothing really, just 0. 

For zero it is correct to say : Zero is One, zero is Many and it is correct to say Zero is Not Any at all! 

44 minutes ago, zeroISinfinity said:

@ZeroInfinitynuff said. 

 

  

 

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Dodo

[Tim R]

1 minute ago, Dodo said:

Zero is One, zero is Many and it is correct to say Zero is Not Any at all! 

But that's the point!!

[Dodo]

 

2 minutes ago, Tim R said:

But that's the point!!

but the point has no dimensions!! 

What I mean is that by saying reality is One (Monism) we are just looking at one of the ways 0 can be seen. That is still not the Ultimate.... That's why Nonduality is a much better way to point, no? 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Dodo

[Tim R]

9 minutes ago, Dodo said:

by saying reality is One (Monism) we are just looking at one of the ways 0 can be seen. That is still not the Ultimate.... That's why Nonduality is a much better way to point, no? 

You're still creating dualities where there aren't any...

"That's not the ultimate". Oh yeah? How could something be excluded from the Ultimate (/Non-Duality)? 

[Leo Gura]

34 minutes ago, Dodo said:

While 1 cannot split itself in such a way by using itself only.

One is Infinity. It can split itself in everything you see around you.

All the numbers are ONE.

ONE is not a number. It is reality itself.

[Member]

59 minutes ago, Dodo said:

but the point has no dimensions!! 

What I mean is that by saying reality is One (Monism) we are just looking at one of the ways 0 can be seen. That is still not the Ultimate.... That's why Nonduality is a much better way to point, no? 

Nonduality doesn't mean plain nothing, it is the unification of everything "In spirituality, nondualism, also called non-duality, means "not two" or "one undivided without a second". Nondualism primarily refers to a mature state of consciousness, in which the dichotomy of I-other is "transcended", and awareness is described as "centerless" and "without dichotomies"."

There's a misconception that there is a difference between nothing and everything, that's why I prefer to call it "everything", or the "Self", rather than saying it's nothing or no-self. Denying ONE is not non-duality, is just self-denial which is not always needed to reach a deeper understanding.

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

One is Infinity. It can split itself in everything you see around you.

All the numbers are ONE.

ONE is not a number. It is reality itself.

I agree that infinity also has exactly the same qualities of 0.

0=0+0+....+0

inf = inf+ inf + .... + inf

They are both concepts that break mathematics and logic so can be used as labels for that which we can never grasp with the mind. 

@Member

45 minutes ago, Member said:

Nonduality doesn't mean plain nothing, it is the unification of everything "In spirituality, nondualism, also called non-duality, means "not two" or "one undivided without a second". Nondualism primarily refers to a mature state of consciousness, in which the dichotomy of I-other is "transcended", and awareness is described as "centerless" and "without dichotomies"."

There's a misconception that there is a difference between nothing and everything, that's why I prefer to call it "everything", or the "Self", rather than saying it's nothing or no-self. Denying ONE is not non-duality, is just self-denial which is not always needed to reach a deeper understanding.

One reality without a second is a good concept, but there is a reason why not-two is a better way to describe it. Otherwise it would be called Oneness.

You might want to watch and get an understanding of how different stages require different pointers. Almost Everyone on this forum is enlightened (hehehe) / knows or has experienced Oneness. I know many people feel that Teal Swan is in no way an authority on the subject of spirituality, but that's just ego. Content is WAY more important than the vessel it gets communicated through. 

 

I guess what I want to say also is that this is a mystery that will remain a mystery. I know some of you guys have popped a lot of psychedellics and believe that you have reached max understanding, but that can never be reached. Understanding a mystery means you can never call it This or That, that's why a Not-two statement of reality is way more realistically correct, because it does not claim to understand or limit That mystery which it is trying to point at. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Dodo

[Member]

@Dodo

Your assumption about others believing that they have reached max understanding or enlightenment is ridiculous, even Leo said many times that he isn't enlightened. This is ironic since you're claiming that almost everyone on this forum is enlightened and if I remember it well, you said before that even babies are enlightened lol. So what the heck are you talking about? As for what Teal said, she's spot on but only if you're seeing reality from a limited perspective. I don't think that anyone said here that reality is this or that since we were talking about the infinite reality. You're just taking things out of context to confirm your theories.

[Moksha]

0 is nothing. 1 is everything. Infinity is nothing and everything.

[Dodo]

2 hours ago, Member said:

@Dodo

Your assumption about others believing that they have reached max understanding or enlightenment is ridiculous, even Leo said many times that he isn't enlightened. This is ironic since you're claiming that almost everyone on this forum is enlightened and if I remember it well, you said before that even babies are enlightened lol. So what the heck are you talking about? As for what Teal said, she's spot on but only if you're seeing reality from a limited perspective. I don't think that anyone said here that reality is this or that since we were talking about the infinite reality. You're just taking things out of context to confirm your theories.

<3 Yes, I stand by that. Babies are enlightened. They are pure love. Have you not seen a baby? How rooted they are in being? They are so complete and whole. 

I think you are living up there in the mind too much. Otherwise you will see that everyone is enlightened. Everyone is love. Everyone is light (of awareness), whether they know it , have integrated it,  or not.  

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, Moksha said:

0 is nothing. 1 is everything. Infinity is nothing and everything.

I like that <3 

[Dodo]

@Member When we are talking about enlightenment, we are talking about authenticity. 

Oh yes, babies are some of the most authentic beings out there. Enlightenment is not about knowing some truth, it's about being yourself completely. And not the changing egoic image selves - no. 

So By your responses I see that you have some glorified state as Enlightenment, while in truth its the most natural thing. It is always here. When you speak from the heart you ARE enlightened. There is only one Heart-You. There are many other alter-egos, but only one Heart you. Thats the one who is enlightened. It's not about knowing some truth and being able to school somebody  

Edited October 4, 2020 by Dodo