Is Friendship Really Necessary?

[Nervtine]

 What do you think? Are rich friendships essential for the good life? 

These do count as external sources, and so far in my development, I've realized true happiness only can be found within. 

If so, how are some ways to gain healthier views on friendships, and what are attributes of being a good friend? 

Also, tell me if I am flogging a dead horse if that's what you think! 

[Shadowraix]

Not necessary, but it's a deep rooted need you'd have to work on. It's not bad to have friends, I mean you are in this story, so why not have a little fun with it? Enjoy it! 

[Hellspeed]

Friendship is something that happens with similar people, having similar vibes. In the majority of cases is not something you choose. True friends are not those who searched for one another. 

[Commodent]

It's enjoyable but not necessary. Having a dog could be just as, or even more, rewarding.

[RawJudah]

Of course you need friends, life can be miserable without people to do fun things with.

Just make sure they are positive people and are into the same stuff you're into.

And beware of fake friends, you need to learn to screen them out of your life.

[Nervtine]

 

11 hours ago, RawJudah said:

Just make sure they are positive people

@RawJudah Doesn't that put an expectation on how you want them to act though? I think I get what you mean, but I also would want to be around them in all shades of life, not only when they are being positive. But in general, I think you are right- finding people who elevate you and take care of themselves are good all around. 

  

 On this for everyone, what is some advice for friendship in adulthood? An intro to how to come across good folks would be very appreciated. 

[JohnnyBravo]

Lets define friendship. Someone you can be yourself around and not be judged. Someone you trust. Mutual seeing each other for the real you.

To me, friendship facilitates enlightenment. You dont wear your mask around friends.

Imagine walking around 24/7 with no mask on because you feel so safe, connected and trusting of everything?

To me, friendship of sincerity has a lack of attachment on a certain level. The investment is not a pressure but a free happy choice.

And here is the thing.....a real friend you never ever ever ever question losing them. You KNOW you are connected for life. The thought of losing them or the relationship falling never comes to your mind. The intimacy is that profound.

Hence why friends you havent seen in 5 years, when you see them again, its as if nothing has changed. Nothing was ever lost.

So i believe genuine intimacy with friends dissolves the ego rather than strengthens the masquarade.

Look at couples that have been together for 20 years out of their own choice. They are extremely humble. Such couples are not common....

[bejapuskas]

@Nervtine  The only thing that is essential is food, water, warmth and shelter. However, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't be nice to the people around you, because „you don't need them for true happiness“. Also pay attention to this pushing forward, would you like someone to take you as a mere boost in their life? 

I found this short paragraph in the book Zen mind: beginner's mind by a zen master Shunryu Suzuki, hope you like it  (btw I am translating from my mother tongue, so please don't blame me if it isn't exactly the same as in the original)

Once upon a time, there were two good friends, Chokei and Hofuku. Once they were talking about the path of bodhisattva. Chokei said: „Even if arhat (Enlightened being) would have bad desires, tathagata (Buddha) still wouldn't judge. He doesn't have two kinds of words. He has words, but they aren't dualistic.“. Hofuku answered: „Even though you speak like this, your understanding is not perfect.“. Chokei asked: „Tell me, how do you understand the words od tathagata?“. But Hofuku replied: „We've said a lot of things already, let's drink some tea!“.

[Nervtine]

@bejapuskas Very good insights there. One of my issues after I've started being authentic 24/7, I've begun to treat everyone like my friend/nice since haven't seen a border between them and myself in some time. Sometimes I feel friendship itself is a border people put up, i.e. "I will treat this person with kindness because they give me something in return. And those who aren't them won't be treated with this same kindness." I just don't think that's fair or believe in that. And that's where I think friendship as society knows it, is conceptually flawed. 

8 hours ago, bejapuskas said:

But Hofuku replied: „We've said a lot of things already, let's drink some tea!“.

I love this bit, haha, Thank you for sharing that with me. I need to rein myself in with this, as I strongly relate to Chokei. 

 

@JohnnyBravo

9 hours ago, JohnnyBravo said:

Imagine walking around 24/7 with no mask on because you feel so safe, connected and trusting of everything?

