why women fall for narcissists

[LordFall]

2 minutes ago, vibv said:

This is a Knowing. I can't explain it, it's just there.

I'm pretty sure you can access it, too, if you let go of your sanity.

Sanity acts like a shield against those things. Only by going beyond sanity will you know GOD.

But be warned, there's things you can't reverse once seen.

I understand, I think it's kinda neat to play around with different ideas in your mind. Unless you can manifest it in reality and find proof of it in the world then it's not much more useful than the homeless guy that was trying to teach me about astrophysics the other day. 

2 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

@LordFall Dude i appreciate your response but unless leo answers my question directly, within the context of the exact qoute i am referring to, then this contradiction will never be resolved. 

Leo literally said himself "pussy flocks to you when you are god" or something like that, i want to understand what this means and again, he specifically said that being god is THE HIGHEST level of game ..

No one here can related to or suddenly just become a mega millionaire celebrity or build some crazy social circle, i am interesting in game, mindset, ect.. these things are in my control, and way more realistic to implement in the short term. 

Becoming a famous millionnaire is in your control. Game is pitching yourself to women. If you have more to offer you will get more women. If you are a random guy there is a limit to the quality of experiences you can achieve and offer the women and overall people in your life. 

Depends what kind of women you're into though and what kind of life you're looking to build ultimately. 

[vibv]

10 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I understand, I think it's kinda neat to play around with different ideas in your mind. Unless you can manifest it in reality and find proof of it in the world then it's not much more useful than the homeless guy that was trying to teach me about astrophysics the other day. 

That's your sanity getting in the way  ✨

Which is fine, it has good reasons to.

What's the difference between me and that homeless guy? From your perspective: None. You have to access that Knowing yourself, no one can give it to you. That's the beauty of it.

But as soon as you do everyone - even the whole universe - starts speaking only Truth.

But they don't mean to.
What's being said is always true, what's being meant never. How's that for a paradox?

Which is why I never speak to you per se, but only ever to the Cosmos itself.

One day it'll all be understood. One day...

It's all about creating a Work Of Art and we are simultaneously the brush and the canvas.

Edited 5 hours ago by vibv

[Optimized Life]

5 minutes ago, LordFall said:

 Becoming a famous millionnaire is in your control. Game is pitching yourself to women. If you have more to offer you will get more women. If you are a random guy there is a limit to the quality of experiences you can achieve and offer the women and overall people in your life. 

yes but it takes a LONG ASS TIME 

What you expect me to do in the mean time? just not date for another 5 or 10 years? 

You can break through those limits to a large extent with persistence and lots of approaches, but of course, you can never reach the cieling of being a literal celebrity in hollywood, this is so obvious that we shouldnt even discuss it. 

I dont disagree with what you're saying per se but this isnt the question i was asking leo

Also, i am already very good looking and jacked, i am literally better looking than most a list celebrities, so any extra amount of game i can get will serve me extremely well in the meantime. 

Quote

Game is pitching yourself to women.

Thats a perspective of yours and perhaps a half truth but im not sure i would put it like that personally 

Game is just the specific way in which you relate to, and seduce women

Edited 5 hours ago by Optimized Life

[LordFall]

13 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

yes but it takes a LONG ASS TIME 

What you expect me to do in the mean time? just not date for another 5 or 10 years? 

You can break through those limits to a large extent with persistence and lots of approaches, but of course, you can never reach the cieling of being a literal celebrity in hollywood, this is so obvious that we shouldnt even discuss it. 

I dont disagree with what you're saying per se but this isnt the question i was asking leo

Also, i am already very good looking and jacked, i am literally better looking than most a list celebrities, so any extra amount of game i can get will serve me extremely well in the meantime. 

Thats a perspective of yours and perhaps a half truth but im not sure i would put it like that personally 

Game is just the specific way in which you relate to, and seduce women

You can host an event this Sunday and film it and post it on social media. You can cold approach women in the next few days to populate the event as well as DM women on Instagram/run an ad. Why wait 5-10 years? You have wrong ideas about this stuff.

16 minutes ago, vibv said:

That's your sanity getting in the way  ✨

Which is fine, it has good reasons to.

What's the difference between me and that homeless guy? From your perspective: None. You have to access that Knowing yourself, no one can give it to you. That's the beauty of it.

But as soon as you do everyone - even the whole universe - starts speaking only Truth.

