Depersonalisation ≠ Enlightenment

[Breakingthewall]

58 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Are you exactly the same as you are now, as you were 5, 10, 15 years ago? 

Yes in the sense that I am the recognition of myself , and myself is what is. 

Edited 4 hours ago by Breakingthewall

[Natasha Tori Maru]

11 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Yes in the sense that I am the recognition of myself , and myself is what is. 

No. In terms of history and experience. You are the exact same now as prior to the last 10 years? The same as when you were 12?

[Breakingthewall]

1 minute ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

No. In terms of history and experience. You are the exact same now as prior to the last 10 years? The same as when you were 12?

In essence yes, exactly the same always. In form no, but form is permanent change, form and change are synonyms. The yes, I'm the same than when i was 12: what is, and because is is permanent change. Same than you or everything else. 

But we are talking about the self. The self is the sense of myself , then as a self , I was the sense of myself when I was 12 and now. The content is irrelevant, the fact is relevant 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

In essence yes, exactly the same always. In form no, but form is permanent change, form and change are synonyms. The yes, I'm the same than when i was 12: what is, and because is is permanent change. Same than you or everything else. 

But we are talking about the self. The self is the sense of myself , then as a self , I was the sense of myself when I was 12 and now. The content is irrelevant, the fact is relevant 

You don't think it is strange that you have such a rigid, fixed sense of self? 

I only ask because this seems closed. Not open. Openness is something you seem to speak on a lot.

If you were to get married, have kids, and divorse - you would be EXACTLY the same as before. Your memories all the same. The experience wouldn't change you AT ALL? 

[Breakingthewall]

2 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

you were to get married, have kids, and divorse - you would be EXACTLY the same as before. Your memories all the same. The experience wouldn't change you AT ALL? 

The experience changes, but the self is not the experience, is the sense of yourself. The conversation with vegan awake was about if the self is real or not. He says that it isn't, I say that it's real, is a construction that happens being human that makes that you are aware of yourself. It's the fact of being conscious of yourself 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

The experience changes, but the self is not the experience, is the sense of yourself. The conversation with vegan awake was about if the self is real or not. He says that it isn't, I say that it's real, is a construction that happens being human that makes that you are aware of yourself. It's the fact of being conscious of yourself 

I'm speaking of the personality self.

Not Self.

This is why I ask you, because I think you are speaking of a different thing.

[Breakingthewall]

7 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I'm speaking of the personality self.

Not Self.

This is why I ask you, because I think you are speaking of a different thing.

1 hour ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

 

Maybe we are talking of different things, what I mean is that the personality is not the self, the personality is how the self manifest, but not what the self is. The self is the sense of yourself. Not the sense of yourself as a woman or man or depressed or anything but the fact of being aware of yourself 

Edited 1 hour ago by Breakingthewall

[Natasha Tori Maru]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Maybe we are talking of different things, what I mean is that the personality is not the self, the personality is how the self manifest, but not what the self is. The self is the sense of yourself. Not the sense of yourself as a woman or man or depressed or anything but the fact of being aware of yourself 

I wonder what @VeganAwake is referring to then, as I think it could be different. My understanding of what they express is different to you.