 See the second and third sentence above. And so what if people judge, I've begun to tell myself. Candidly, why should we care? I'd want friends who have different beliefs than mine and challenge me, which usually starts with them judging what I hold dear and vice versa. 

 

9 hours ago, JohnnyBravo said:

To me, friendship of sincerity has a lack of attachment on a certain level. The investment is not a pressure but a free happy choice.

I made the mistake in previous friendships believing the opposite was true; worse even a previous friend told me this, and I thought it was toxic. (Same friend from the post I made in my Trauma thread) I am working on embodying this- or maybe that's the thing, you don't work on it. Fundamentally, I was a builder in my craft and when it came to relationships. There was a foundation that held you down, and even more layers on top of that. How I thought this was healthy is beyond me. In fact, it is more difficult to just let things happen for me as I used to think you had to shoulder through everything in life. Now I am trying to let in unfold and accept the beauty that I have no control over that. 

 I may be on track though. As I am in a relationship kinda like the one you mentioned, though it hasn't been 20 years, it's creeping close to half a decade. There is comfort knowing I could leave at any time, but I don't want to and stay out of choice. This has been a development in the last year, as I used to play the victim and pretend I had no choice at all. Until my disillusionment came knocking on my door with a sledgehammer. 

[bejapuskas]

@Nervtine  Oh yeh, I can also relate to Chokei hahahahha. Once me and my friend challenged ourselves (mostly myself though) to not talk about any intellectual topics for a week. I broke it after 17 hours accidentally hahahaha, couldn't even pay attention to it how hard it was, it's a serious addiction... Now it's better though  If I may give you some advice, talking to the opposite sex a lot really helped me, because feminine brain is not so rational and analytical and you can learn how to listen to people better etc... I also like to break social barriers with people as quickly as possible, but sometimes it is kind of rude, so I need to kind of adapt a bit... Because when I don't adapt, then I end up telling people what to do, like: „Why the hell are you so fake?“. Maybe these people need to go all the way through this stage in their lives and you can just point gently to certain areas, where they can and are willing to improve, forceful conversations are rarely mutually beneficial from my experience.

[Nervtine]

13 minutes ago, bejapuskas said:

Oh yeh, I can also relate to Chokei hahahahha. Once me and my friend challenged ourselves (mostly myself though) to not talk about any intellectual topics for a week. I broke it after 17 hours accidentally hahahaha, couldn't even pay attention to it how hard it was, it's a serious addiction...

@bejapuskas Gosh, I dunno if I could even last 17 hours, haha. Thinking (I mean, that in general too) about those kind of topics is my number one addiction above all else. 

 

15 minutes ago, bejapuskas said:

If I may give you some advice, talking to the opposite sex a lot really helped me, because feminine brain is not so rational and analytical and you can learn how to listen to people better etc...

  As far as I know, my fiancee is the opposite sex and they are the main person I talk to, so that's a good check. I usually favor talking to guys (half the people on here think I am a guy, so sorry for ruining the illusion) so another plus. In some ways, it's a lot harder for me to talk to women, even though biologically I have those bits. I am defiantly more rational and analytical, and one of my greater challenges has been learning to truly embrace my feminine side. 

21 minutes ago, bejapuskas said:

 I also like to break social barriers with people as quickly as possible, but sometimes it is kind of rude, so I need to kind of adapt a bit... Because when I don't adapt, then I end up telling people what to do, like: „Why the hell are you so fake?“. Maybe these people need to go all the way through this stage in their lives and you can just point gently to certain areas, where they can and are willing to improve, forceful conversations are rarely mutually beneficial from my experience.

Haha, I relate strongly to this. I usually try to engage in deeper topics right away- something like this: 

Stranger breaking the ice:"Fine weather today, huh?"

Me:"Have you recognized how every one of your choices affected the person you are today? And how has your development gone on working past your firmly established disillusions and growing to be a greater individual as a whole?" 

Stranger exits stage left. 

