My critique on Spiritual Teachers

[Nick_98]

This critique goes to teachers like eckhart tolle, sadhguru, etc.. 

They try to neglect the fact that you’re a human, or at least inside that state of consciousness. They keep giving you advices on how to awaken how to enlighten etc.. but underestimate the fact that you are a human. Many treat being a human as something lesser important than their mission. 
 

ok i understand that you’ve acquired a higher state of consciousness, but what are the consequences for students like me ? 
 

I spent years of my life neglecting my psychological well being for spiritual pursuit. Your psychological well being is more important than your spiritual achievements. You were born to BELONG, to feel included, to be happy , to succeed socially and internally. Spiritual teachers neglect this side , they keep talking about the mind as something is wrong with it. They tell you life is suffering. That’s not true. Life is not suffering. Their outlook on life makes life a suffering playground. When you are constantly trying to escape your state of consciousness, which is beneath god of course you’ll be suffering. You’re damaging your psychological wellbeing by chasing something that requires a superhuman like Leo to achieve. 
why is this post ? 
This post is to remind you to not neglect your psychological well being. Your psychological well being is very important, for your overall functioning and YES you can be happy without gaining spiritual insights. I know a lot of people that are really happy and they never heard a word from eckhart tolle or sadhguru, some of them are even religious and some of them are blinded by lies but at the end of the day they are happy. Their psychological well being is not in trouble it’s intact. And THAT is what really matters. 
 

Living a safe psychologically well established life is the goal. Being Sane is the Goal. You would reap great benefits if you focus on your psychological well being first. Then you can sit and meditate but that should be secondary not primary.

Hope you have a good one  
 

Edited 14 hours ago by Nick_98

[Joshe]

8 hours ago, Nick_98 said:

This critique goes to teachers like eckhart tolle, sadhguru, etc.. 

They try to neglect the fact that you’re a human, or at least inside that state of consciousness. They keep giving you advices on how to awaken how to enlighten etc.. but underestimate the fact that you are a human. Many treat being a human as something lesser important than their mission. 
 

ok i understand that you’ve acquired a higher state of consciousness, but what are the consequences for students like me ? 
 

I spent years of my life neglecting my psychological well being for spiritual pursuit. Your psychological well being is more important than your spiritual achievements. You were born to BELONG, to feel included, to be happy , to succeed socially and internally. Spiritual teachers neglect this side , they keep talking about the mind as something is wrong with it. They tell you life is suffering. That’s not true. Life is not suffering. Their outlook on life makes life a suffering playground. When you are constantly trying to escape your state of consciousness, which is beneath god of course you’ll be suffering. You’re damaging your psychological wellbeing by chasing something that requires a superhuman like Leo to achieve. 
why is this post ? 
This post is to remind you to not neglect your psychological well being. Your psychological well being is very important, for your overall functioning and YES you can be happy without gaining spiritual insights. I know a lot of people that are really happy and they never heard a word from eckhart tolle or sadhguru, some of them are even religious and some of them are blinded by lies but at the end of the day they are happy. Their psychological well being is not in trouble it’s intact. And THAT is what really matters. 
 

Living a safe psychologically well established life is the goal. Being Sane is the Goal. You would reap great benefits if you focus on your psychological well being first. Then you can sit and meditate but that should be secondary not primary.

Hope you have a good one  
 

Right track. It's nice to see some light being shined here. 

If spiritual teachers were actually responsible regarding psychological well-being/destabilization, they'd provide more than a once-ina-blue-moon 20-word disclaimer.

In the real world, people are seeking relief and so they ignore the 20-word disclaimer, and the so-called gurus know this and conveniently ignore it.

Also, it's the ultimate scheme: sell a product to a desperate person and if the promise of the vague, abstract product doesn't materialize, it's user error - not product failure. And there's no way to tell, so lock in for the next decade because it's the only way to reach the summit. And in the meantime, buy this other book/course/program to solve the dozens of blocks that will arise, because once you invest enough financially and emotionally, you'll build up sunk-cost fear and start telling yourself lies about who you are and how it's all worth it. Just keep going for another 5 years - the summit is there!". 

Not that everyone is doing this but I think it's important to be aware of incentives and how spiritual sales funnels operate. 

For too many, it often loops like this:

• Suffering prompts search for meaning
• Spiritual ideas give relief and direction
• Commitment grows
• Real-life problems get bypassed/postponed
• Distress appears again because it's structural
• Further disengagement from life via abstract ideas
• Loop keeps going

Apparently, they call it "spiritual bypassing" - spirituality as an escape from being a human.

Edited 6 hours ago by Joshe

[Nick_98]

21 minutes ago, Joshe said:

Right track. It's nice to see some light being shined here. 

If spiritual teachers were actually responsible regarding psychological well-being/destabilization, they'd provide more than a once-ina-blue-moon 20-word disclaimer.

In the real world, people are seeking relief and so they ignore the 20-word disclaimer, and the so-called gurus know this and conveniently ignore it.

Also, it's the ultimate scheme: sell a product to a desperate person and if the promise of the vague, abstract product doesn't materialize, it's user error - not product failure. And there's no way to tell, so lock in for the next decade because it's the only way to reach the summit. And in the meantime, buy this other book/course/program to solve the dozens of blocks that will arise, because once you invest enough financially and emotionally, you'll build up sunk-cost fear and start telling yourself lies about who you are and how it's all worth it. Just keep going for another 5 years - the summit is there!". 

Not that everyone is doing this but I think it's important to be aware of incentives and how spiritual sales funnels operate. 

