Here's why I think Trump has chances in 2020

[Parththakkar12]

I would expect the world crises to prompt everyone to move down a Spiral stage or two. I expect to see more Stage Blue in the near future in America, more nationalism. I think America actually needs Stage Blue. Whenever a civilization/country faces a threat, you need Stage Blue nationalists/experienced conservatives to come forward and say 'Okay. We need to band together and collectively rebuild a new country/civilization. We have a ton of experience with the old systems, so we have an idea of what works vs what doesn't work. We need to guide the youngsters in doing so.'

There are certain aspects of Stage Blue that no other stage can provide such as:

• Unification as a civilization/community.
• Defining a common good/bad, intuition for what's good or bad for their civilization/religion. This is needed, believe it or not. This can have a unifying effect.
• Contribution to your community/civilization, stepping up to protect it when it's threatened. This we can see with especially the army.
• Creating a sense of 'normalcy'. Normalcy or norms are needed for collective survival and they get created only at Blue.
• Experience with potential threats your collective could face and how they got resolved in the past. This is what they know that youngsters don't know. This is where a lot of young progressives go wrong.

I'm not saying that we should 'go back to the rosy old past'. People say that when they get hyper-identified and absolutist with their civilization/ideology/morality which is egotism. What I am saying though is that you need Stage Blue to either protect your current civilization, or build a new civilization if this one collapses.

Trump is more favorable to Blue than Biden or any Dem. This is why I think Trump has chances. What do you think?

[Epikur]

@Parththakkar12

I am color blind so my reasoning is the BLM and democrats crossed the line. They look like lost cause. Trump looks like the only adult in the room. 

His approval will probably be higher than ever before.

[Extreme Z7]

This strikes eerily to me of the mentality that America had in reaction to the 9/11 attacks.

[Preety_India]

It actually won't happen. Trump is just a phase that will be gone with the wind. And a new season will come to America. 

Trump might win the election but that's only because he is too lucky to have a weak opponent like Biden. 

Trump will soon be forgotten and America will be over Trump before Trump knows it 

 

[Epikur]

13 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

It actually won't happen. Trump is just a phase that will be gone with the wind. And a new season will come to America. 

Trump might win the election but that's only because he is too lucky to have a weak opponent like Biden. 

Trump will soon be forgotten and America will be over Trump before Trump knows it 

 

You are an optimist. The most violent cities seem to be led by democrats. So if they win there might be even more of such cities.

 

[Preety_India]

@Epikur  democrats aren't creating it. People are. People will change. Humanity will be more peaceful over time. You are not seeing the bigger picture. 

The times we are living in are much less violent than the horrors of second world War and centuries before that. Humanity was very cruel and there was no dignity or value for human rights. 

Now even third world countries are trying to honor human rights. 

So why will a first world country like the United States go backwards? 

In the broader picture it doesn't make sense. 

America is on a threshold where people are confused about priorities and Trump was able to take advantage of the tension. 

Once the tension ceases, people won't elect someone like Trump. 

The direction of humanity is positive 

But that doesn't mean that we won't suffer as a collective species. We will still. But not in the form of war or violence, but we will suffer in terms of unemployment, population explosion, Scarcity of resources, economic crisis, climate crisis, hurricanes, tsunamis, natural disasters, epidemic and pandemics, Cancer, suicides. Evil will exist in another form. 

And humanity will try hard again to conquer this. However 400 years ago, conquering human problems was easy. All you had to do was replace a leader, sign a memorandum, change the constitution,make new rules. This was possible in a blue stage system by creating a shared values and law system. 

However problems of humanity are going to be more complex from here on. Now Blue stage cannot handle this problem. For example, the war on drugs. Even if you arrest people who circulate drugs, drug users will always find a way to use drugs. How many people will you put in prison? So even if you make strict laws and tell people to obey or get penalized, it doesn't work. Similarly if you made a law for people to stop using plastic, they will still use plastic, you can't monitor how each and every person behaves or what they do under a Blue System no matter how strict you are. You can't make people nationalistic if they want interracial relationships. At some point Blue Stage governments like in India were against suicide and they criminalized suicide. But it didn't solve the problem since it's an individual problem the government cannot control through rules. That's why recently the Indian government decided to decriminalize suicide. Thus we need stage Green and Stage Turquoise here. Because in stage Green you have the basic rules of Blue but you give people the freedom to decide. In stage Green people are conscious enough to make their own decisions. They will not do drugs because they know drugs are harmful. They will not use plastic because stage green people know that plastic is dangerous for environment. Stage Green will take self responsibility just like stage Yellow. So government rules to solve such problems will not be required. People will become conscious and solve it on their own. 

