The Tension Before the Approach

[Natasha Tori Maru]

6 minutes ago, Ulax said:

My interpretation was you were arguing that someone's understanding of their inner experiences ought to be prioritised over an outsider's understanding of them

Not quite, I probably didn't formulate my point clearly enough. I’m not arguing that a persons understanding of their own inner experience should automatically be prioritised over another persons interpretation (or that self-report is infallible). My point is much narrower: when we have an inference about someone’s internal state, and that person tells us our inference doesn't match their actual experience, that should be treated as evidence worth considering. It should prompt some healthy doubt about whether our model is accurate (hence why I also raised about gathering information and testing against current models + updating if needed).

They may be wrong about themselves, and we may be wrong about them. Neither position should be treated as automatically infallible. But in this specific case, given forum history and context (always asserting how "things are for women" or how "I am", lack of openness in this domain, lack of enquiry or probing questions, demonstrated inability to update models or drop frame, and general uncharitable engagement) my position is well founded. 

[Jirh]

1 hour ago, Inliytened1 said:

Hey he is claiming her...I kinda wanted dibbs but he beat me to it.  Not cringe.  She's quality.

Not sure where we are gonna find her elsewhere.

OMG! 🤢

What's the matter with you guys?

Thank God I'm not a female on this forum.

[Inliytened1]

5 hours ago, Jirh said:

OMG! 🤢

What's the matter with you guys?

Thank God I'm not a female on this forum.

What's the matter with us?  Do you really want that list?  Cuz it's fucking long.

I'm glad you're not too.  Would have been another surprise though.  Mellowmarsh plays a really good guy.

[Ulax]

6 hours ago, Jirh said:

OMG! 🤢

What's the matter with you guys?

Thank God I'm not a female on this forum.

Apologies, yes. All of us men on the forum are one hive mind, and so responsible for the acts of every other dude

[Joseph Maynor]

6 hours ago, Jirh said:

OMG! 🤢

What's the matter with you guys?

Thank God I'm not a female on this forum.

Sad but true haha.

[Inliytened1]

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Apologies, yes. All of us men on the forum are one hive mind, and so responsible for the acts of every other dude

Haha thats awesome.  We're a hive mind.  

Edited 5 hours ago by Inliytened1

[AION]

13 hours ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@Valach haha 

Omg! Again trying to tell me how I feel or how I work! 

How can you not see this? 

Literally mansplaning. Surely you are aware enough to see how weird you are being? 

I don’t know but I tried to be nice with you but you simply don’t get it. 
 

The world doesn’t evolve around your demands and conditions for men. 
 

High quality men independently have their demands and standards. And if you don’t meet those you are not part of the party. 
 

And don’t be mistaken. Men are the prize. 80% of women go for the top 10% of men. And you saying you don’t. I frankly don’t believe it. But you don’t even are eligible. And I’m not part of the 10-20% of men so I’m not eligible but I’m not butt hurt about it. 

I admit I would like to be part of that high quality of men. Why not? Why is wanting to be high quality bad? And why is it for you to be high quality women and be desired bad? Everything about you leaks that you want to be that woman. That is why these topics are so sensitive for you. 
 

To be honest I do get girls I want but I have to work much harder for it than the high quality men. I could be like you be butt hurt about it. Or be like one of the mother Natasha cult members and throw a hissy fit that life is not fair but life is not fair.

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, AION said:

I don’t know but I tried to be nice with you but you simply don’t get it. 
 

The world doesn’t evolve around your demands and conditions for men. 
 

High quality men independently have their demands and standards. And if you don’t meet those you are not part of the party. 
 

And don’t be mistaken. Men are the prize. 80% of women go for the top 10% of men. And you saying you don’t. I frankly don’t believe it. But you don’t even are eligible. And I’m not part of the 10-20% of men so I’m not eligible but I’m not butt hurt about it. 

I admit I would like to be part of that high quality of men. Why not? Why is wanting to be high quality bad? And why is it for you to be high quality women and be desired bad? Everything about you leaks that you want to be that woman. That is why these topics are so sensitive for you. 
 

To be honest I do get girls I want but I have to work much harder for it than the high quality men. I could be like you be butt hurt about it. Or be like one of the mother Natasha cult members and throw a hissy fit that life is not fair but life is not fair.

Yeah but whats that 10% of men - money?  It's obvious that women go for money.

[Ulax]

2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yeah but whats that 10% of men - money?  It's obvious that women go for money.

Most in-demand guys are the ones who convey the most competence, power/influence, and social proof 

[AION]

2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yeah but whats that 10% of men - money?  It's obvious that women go for money.

Money is not the only attractor. Only having money attracts gold diggers.

This is my list from my notes:

    1.    Status/dominance — social rank, resource control, being deferred to by others

    2.    Physical vitality — health, fitness, testosterone markers (jaw, frame, posture)

    3.    Confidence/frame — self-referencing internally, not needing validation

    4.    Purpose/ambition — visible drive toward something bigger than her

    5.    Warmth/humor — the emotional payoff that makes the first four feel good to be around, not just impressive

 

[Ulax]

1 minute ago, AION said:

Money is not the only attractor. Only having money attracts gold diggers.