But they don't mean to.
What's being said is always true, what's being meant never. How's that for a paradox?

Which is why I never speak to you per se, but only ever to the Cosmos itself.

One day it'll all be understood. One day...

It's all about creating a Work Of Art and we are simultaneously the brush and the canvas.

I've asked you for truth, proof is truth materialized in reality. I would warn against a lack of sanity to deal with the existential dread and anxiety that the problems of reality induce in us. 

[Optimized Life]

Quote

You can host an event this Sunday and film it and post it on social media. You can cold approach women in the next few days to populate the event as well as DM women on Instagram/run an ad. Why wait 5-10 years? You have wrong ideas about this stuff.

I'm done with your autistic, nerdy bullshit. 

I'm not running a fucking ad to get pussy 

@Leo Gura I had an original intelligent question on a previous page, if you can answer it thoughtfully, i will send you $5000 USD in a few years when i am rich af, and im not even joking

Edited 5 hours ago by Optimized Life

[LordFall]

2 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

I'm done with your autistic, nerdy bullshit. 

I'm not running a fucking ad to get pussy 

I think you're projecting on one of these fascets my friend. Right so you call me nerdy but you want to learn God game to optimize your cold approach? Okay bro 

It's not that crazy, all the hottest women in the world are on Instagram. You spend $30 to get 10 of them to come to your event. If that blows your mind idk you'll freak out when you find out how computers work and the technology needed to power the forum you're using now.

 

Edited 5 hours ago by LordFall

[vibv]

9 minutes ago, LordFall said:

I've asked you for truth, proof is truth materialized in reality. I would warn against a lack of sanity to deal with the existential dread and anxiety that the problems of reality induce in us. 

 

[eos_nyxia]

No one went into the very obvious trauma and female social indoctrination conditioning growing up? 

For what it's worth, manipulative people don't usually show all of their hand at first before a person is hooked, unless they are very confident in their ability to pull it off and/or are stupid. Women/ girls often have their guard up the most up at the beginning, because "strangers", and things often fall apart once that guard is down. 

If you are deeply conditioned since early childhood to accept certain things from males in your life, you will miss a lot of signs that might otherwise be clear as day. It's like a preconditioned blindness or selective seeing. This means in order to not fail at getting duped by a guy who hides his nature, you need to have the foresight to anticipate that a person is no good for you, which is often a combination of gut intuition (which we're often conditioned to ignore as girls) and knowing exactly what tells to look for before the situation escalates and gets out of control (abuse, trafficking, etc.). You need to have a clear enough sense of self, a decent understanding of people's motives, and the strength to trust in yourself even if others tell you there is nothing to worry about. You also need to feel like your well being fundamentally matters. By the way, a woman can appear confident or like she has so much social power and many different options without having any of these traits I just mentioned.

Many girls start dating when they are pretty damn young, like even in their early teens. Most people learn by getting burnt first, and then trying to learn from those experiences. From observing from the outside: by the time many women figure it out, there is a lot of bitterness and accumulated baggage. Many are done with men by that point.  This is especially true right now with the women who are opting out. 

And by "foresight", it's often straight up hypervigilance.

In my experience, do you know who is the best at predicting who is going to be a user before they get used? People who got used and abused by people growing up, especially by their own parents and caregivers. I'm that way, My husband is that way. Both of us were pretty good at avoiding getting screwed by people when we were young. There's often a terrible cost for that level of clarity and discernment when it comes to sussing. Do you want to live watching your back all the time because people always want something from you and they might be willing to destroy you in the process as long as they get what they want? It's not very fun. 

You can't desperately want to want to believe in people, for instance, because that is a blindness, which then turns into a liability. 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by eos_nyxia

[LordFall]

33 minutes ago, vibv said:

 

Personally I'm a very logical person and although I'm very intuitive as an INTP, I filter it through my logic or I don't find it helpful in my life. You might have a different experience. 

[Olaf]

@eos_nyxia if the only men you are attracted to are toxic, then being done with men makes sense. I guess, that it is a love hate relationship, they don't appreciate a men who is healthy and mature, then they are gonna stay in toxic relationships or remain single. At some point there has to be somewhat of a shift to look for peace and stability in a relationship instead of the rush of the highs and lows and the chasing, which I think happens for some woman only after the age of 40 or 30, some earlier. Also a level of self respect to not let boundaries be crossed that shouldn't be crossed. Some woman will learn early, some will never learn, others will be hurt too deeply by a narcissist to never go on a date again, who knows. This is the problem I am seeing both in the narcissist and also the codependent, they are both broken and need self respect and love. 