For too many, it often loops like this:

• Suffering prompts search for meaning
• Spiritual ideas give relief and direction
• Commitment grows
• Real-life problems get bypassed/postponed
• Distress appears again because it's structural
• Further disengagement from life via abstract ideas
• Loop keeps going

Apparently, they call it "spiritual bypassing". 

Wow. I like your explanation. Thanks!

[Ramasta9]

Most of the mainstream teachers are not real spiritual teachers in my eyes but government agents / spiritual puppets put there to distract you from true / real spirituality and true nature. Dalai lama is another example, deepak, ect.. avoid them at all costs.

Know Thyself, you'll see right through them.

 

[Jodistrict]

I prefer the Tantrik teachings and practices of Kashmir Shaivism.   Unlike Vedanta which considers the world to be maya or an illusion,  Shaivism considers the world to be real and we are here for a purpose.  Enlightenment isn’t transcendental, but rather it is a being fully embodied.  It is feeling the world without the ego and its defense mechanisms and all the conditioning.   Spirituality is not an escape from being human.  It is being fully human in this form in this world.  The body is not something to be renounced.  It is the vehicle to awakening.

https://www.tantrailluminated.org/

[Natasha Tori Maru]

5 hours ago, Joshe said:

Spirituality as an escape from being a human. 

No true spirituality is an escape from being human.

If that's where it leads, it is not spirituality. 

It is a misunderstanding and missing the point. 

It's not about meaning making. 

But I understand many turn to spirituality misunderstanding this; misguidedly turning to the spiritual process to find meaning. It is very, very common. And the easiest way to bypass and build a lovely little spiritual ego in place of what previously served.

[Zigzag Idiot]

@Natasha Tori Maru In pointing this out. You are now spiritual materialist. 

I point this out to you and now I am Zen Devil. How I hate this at times. Not being able to say everything at once and being done with it all. I appreciate the forum but it becomes a merry-go-round fairly often. 

Do you think our degree of being is in a fluctuating state?  I observe my 'need' to engage in commentary and sometimes see it plainly as identifying. Depends on the mood I'm in. Some days, Rome falls nine times an hour. Sometimes not.

Pokin fun,, Being light-hearted,,,  

[Natasha Tori Maru]

@Zigzag Idiot I don't really understand you.

A lot of this would hinge around how you define 'being' and 'state'. Too nebulous to tackle.

I don't think you understand me. Whether that is on me or you, will remain a mystery.

Edited 6 hours ago by Natasha Tori Maru

[Joshe]

1 hour ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

No true spirituality is an escape from being human.

If that's where it leads, it is not spirituality. 

It is a misunderstanding and missing the point. 

It's not about meaning making. 

But I understand many turn to spirituality misunderstanding this; misguidedly turning to the spiritual process to find meaning. It is very, very common. And the easiest way to bypass and build a lovely little spiritual ego in place of what previously served.

Yes, we're in agreement. I said "Spirituality as an escape from being a human." in the context of explaining the all-too-common path. I probably shouldn't have put it on its own line like that because is does kinda read like "is". 

Edited 6 hours ago by Joshe

[Joshe]

@Natasha Tori Maru How is it not about meaning? Beauty and love are meaningful to me. As you know, I haven't prioritized spirituality, but to me, it seems to be about beauty and love. I haven't put a ton of thought into it actually, so I'm genuinely curious. 

Edited 6 hours ago by Joshe

[Natasha Tori Maru]

4 minutes ago, Joshe said:

@Natasha Tori Maru How is it not about meaning? Beauty and love are meaningful to me. As you know, I haven't prioritized spirituality, but to me, it seems to be about beauty and love. I haven't put a ton of thought into it actually, so I'm genuinely curious. 

I think in the end, we make our own meaning. 

I am actually quite aligned with you here - beauty & love & truth. They are meaning to me. 

But at the heart of it when I look to my experience, and ontologically - I simply return to all of this *sweeping hand gestures* simply, is. The 'isness'. I always return to it. In its simplicity and paradox. Empty and full. 

Through that I see I make my meaning. And the fact *I* make it, is all there needs to be 😁

[Natasha Tori Maru]

9 minutes ago, Joshe said:

As you know, I haven't prioritized spirituality, but to me,

Hehe you say this... But I have this sneaky suspicion it is in your nature to return to it. Like an itch that cannot be scratched.

It was that way, for me, at least.

[Joseph Maynor]

Finite perspectives are all creating differently and that is the Beauty.  Loving True Beauty for me is a good pointer.  In other words, whatever floats your boat haha.

[Joshe]

6 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

But at the heart of it when I look to my experience, and ontologically - I simply return to all of this *sweeping hand gestures* simply, is. The 'isness'. I always return to it. In its simplicity and paradox. Empty and full. 

Through that I see I make my meaning. And the fact *I* make it, is all there needs to be 😁

I'm aware of the "isness" when my mind isn't doing it's thing, but I haven't made it beautiful yet. I mean, it has been, but it's not usually. Usually, it's just neutral awareness of it. But maybe that's exactly what it should be or maybe recontextualization is necessary?

9 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Hehe you say this... But I have this sneaky suspicion it is in your nature to return to it. Like an itch that cannot be scratched.

It was that way, for me, at least.

Yeah, I'm just letting things happen organically. I'm sure I'll get back on the wagon at some point. 

[Carl-Richard]

9 hours ago, Nick_98 said:

You were born to BELONG, to feel included, to be happy , to succeed socially and internally. Spiritual teachers neglect this side

You just gotta get to know the right teachers.

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