This is my list from my notes:

    1.    Status/dominance — social rank, resource control, being deferred to by others

    2.    Physical vitality — health, fitness, testosterone markers (jaw, frame, posture)

    3.    Confidence/frame — self-referencing internally, not needing validation

    4.    Purpose/ambition — visible drive toward something bigger than her

    5.    Warmth/humor — the emotional payoff that makes the first four feel good to be around, not just impressive

 

Humor is overrated regarding attractiveness

[Joseph Maynor]

Just now, Ulax said:

Humor is overrated regarding attractiveness

I'm glad someone said this.  You beat me to it.

[Inliytened1]

 

4 minutes ago, AION said:

Money is not the only attractor. Only having money attracts gold diggers.

This is my list from my notes:

    1.    Status/dominance — social rank, resource control, being deferred to by others

    2.    Physical vitality — health, fitness, testosterone markers (jaw, frame, posture)

    3.    Confidence/frame — self-referencing internally, not needing validation

    4.    Purpose/ambition — visible drive toward something bigger than her

    5.    Warmth/humor — the emotional payoff that makes the first four feel good to be around, not just impressive

 

That's pretty on par. On paper. But paper only goes so far.  Utlimately you just need to have money.  Being tall helps as well, because women hate short guys for whatever reason.  I'm on the shorter side so I've had to fight my whole life against that.  But yeah - ultimately bro the shit you got on your list isn't gonna mean crap.  If you come in with power, with money, that's all you neeed.

[Joseph Maynor]

2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

That's pretty on par. On paper. But paper only goes so far.  Utlimately you just need to have money.  Being tall helps as well, because women hate short guys for whatever reason.  I'm on the shorter side so I've had to fight my whole life against that.  But yeah - ultimately bro the shit you got on your list isn't gonna mean crap.  If you come in with power, with money, that's all you neeed.

I feel like women take you for how you present yourself and your inner worth.  

[Natasha Tori Maru]

20 minutes ago, AION said:

I don’t know but I tried to be nice with you but you simply don’t get it. 
 

The world doesn’t evolve around your demands and conditions for men. 
 

High quality men independently have their demands and standards. And if you don’t meet those you are not part of the party. 
 

And don’t be mistaken. Men are the prize. 80% of women go for the top 10% of men. And you saying you don’t. I frankly don’t believe it. But you don’t even are eligible. And I’m not part of the 10-20% of men so I’m not eligible but I’m not butt hurt about it. 

I admit I would like to be part of that high quality of men. Why not? Why is wanting to be high quality bad? And why is it for you to be high quality women and be desired bad? Everything about you leaks that you want to be that woman. That is why these topics are so sensitive for you. 
 

To be honest I do get girls I want but I have to work much harder for it than the high quality men. I could be like you be butt hurt about it. Or be like one of the mother Natasha cult members and throw a hissy fit that life is not fair but life is not fair.

I don't know what this is about. It seems confused. You don't know any of my wants or needs from men??? I never said or made this explicit. I never claimed life wasnt fair or complained about it. 

You can have your needs. And it's perfectly fine to want to be part of status hierarchies. 

I am saying I don't go for those guys. It's your choice not to believe it. You express so much indignation because I don't fit your model. I just don't fit your model. 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

I feel like women take you for how you present yourself and your inner worth.  

8 minutes ago, AION said:

Money is not the only attractor. Only having money attracts gold diggers.

This is my list from my notes:

    1.    Status/dominance — social rank, resource control, being deferred to by others

    2.    Physical vitality — health, fitness, testosterone markers (jaw, frame, posture)

    3.    Confidence/frame — self-referencing internally, not needing validation

    4.    Purpose/ambition — visible drive toward something bigger than her

    5.    Warmth/humor — the emotional payoff that makes the first four feel good to be around, not just impressive

 

Not at the end of the day.  It's only status that matters.

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

I feel like women take you for how you present yourself and your inner worth.  

I meant to respond to you not him.  Only status matters at the end of the day.

[Inliytened1]

6 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I don't know what this is about. It seems confused. You don't know any of my wants or needs from men??? I never said or made this explicit. I never claimed life wasnt fair or complained about it. 

You can have your needs. And it's perfectly fine to want to be part of status hierarchies. 

I am saying I don't go for those guys. It's your choice not to believe it. You express so much indignation because I don't fit your model. I just don't fit your model. 

 

You have to think like a man. We're trying to figure YOU out.  YOU. How you think. How you walk.  How you talk.  We need to know that. 

Now, I understand that you aren't like the normal chick - so, I am saying that in a general sense.

17 minutes ago, AION said:

 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by Inliytened1

[Natasha Tori Maru]

9 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

You have to think like a man. We're trying to figure YOU out.  YOU. How you think. How you walk.  How you talk.  We need to know that. 

Now, I understand that you aren't like the normal chick - so, I am saying that in a general sense.

 

I get that, but AION isn't trying to understand anything about me. He is trying to force me to fit into his model of how women work, and when I claim that's not me, that's not how I work, he is incapable of accepting that claim. 

This is why I think it's weird. And mansplany. And once again applying a sweeping generalisation to all women and how they work. No nuance. Just "all woman work that way"

Edited 5 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I get that, but AION isn't trying to understand anything about me. He is trying to force me to fit into his model of how women work, and when I claim that's not me, that's not how I work, he is incapable of accepting that claim. 

Well then I guess he brings home no prize tonight.  You see, that will stab him in the back, this blindness that you have snuffed out.