Relationship Based on Truth, Honesty & Vulnerability

[LordFall]

1 hour ago, Miguel1 said:

@LordFall Of course both are important, that goes without saying. Without human survival, there is no human spirituality and deep connection.

As always, you are deep in your orange pursuits, so you will rationalize anything for your favour.

Sure I think mastering stage orange is a great way to build a foundation for a solid life and the relationships that come with it. You keep saying that anyone that doesn't view the world the way you do is wrong. That sounds like a bias and ego deflection to me. It's your life man if you're happy with the way you're operating then more power to you. I'm just pointing out the blindspots that seem objective to me. 

When you start saying that women that want a man that has his shit together is stuck in ego then I think you've gone off the deep end. My reason for thinking that you are operating from shadow and not healthy integration of stage orange and green is you keep shaming other perspectives that aren't aligned with yours instead of understanding where they're coming from.

[MarkKol]

16 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

The point is that 99%+ people havent done the work, and are stuck in their survival ego, thus are not capable of real intimacy, vulnerability and love — but just uses the other for their own unconscious survival agendas, whether it is something gross like financial or someting sublte like trauma.

My point is the same as yours: people don't care about vulnerability.

I would rather work on a different area in life than seek extra depth or extra meaning out of an existing relationship that started because of a superficial reason in the first place; it's a hit-or-miss, most often a miss.

34 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

real intimacy, vulnerability and love

These are very nebulous feelings and conditions inside a relationship. Defining them or understanding them doesn't make it easier. It would be easier and more dependable to just love yourself more. People are animals; I don't expect them to have much depth at all, and that's fine.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Ouch that most recent link from Naftali - hard no. He is unintegrated. Just knows the words and that's it. 

 

[Joseph Maynor]

From a Feminine standpoint, I would say attraction is based on a practical demonstration of care primarily.  That opens the door to a real relationship if you are mature.

[Miguel1]

@Natasha Tori Maru Are you looking to date seriously?

If yes, how do you go about it, making sure it actually is healthy and sustainable, and based on truth and honesty as early as possible?

How do you make sure you don’t waste a ton of time with the wrong person?

Edited 4 hours ago by Miguel1

[Miguel1]

The dating space lacks integrity, honesty and vulnerability so badly that I am considering going back to my peak PUA phase and just spinning 10 girls for my own needs, treating them all as such: good for little bit of fun and intimacy but that’s it.

Especially now as I feel like I have properly moved on from my ex partner, and no longer have that same longing for a partner.

Ideally I would find one girl to build a healthy and sustainable relationship with for the rest of my life here on Earth. But how the fuck?

Edited 4 hours ago by Miguel1

[Natasha Tori Maru]

28 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

@Natasha Tori Maru Are you looking to date seriously?

I already am.

28 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

If yes, how do you go about it, making sure it actually is healthy and sustainable, and based on truth and honesty as early as possible?

I have deep self trust. I have boundaries that mean I do not overextend into unhealthy territory. I do not approval seek. I am kind as I conduct myself.

29 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

How do you make sure you don’t waste a ton of time with the wrong person?

I don't care about "wasting time" because no time is ever wasted.

I learn from every bit of my experience. Either more about myself, or another.

There is so much experience to be had, and all of it is so divine. No moment is wasted.

I feel no moment stolen.

[Miguel1]

18 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I don't care about "wasting time" because no time is ever wasted.

I learn from every bit of my experience. Either more about myself, or another.

There is so much experience to be had, and all of it is so divine. No moment is wasted.

I feel no moment stolen.

The issue is I care about wasting time with the wrong person. Whenever I am in a relationship, I care deeply about the person, and so naturally I invest a ton of time and energy into it.

If the person then ends up cheating or breaking up for some silly reason, because they ”fell out of fantasy / love”, it is a huge waste.

I have become very strongly allergic to wasting my time in relationships, as I’ve done it so many times. I’ve learned many lessons don’t get me wrong (and very appreciative) but this is definitely one of the big ones.

Besides, if you want babies, you do have a time limit. Even for men — and the worst part is that you cannot really afford to have kids with the wrong person, as it will ruin your and the baby’s life.

Edited 4 hours ago by Miguel1

[Natasha Tori Maru]

10 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

The issue is I care about wasting time with the wrong person. Whenever I am in a relationship, I care deeply about the person, and so naturally I invest a ton of time and energy into it.

If the person then ends up cheating or breaking up for some silly reason, because they ”fell out of fantasy / love”, it is a huge waste.

I have become very strongly allergic to wasting my time in relationships, as I’ve done it so many times. I’ve learned many lessons don’t get me wrong (and very appreciative) but this is definitely one of the big ones.