Consider the example of this forum 

In a stage Blue forum like this we need a leader like Leo and a group of moderators. It's needed because people can say offensive things or derail a discussion or start trolling. Now this is because these people are in stage Blue. They need control and power to be told to stop in order for them to stop. 

Now let's imagine the forum in Stage Green and Stage Turquoise. Here people would be conscious on their own. They will not need to be told what to do. In other words they will self moderate. Like stage Yellow, in this tier people will take responsibility for their own behavior. They will criticize themselves. They will make conscious decisions and not troll. They will automatically single out a person who is trolling a discussion and opt to cancel the person from the discussion by opting to not respond to him/her. They will self segregate and create their own space of healthy conversations and the trolls will be automatically taken care of. Because nobody will pay attention to a troll. Thus they will self moderate and you won't require much action from moderators because most people will automatically follow guidelines and rules. Thus a stage Blue will slowly become redundant as stage Green progresses towards Turquoise. 

As you see in the world, most countries that are Blue are gradually turning green in support of the environment in order to adjust to the needs of the environment. 

Now rigid blue system or governments that still remain in stage Blue or Orange will fail to adopt this change or adjustment and suffer greatly. 

So if the United States continues to stay in Stage Blue or Orange and doesn't evolve then it will have problems that it won't be able to handle and the problems will get worse thus crumbling the system. 

Whereas a country that quickly adjusts to new circumstances and adopts Green policy where people are made aware of the dangers of drugs or environmental destruction and handed the freedom to create change on their own these countries will safely crossover and continue to make progress without any bottlenecks. 

So there is still hope for humanity as long as humanity is ready to make the big leap into stage Green and then Turquoise.. The thing is stage Green requires a lot of selflessness and empathy. This means you need to think not just about yourself but you have to think about humanity in general. Once people take self responsibility for the change they want in the world, by not doing drugs or not doing things that are harmful to others, the problems of the world will be brought under some control and there will be hope towards a permanent resolution. Till then we are stuck. 

So violence or no violence has nothing to do with Trump. And a stage Blue leader also cannot do anything about it. This is a people issue. These people will have to take self responsibility and move into Stage Green of no violence and move towards Turquoise.. 

 

[Raze]

Trump has no chance at this point. If you look at the polls and study the map it's obvious. I know polls said Hillary would win, but it's not the same, even if the polls are as wrong now and you remove the lead Hillary had from Biden's lead, he's still winning by a lot.

[Epikur]

26 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Epikur  democrats aren't creating it. People are. People will change. Humanity will be more peaceful over time. You are not seeing the bigger picture. 

The times we are living in are much less violent than the horrors of second world War and centuries before that. Humanity was very cruel and there was no dignity or value for human rights. 

Now even third world countries are trying to honor human rights. 

So why will a first world country like the United States go backwards? 

In the broader picture it doesn't make sense. 

America is on a threshold where people are confused about priorities and Trump was able to take advantage of the tension. 

Once the tension ceases, people won't elect someone like Trump. 

The direction of humanity is positive 

But that doesn't mean that we won't suffer as a collective species. We will still. But not in the form of war or violence, but we will suffer in terms of unemployment, population explosion, Scarcity of resources, economic crisis, climate crisis, hurricanes, tsunamis, natural disasters, epidemic and pandemics, Cancer, suicides. Evil will exist in another form. 

And humanity will try hard again to conquer this. However 400 years ago, conquering human problems was easy. All you had to do was replace a leader, sign a memorandum, change the constitution,make new rules. This was possible in a blue stage system by creating a shared values and law system. 

