The phenomenon of fragmentation

[Faceless]

9 minutes ago, starsofclay said:

Perhaps we'll be integrated by then ?

Yeah, but only in the cessation of this process of fragmentation can there be integration.

That’s why understanding holistically this phenomenon of fragmentation as (one single movement) is essential. If there is no understanding there can be no awareness of this movement in motion. 

Action must be whole in order to stop this pattern of division from manifesting. Because fragmented action will only feed itself. 

Or as I have put it before..

 THE SELF FEEDING LOOP ⭕️ OF CAUSALITY WILL CONTINUE TO NOURISH ITS OWN DIVISIVE MOVEMENT. 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Seeing this holistically is its own action.

One will not need to act after seeing/understanding this phenomenon as movement. 

There is no gap between the seeing-understanding and action. 

The seeing-understanding is action. This is to have a holistic insight into the whole nature of fragmentation. That insight is whole action in and of itself. This is intelligent action unbound by the conditioned movement of self-thought. 

 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Without this whole understanding awareness will always be dualistic, therefore not awareness. 

 

[Ingit]

@Faceless @robdl  WOW that was great both of you explained well... I can see how the reaction goes creating a self loops and loops and never ending loops !

[Ingit]

@Faceless I read it and settled in my Mind... but how to bring out the real understanding or the real power of this concept cuz I now feel very settled knowing that wow my Mind is such a mess but i know tomorrow I will be the same again back to my old self and forgetting all for a moment.

[Faceless]

9 minutes ago, Ingit said:

@Faceless I read it and settled in my Mind... but how to bring out the real understanding or the real power of this concept cuz I now feel very settled knowing that wow my Mind is such a mess but i know tomorrow I will be the same again back to my old self and forgetting all for a moment.

Is it a mere concept?

Or do you see this movement actually in yourself as a fact? 

Not some information other than yourself,(abstract), but to see that in your self actually. 

To conform to a concept is one and the same movement as feeding the self; action influenced by this false division between the entity conceiving and that which it conceives, and between the entity that conforms and that which it conforms too. 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Everything I talk about is phenomenon that can be seen in oneself. With careful/unbound/non-resistant observation. Not at all do I see any of it as concept (abstraction). If we see it all as conceptual, then we have placed it as being seperate from the self. Again another movement of division-fragmentation. 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless

[Ingit]

@Faceless You explain it great but I dont get you.    I see this circle in myself too, Im driven with my thoughts of fear and doubt and then They force me inside creating more thoughts to get rid of them...Getting rid of them are just another fragmented part of Fear and doubt... and it continues........ I can see it but iM not fully satisfied inside sometimes by these understandings.... IDK why

[Faceless]

2 minutes ago, Ingit said:

@Faceless You explain it great but I dont get you.    I see this circle in myself too, Im driven with my thoughts of fear and doubt and then They force me inside creating more thoughts to get rid of them...Getting rid of them are just another fragmented part of Fear and doubt... and it continues........ I can see it but iM not fully satisfied inside sometimes by these understandings.... IDK why

It’s ok. So we keep at it until we understand is all. 

 

[Faceless]

@Ingit

I’ll tell you this, in most cases it seems to just snap all of a sudden. 

[Ingit]

@Faceless ?? Why don’t I satisfy with understanding... might be that a fragmented part of my fear !!! Wont be?

[robdl]

6 minutes ago, Ingit said:

@Faceless You explain it great but I dont get you.    I see this circle in myself too, Im driven with my thoughts of fear and doubt and then They force me inside creating more thoughts to get rid of them...Getting rid of them are just another fragmented part of Fear and doubt... and it continues........ I can see it but iM not fully satisfied inside sometimes by these understandings.... IDK why

Yeah, If there is division in thought —between the thinker and their thoughts, between the “I” and that which it fears  — then the thought-division (fear) pattern perpetuates, gets nourished.

If there’s an “I” that “thinks” it’s seeing all of this, that can subtly be the thought-division in disguise.

Edited September 1, 2018 by robdl

[Ingit]

@robdl What?? Can a thought itself gets divided into two...!!! ?? the thoughts are thought.

[robdl]

1 minute ago, Ingit said:

@robdl What?? Can a thought itself gets divided into two...!!! ?? the thoughts are thought.

The division-fragmentation that creates the apparent separation between “I” and the remainder of thought. Not talking about the split of a single thought.

[robdl]

@Ingit I’d go back to the first page, my first post in this thread for additional clarity on this division in thought/thinking. 

Go through it slowly

Edited September 1, 2018 by robdl

[Faceless]

Right now one may be thinking in response to what we are saying.

There is apparently “the i” and “the i” is responding with this movement of thought to understand what we are saying. 

So we have already came into this with divided attention, or are pre-assuming very subtly, that “the i” is different from that movement of thinking itself. 

Any attempt to understand that which is whole, with divided attention, such as above, will lead to incoherent understanding. 

It’s like starting a math problem off incorrectly. Every step applied after that mistake will lead to the inevitable error in the end. 

The error here being thought splitting the i and the movement of thought. 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless

[Ingit]

@robdl

What happens when there is awareness with no distorting lens (a lens that has been put together by thought)?

 This line didn’t resonate well inside me... What do you mean!!!  Awareness is a thought, Unfragmented thought?

[robdl]

2 minutes ago, Ingit said:

@robdl

What happens when there is awareness with no distorting lens (a lens that has been put together by thought)?

 This line didn’t resonate well inside me... What do you mean!!!  Awareness is a thought, Unfragmented thought?

When there is awareness with no distorting lens, then there is unconditioned awareness; true meditation. Seeing-understanding of the whole structure of thought-self rather than being stuck within the loop via the lens-division.

[Ingit]

@Faceless  Its the thought on thought loop.? I can see... A thought —->Fragmenting itself into much more... I a thought thinking and conceptualising another thought...and so on

[Faceless]

3 minutes ago, robdl said:

rather than being stuck within the loop via the lens-division.

Which leads to this divided action; I will dissolve my ego by meditation, chemicals, knowledge and so on. This is all subtle forms or control. 

Edited September 1, 2018 by Faceless