 I've been working on being less blunt as well. Trying to get to know them first, then trying to see if they want something of substance. We all need to go through certain stages- in fact, we are in some stage now, whether we realize it or not- to become who we are tomorrow. The willingness to improve is paramount. One of my biggest past mistakes was thinking I could help people, even if they didn't want my help. I mean, I only wasted a few years of my life doing that, whoopsie daises. 

[RawJudah]

13 hours ago, Nervtine said:

 

@RawJudah Doesn't that put an expectation on how you want them to act though? I think I get what you mean, but I also would want to be around them in all shades of life, not only when they are being positive. But in general, I think you are right- finding people who elevate you and take care of themselves are good all around. 

  

 On this for everyone, what is some advice for friendship in adulthood? An intro to how to come across good folks would be very appreciated. 

I meant so they have a positive attitude about life, and are generally friendly people. They are the ones you want as friends. Obviously they aren't going to be happy all the time, but neither will you.

I honestly think having good friends leads to us having a better life. 

But they are hard to find!

[bejapuskas]

47 minutes ago, Nervtine said:

As far as I know, my fiancee is the opposite sex and they are the main person I talk to, so that's a good check. I usually favor talking to guys (half the people on here think I am a guy, so sorry for ruining the illusion) so another plus. In some ways, it's a lot harder for me to talk to women, even though biologically I have those bits. I am defiantly more rational and analytical, and one of my greater challenges has been learning to truly embrace my feminine side. 

Are you on nofap?  Also try going to social events and just talking to random people. That probably helps me the most, just joining someone at a table and asking them questions naturally. I know it's hard to find some time for that, but if you have the chance... Maybe you can even do it on the family meetings, like weddings, birthdays etc.. don't be so shy and chat up the people you've never met before, they aren't that boring  What has also helped me a lot was listening to some good emotional music or watching quality movies/anime, you can just completely open up, even cry...

51 minutes ago, Nervtine said:

Stranger breaking the ice:"Fine weather today, huh?"

Me:"Have you recognized how every one of your choices affected the person you are today? And how has your development gone on working past your firmly established disillusions and growing to be a greater individual as a whole?" 

Stranger exits stage left. 

 I've been working on being less blunt as well. Trying to get to know them first, then trying to see if they want something of substance. We all need to go through certain stages- in fact, we are in some stage now, whether we realize it or not- to become who we are tomorrow. The willingness to improve is paramount. One of my biggest past mistakes was thinking I could help people, even if they didn't want my help. I mean, I only wasted a few years of my life doing that, whoopsie daises. 

I see... Just work on yourself I guess and then people will see, that you live a good life, that you are at peace all the time, that you are a good listener, very compassionate... They will ask for advice themselves  Or just whenever someone shares their secret with you, maybe your fiancee, try to help them, question what they are saying, so that they can think about it more deeply themselves, don't build the conversation around you.

[Nervtine]

8 hours ago, bejapuskas said:

 Also try going to social events and just talking to random people. That probably helps me the most, just joining someone at a table and asking them questions naturally. I know it's hard to find some time for that, but if you have the chance... Maybe you can even do it on the family meetings, like weddings, birthdays etc.. don't be so shy and chat up the people you've never met before, they aren't that boring  What has also helped me a lot was listening to some good emotional music or watching quality movies/anime, you can just completely open up, even cry..

@bejapuskas I'm not sure how it is connected, but yeah, I don't go against the rules of nofap, if I remember them correctly.  In a way, it isn't too scary to think of going up to strangers- it just that I rarely get the opportunity as a stay at home writer and artist. Evocative music has been a huge help to me in the past few years, so good call.

Overall, thank you for the advice! 

[bejapuskas]

@Nervtine  I think it is connected, because by relapsing, a lot of your creative energy is being wasted. And creative energy can be used for all sorts of things, it isn't just sexual thing.  You most likely know that as an artist. My point is not to judge people when talking with them, let everyone be your master.  

[Joseph Maynor]

Social activity is more necessary than friendships.  Friendships are like blossoms that arise in social activity.  But you do need some social activity -- which a lot of people satisfy in unhealthy ways like with TV.