However problems of humanity are going to be more complex from here on. Now Blue stage cannot handle this problem. For example, the war on drugs. Even if you arrest people who circulate drugs, drug users will always find a way to use drugs. How many people will you put in prison? So even if you make strict laws and tell people to obey or get penalized, it doesn't work. Similarly if you made a law for people to stop using plastic, they will still use plastic, you can't monitor how each and every person behaves or what they do under a Blue System no matter how strict you are. You can't make people nationalistic if they want interracial relationships. At some point Blue Stage governments like in India were against suicide and they criminalized suicide. But it didn't solve the problem since it's an individual problem the government cannot control through rules. That's why recently the Indian government decided to decriminalize suicide. Thus we need stage Green and Stage Turquoise here. Because in stage Green you have the basic rules of Blue but you give people the freedom to decide. In stage Green people are conscious enough to make their own decisions. They will not do drugs because they know drugs are harmful. They will not use plastic because stage green people know that plastic is dangerous for environment. Stage Green will take self responsibility just like stage Yellow. So government rules to solve such problems will not be required. People will become conscious and solve it on their own. 

Consider the example of this forum 

In a stage Blue forum like this we need a leader like Leo and a group of moderators. It's needed because people can say offensive things or derail a discussion or start trolling. Now this is because these people are in stage Blue. They need control and power to be told to stop in order for them to stop. 

Now let's imagine the forum in Stage Green and Stage Turquoise. Here people would be conscious on their own. They will not need to be told what to do. In other words they will self moderate. Like stage Yellow, in this tier people will take responsibility for their own behavior. They will criticize themselves. They will make conscious decisions and not troll. They will automatically single out a person who is trolling a discussion and opt to cancel the person from the discussion by opting to not respond to him/her. They will self segregate and create their own space of healthy conversations and the trolls will be automatically taken care of. Because nobody will pay attention to a troll. Thus they will self moderate and you won't require much action from moderators because most people will automatically follow guidelines and rules. Thus a stage Blue will slowly become redundant as stage Green progresses towards Turquoise. 

As you see in the world, most countries that are Blue are gradually turning green in support of the environment in order to adjust to the needs of the environment. 

Now rigid blue system or governments that still remain in stage Blue or Orange will fail to adopt this change or adjustment and suffer greatly. 

So if the United States continues to stay in Stage Blue or Orange and doesn't evolve then it will have problems that it won't be able to handle and the problems will get worse thus crumbling the system. 

Whereas a country that quickly adjusts to new circumstances and adopts Green policy where people are made aware of the dangers of drugs or environmental destruction and handed the freedom to create change on their own these countries will safely crossover and continue to make progress without any bottlenecks. 

So there is still hope for humanity as long as humanity is ready to make the big leap into stage Green and then Turquoise.. The thing is stage Green requires a lot of selflessness and empathy. This means you need to think not just about yourself but you have to think about humanity in general. Once people take self responsibility for the change they want in the world, by not doing drugs or not doing things that are harmful to others, the problems of the world will be brought under some control and there will be hope towards a permanent resolution. Till then we are stuck. 

So violence or no violence has nothing to do with Trump. And a stage Blue leader also cannot do anything about it. This is a people issue. These people will have to take self responsibility and move into Stage Green of no violence and move towards Turquoise.. 

 

So the simplified version of what your are writing is that if the people will be good things will be good otherwise things will be bad. 

Because there were no world wars recently that means things are better. That is only one perspective. One can argue that things got better because it is much much more dangerous to make a mistake than in the past. If you make a big mistake nowadays a mistake like a nuclear war it is game over. 

I am with Nassim Taleb. You can not forsee black swan events. It is just not possible. I think the most important thing for politics is to not go into a big war. Everything else is relatively small potatoes. We already see USA is no more playing world police. The lion makes a pause the hyenas come out for example in Syria and Libya. Other empires are enhancing their power. We are getting closer to the pattern before the first world war or business as usual that is struggle for power. 





 

Edited June 10, 2020 by Epikur

[Preety_India]

@Epikur  there won't be wars don't worry. 

We are in a much better place.. 

But we have miles to go to solve the common man's problems. And also the environment. 

 

 

[Epikur]

1 minute ago, Preety_India said:

@Epikur  there won't be wars don't worry. 

We are in a much better place.. 

But we have miles to go to solve the common man's problems. And also the environment. 

 

 

The guys in Syria and Libya might object about your perception of reality.

[Preety_India]

@Epikur  that's because the whole world is not at stage Green and Turquoise yet 

 

 

[Epikur]

3 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Epikur  that's because the whole world is not at stage Green and Turquoise yet

You said there will be no wars. But  there are wars already. Maybe I am just having some form of illusion about logic here. 