[vibv]

11 minutes ago, LordFall said:

Personally I'm a very logical person and although I'm very intuitive as an INTP, I filter it through my logic or I don't find it helpful in my life. You might have a different experience. 

At one point one has to transcend logic to get to the Higher Truths.

[eos_nyxia]

My first ex who I dated when I was 15 for a handful of years had a lot of narcissistic qualities, but then, I wasn't a "nice girl" at that point either. Why would I have wanted a "nice guy" when I knew deep down that I wasn't "nice" myself either? Also, beyond physical attraction, we need to have other things in common? 

I put up with a lot, but if he had actually been a consistently kind, genuine, compassionate, and sensitive person (and not a profoundly self-absorbed one), then it would have been much, much harder to inevitably leave him, and I would have had more conscience about the way I treated him the more time went on. (Like if he went into a narcissistic-type of rage-fueled meltdown, if he was a "better" person, I wouldn't have been able to laugh in his face about his behaviour and STILL feel like a decent person.) So probably not quite dynamic OP was originally referring to. My eyes were open. I wasn't exactly fooling myself. 

Also,the pairing of covert with overt (or classical) narcissists is very much a thing. How common it is exactly, I do not know. But I suspect that women tend to fall more into the covert narcissist category largely because of social conditioning and acceptability -- we really do have a spot in our cultures for overtly narcissistic men, don't we? With women, not so much (especially if you are not considered very attractive and charming as a woman). 

Secretly, covert narcissists often get to feel superior to the overt narcissist, while the covert narcissist gets to be the kinder, more moral, more responsible one. Or the victim or martyr. They get to look better to others and themselves. 

I see this dynamic a little bit in myself in retrospect: my ex got to be dumb one and I got to be the smart one. And I felt like I was the more responsible and moral one until I decided that if the relationship originally had something positive to it, it didn't anymore (which it did, again, usually there is a hook which attracts and keeps people in relationships). At that point, I didn't care about how I was seen by others or him at that point anymore, I was going to burn my bridges, and the fastest way to do that is with someone who has narcissistic tendencies to get them to release their death grip on you is to burn their fingers consistently and enough times to make it clear to them that you are NOT a food source anymore, lol. 

 

You have to want to look at what's underneath the hood, not just at the superficial dynamics. 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by eos_nyxia

[eos_nyxia]

43 minutes ago, Olaf said:

@eos_nyxia if the only men you are attracted to are toxic, then being done with men makes sense. I guess, that it is a love hate relationship, they don't appreciate a men who is healthy and mature, then they are gonna stay in toxic relationships or remain single.

Often there is a large gap between what one consciously wants and looks for and what one is willing to tolerate. With men too and what they're willing to tolerate in women (or feel that they have no choice to tolerate). Women tend to be less of a physical threat, but you still see plenty of men with abusive and narcissistic women as well. 

Quote

At some point there has to be somewhat of a shift to look for peace and stability in a relationship instead of the rush of the highs and lows and the chasing, which I think happens for some woman only after the age of 40 or 30, some earlier. Also a level of self respect to not let boundaries be crossed that shouldn't be crossed. Some woman will learn early, some will never learn, others will be hurt too deeply by a narcissist to never go on a date again, who knows. This is the problem I am seeing both in the narcissist and also the codependent, they are both broken and need self respect and love. 

If your "subconscious" is primed to look for an abusive or narcissistic man because it's all you're capable of finding, because deep down that is what you believe is Real and also probably what you deserve, then you will be constantly self-sabotaging until you take a hard look at yourself. It's a many years long project with yourself, therapy, various healing modalities, etc. Usually the only way people get to that point is because something seriously failed and they hit a rock bottom of sorts. (This is a human motivation issue, not a gender specific issue.)  

It is unreasonable and unrealistic to expect very young women or girls (or very young people in general) to pop into the world fully formed and able to discern without that experience (usually negative life experience) or positive relationship role models/ mentors to make excellent decisions and no serious mistakes. 

Edited 4 hours ago by eos_nyxia

[LordFall]

31 minutes ago, vibv said:

At one point one has to transcend logic to get to the Higher Truths.