Besides, if you want babies, you do have a time limit. Even for men — and the worst part is that you cannot really afford to have kids with the wrong person, as it will ruin your and the baby’s life.

I don't have all these rights and wrongs. I don't have fear about making a mistake or wasting time. Kids aren't a thing for me. Even if I did deeply desire them, I would surrender to the fact that life is not mine.

I am highly unusual in my peace and acceptance with people in my life. Obviously I have friction. But I deeply accept things won't go my way. There is always more out there. But I surrender to what will be. I take action where I can, when I have the highest chance to meet a desire - but I don't have any ability to be certain of an outcome. 

I don't view any time as wasted. 

I have very, very different parameters to your typical women 🫠

I'm a bit of a freak 

Edited 3 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Jirh]

6 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I don't view any time as wasted.

Feels like you've reached an unusual level of living in the moment. Most people aren't like that, especially women.

Must feel really good being in your shoes.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

5 minutes ago, Jirh said:

Feels like you've reached an unusual level of living in the moment. Most people aren't like that, especially women.

Must feel really good being in your shoes.

I agree I don't think I am like most women.

It has not been easy getting to this spot. I was suffering a tremendous amount in the past. I was never where I wanted to be. That caused most of the problem.

Physical pain and sickness is still a challenge - that's the one time I really struggle with being and accepting the moment. Health is just massive.

Edited 3 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Jirh]

@Natasha Tori Maru Oh, sorry to hear that. Sounds like you've earned every bit of your healthy mental state. Hope you feel similarly about your physical state soon. Stay strong 🙏🏻

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Jirh thank you - and you also! I am doing excellent at the moment 😁 I have Hashimoto's which is in remission. In the past I have gone through days of being unable to leave the bed. I am very grateful to be well. 

[Jirh]

@Natasha Tori Maru 🙏🏻❤️

[Lyubov]

1 hour ago, Miguel1 said:

@Natasha Tori Maru Are you looking to date seriously?

If yes, how do you go about it, making sure it actually is healthy and sustainable, and based on truth and honesty as early as possible?

How do you make sure you don’t waste a ton of time with the wrong person?

It starts completely with you. Are you true and honest with yourself, your self talk? How you live? The choices you make? Have you observed the field long enough to be honest with yourself about your observations on how it works? How have you been observing it? With expectations you laid on top of how you think it should be? What do you mean by date seriously?

I will say you have to be careful how you approach relationships, your expectations for them and also your fundamental framing of them in the first place with your language and words you use. If you try to overly optimize or control them you turn it into another proving ground where there is a carrot on a stick you’re chasing. Everything that turns serious starts out as unserious. 

I would say if you are being responsible in your life and both truthful and honest with yourself first and foremost. the path becomes clearer and things seem to naturally unfold in due time. I’d say really do some self reflection on your beliefs about relationships first. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Lyubov

[Natasha Tori Maru]

10 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

It starts completely with you. Are you true and honest with yourself, your self talk? How you live? The choices you make? Have you observed the field long enough to be honest with yourself about your observations on how it works? How have you been observing it? With expectations you laid on top of how you think it should be? What do you mean by date seriously?

I will say you have to be careful how you approach relationships, your expectations for them and also your fundamental framing of them in the first place with your language and words you use. If you try to overly optimize or control them you turn it into another proving ground where there is a carrot on a stick you’re chasing. Everything that turns serious starts out as unserious. 

I would say if you are being responsible in your life and both truthful and honest with yourself first and foremost. the path becomes clearer and things seem to naturally unfold in due time. I’d say really do some self reflection on your beliefs about relationships first. 

Killed it. Like murdered it. First degree. Guilty. Charged. 

20 warning points 😃

Edited 2 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Miguel1]

@Lyubov Of course all of those are done. That’s a given.

What it leads to is this thread. We are talking in circles.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

2 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

@Lyubov Of course all of those are done. That’s a given.

The nature of the question seems to point toward what @Lyubov illustrates as uninspected belief. 

Your words just appear to be so loaded with judgement and attachment to outcome. And a dislike of the experience of searching. Genuine dislike. The process is where it's at.

I could be totally wrong. It just appears this way from the language you use.

[Miguel1]

@Natasha Tori Maru Yes, there is a clear disagreement between us.

Either it is misunderstanding or real, but we definitely don’t see eye to eye right now.

Relationships at my age is no children’s game. I could fuck around and find out in my 20s but right now it needs to be pretty strong from the get go for it to be worth investing in it.

Edited 2 hours ago by Miguel1

[Natasha Tori Maru]

16 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

Relationships at my age is no children’s game. 

Do you suspect this is how I view relationships?