 

 

[Preety_India]

@Epikur I said there will be. Not there are. I was talking about the future. 

 

[Epikur]

14 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Epikur I said there will be. Not there are. I was talking about the future. 

 

Ok you could be right if you talk about in 20 plus years. The current wars will probably not stop today and will go on tomorrow that is future.

[Bodigger]

4 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Trump might win the election but that's only because he is too lucky to have a weak opponent like Biden. 

Is it too much for us to call it a blessing.

@Parththakkar12  has done well with his words, in which, I have been attempting to say for a while now.

[Preety_India]

@Bodigger what blessing are you talking about? 

I didn't get what you meant 

 

Edited June 10, 2020 by Preety_India

[Bodigger]

7 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

@Bodigger what blessing are you talking about? 

I see people use the word Blessing as well as Luck.  In my experience, Blessing is used when we are in harmony with the action, and Luck is used when we are in contention.  In my opinion, what @Parththakkar12  has illustrated, is a blessing to the collective so we can relax and know that the world is perfect the way it is at this moment.  Having Biden as the Democrat nominee makes it less challenging for people on the fence to decide on a candidate for president, is a blessing, and did not happen by chance.

I was dissatisfied with the Obama administration, but I also felt that it was a blessing to have him as president.  More than likely, had Obama not been the president, we would not see Trump as a candidate.  Therefore, Trump is a blessing, and we need him more now.  Even at Blue......

[Danioover9000]

@Parththakkar12

8 hours ago, Parththakkar12 said:

I would expect the world crises to prompt everyone to move down a Spiral stage or two. I expect to see more Stage Blue in the near future in America, more nationalism. I think America actually needs Stage Blue. Whenever a civilization/country faces a threat, you need Stage Blue nationalists/experienced conservatives to come forward and say 'Okay. We need to band together and collectively rebuild a new country/civilization. We have a ton of experience with the old systems, so we have an idea of what works vs what doesn't work. We need to guide the youngsters in doing so.'

There are certain aspects of Stage Blue that no other stage can provide such as:

• Unification as a civilization/community.
• Defining a common good/bad, intuition for what's good or bad for their civilization/religion. This is needed, believe it or not. This can have a unifying effect.
• Contribution to your community/civilization, stepping up to protect it when it's threatened. This we can see with especially the army.
• Creating a sense of 'normalcy'. Normalcy or norms are needed for collective survival and they get created only at Blue.
• Experience with potential threats your collective could face and how they got resolved in the past. This is what they know that youngsters don't know. This is where a lot of young progressives go wrong.

I'm not saying that we should 'go back to the rosy old past'. People say that when they get hyper-identified and absolutist with their civilization/ideology/morality which is egotism. What I am saying though is that you need Stage Blue to either protect your current civilization, or build a new civilization if this one collapses.

Trump is more favorable to Blue than Biden or any Dem. This is why I think Trump has chances. What do you think?

   Yes, I think there are chances that Trump might win. That's my projection, but also your projection of the future. You haven't factored in China, Russia, North Korea, and other countries though, which could trigger easily a nuclear war and other sabotages. Alternatively, we could have Joe Biden/Hillery Clinton, so yikes, what can we do?

   Yes, in the context of the collective protecting itself, it seems to involve a majority that's stage blue/orange than other colors. This is probably why the Dalai Lama said 'Europe belongs to Europeans' in front of a leftist party's election in Sweden, to remind the collective there that don't simply take in refugees and that's that, but train them well and send them back to help their homeland develop. Instead, people get triggered at the holy man, a man that is at stage turquoise, has the siddhi to alter wethers, that experienced how the Chinese treated the Tibetans, that is wiser than them. That's the projection of the masses, it seems it can't be helped...

[Preety_India]

@Bodigger  if you think that Trump is a blessing that I don't know what to tell you. 

But if you mean Trump is a blessing in a retrospective sense where an anti-Trump will come to power in a similar fashion as you described with Obama and Trump, then yes I agree that Trump coming to power can be a blessing to those who are very eager to put that joke and the likes of him out of office for good and forever. 

 

[Bodigger]

@Preety_India  It is only an observation regarding the differences of when Blessing and Luck are used.  Would you feel comfortable with Green and Turquoise taking on Red?  This is what I mean about Trump as a Blessing.

Good point @Danioover9000