Sure but 90% of people that try to do so don't transcend logic, they confuse delusions for useful insight. Do you know how many people in history have claimed to be prophets and given humanity some divine insights? Most of them are nonsensical, a few are legitimate and translate to real events in our shared reality. 

[vibv]

5 minutes ago, LordFall said:

Sure but 90% of people that try to do so don't transcend logic, they confuse delusions for useful insight. Do you know how many people in history have claimed to be prophets and given humanity some divine insights? Most of them are nonsensical, a few are legitimate and translate to real events in our shared reality. 

Even delusions carry a figment of Truth.

What's important is how beautiful it is, not necessarily how logical.

Edited 4 hours ago by vibv

[LordFall]

1 minute ago, vibv said:

Even delusions carry a figment of Truth.

Sure, it's not a very useful way to think about it though. You can say you're a Tomato because we are also biological and part of reality. I don't see how that will help your dating experience and life overall though. 

Becoming post-rational includes intuition AND logic. It doesn't just throw logic out of the window, that's pre-rational. 

Edited 4 hours ago by LordFall

[vibv]

9 minutes ago, LordFall said:

Sure, it's not a very useful way to think about it though. You can say you're a Tomato because we are also biological and part of reality. I don't see how that will help your dating experience and life overall though. 

Becoming post-rational includes intuition AND logic. It doesn't just throw logic out of the window, that's pre-rational. 

Of course. Sense the Truth in my words or don't. It's up to you.

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, Optimized Life said:

@Leo Gura How do you reconcile this apparent contradiction???

Are you saying : Tate's narcissistic level of game is like 8/10 but god game is 10/10, even higher and more potent? ..

i Would appreciate an answer because this contradiction is annoying 

P.S it's obvious that narcissism > being a shy, meek, autistic nerd 

But what about super confident and charming god guy whos also a good guy? does he get more girls than tate?   

Being God is the strongest form of confidence. Narcissism is like a fake toxic emulation of that. But many immature women can't tell the difference.

However, being God doesn't mean you will get laid more because to get laid it helps to be a manipulative, selfish, and a liar.

I did not promise you that being God maximizes sex. Being God trades quantity for quality and for your own sake, not the sex. Being God gives you true confidence. However, women may not care if your confidence is true or fake.

Maximizing sex and being God is contradictory.

Most narcs would lie to a woman to sleep with her. But I can't do that, so I will get less sex.

Game is not just about social skills, it also involves a lot of manipulation to get sex. An immoral person will have no restrictions on mamipulation and thus gets laid more. That's why most PUAs are immoral.

Narcs win at games of raw power because they have no moral limits. That's one of the reasons women falls for narcs. Raw survival wins at the end of the day.

You can think of narcissism as survival on steroids. And women love to survive.

Edited 2 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Olaf]

Being God is just being grounded, peaceful, stable, not anxious, therefor confident, this is ultimately the state building that is talked about in pick up. Just being present and in the moment. I like how Owen said that approaching is actually spiritual as you are learning to be present in hard circumstances, which is very true. It is easy to be present in nature, in the peace and calm, try doing that in a club while a girl pushes you and tells you to fuck off. HAHAHA

[Vynce]

24 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Being God is the strongest form of confidence. Narcissism is like a fake toxic emulation of that. But many immature women can't tell the difference.

However, being God doesn't mean you will get laid more because to get laid it helps to be a manipulative, selfish, and a liar.

I did not promise you that being God maximizes sex. Being God trades quantity for quality and for your own sake, not the sex. Being God gives you true confidence. However, women may not care if your confidence is true or fake.

Maximizing sex and being God is contradictory.

Most narcs would lie to a woman to sleep with her. But I can't do that, so I will get less sex.

Game is not just about social skills, it also involves a lot of manipulation to get sex. An immoral person will have no restrictions on mamipulation and thus gets laid more. That's why most PUAs are immoral.

Narcs win at games of raw power because they have no moral limits. That's one of the reasons women falls for narcs. Raw survival wins at the end of the day.

You can think of narcissism as survival on steroids. And women love to survive.

What would be an example of manipulation -> sex? From anything I experienced with women was that they are extra sharp in sensing if a guy is full of crap. And that the manipulation only worked for him if he believed his BS the most. Which is not a game strategy, that is just being cognitively immature no?