Early 1900's Communism, Marxism, Fascism (This will be new info to most)

[MightyMind]

Does anyone on here think that the marxists/communists/revolutionaries had good ideas? In particular I'm referring to the early 1900's. I'd like to gain more perspective on their world view to see if they had good reason to believe in what they believed in. Do they have anything to offer that is relevant for today? Please offer any sources you think would be a worthy consideration.  

Beyond that, I'll share what I've come to learn. I think many people would benefit from considering the following. 

As I saw the word fascism carelessly thrown around I became more curious about the definition and this inquiry has opened many doors for me and one of them is the world communism movement that was taking place during the early 1900's. First let's take a look at few definitions of fascism. 

(1927) Fascisti: Italian reform party organized in 1919 to oppose all radical and revolutionary movements in Italy (The New Universities Dictionary)

(1944) Fascism: The doctrine and principles of the Fascismo: Fascism, a political and economic movement, strongly nationalistic, magnifying the rights of the state as opposed to those of the individual, in which both industry though remaining largely under private ownership, and all administrative political units, are controlled by a strong central government (The Winston Dictionary)

(1945) Fascisti: A society to oppose Bolshevism in Italy, formed in 1919 by Benito Mussolini / Fascism: Doctrine of the Fascisti  (Practical Standard Dictionary/ Funk and Wagnalis)

As you can see, fascism didn't spring out of nowhere. According to these dictionaries it was a response to communistic and revolutionary movements. Also not generally known is how widespread they were around the world. We've been told many times the nazi's wanted to take over the world, but there was also a world communistic revolution happening. "The nazi's wanted world domination"...but no mention of the communists intent for a world revolution?

AI mentions these movements are inspired by Marxism which were heavily influenced by the Bolshevik Revolution and aligned with the Comintern, adopting Marxist-Leninist principles.

The Comintern, or Communist International (also known as the Third International), was an international organization founded in 1919 in Moscow by the Bolsheviks, led by Vladimir Lenin, to promote and coordinate communist revolutionary activities worldwide. Its goal was to spread Marxist-Leninist ideology, support the creation of communist parties globally, and foster proletarian revolutions to overthrow capitalist systems. 

------

This is also from Grok/AI 

Germany: The Communist Party of Germany (KPD) was founded in 1918, evolving from earlier socialist groups like the Spartacus League. Marxist ideas had circulated since the 1840s, with the Communist Manifesto published in 1848 by Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels in London, influencing German radicals.

Russia: The Russian Social Democratic Labour Party (RSDLP), formed in 1898, split into Bolsheviks and Mensheviks in 1903. The Bolsheviks, led by Lenin, became the Communist Party of the Soviet Union after the 1917 Revolution, dominating Russian politics by the 1920s.

France: The French Communist Party (PCF) was established in 1920, splitting from the socialist French Section of the Workers' International (SFIO). Earlier, communist ideas were present in the Paris Commune (1871) and various socialist groups.

Italy: The Communist Party of Italy (PCI) was founded in 1921, emerging from a split in the Italian Socialist Party. Marxist groups had existed since the late 19th century, gaining traction in industrialized northern Italy.

Spain: The Communist Party of Spain (PCE) was formed in 1921. It grew during the Second Spanish Republic (1931–1939) and played a significant role in the Spanish Civil War (1936–1939).

United Kingdom: The Communist Party of Great Britain (CPGB) was founded in 1920, building on earlier Marxist groups like the Social Democratic Federation (formed in 1881).

Austria: The Communist Party of Austria (KPÖ) was established in 1918, influenced by the revolutionary wave after World War I.

Hungary: The Communist Party of Hungary was founded in 1918, briefly holding power during the Hungarian Soviet Republic in 1919 under Béla Kun.

Poland: The Communist Party of Poland (KPP) was formed in 1918, operating under difficult conditions due to government repression and later Soviet influence.

Czechoslovakia: The Communist Party of Czechoslovakia (KSČ) was founded in 1921, splitting from the Social Democratic Party, and gained significant support in the interwar period.

Bulgaria: The Bulgarian Communist Party (BCP) was established in 1919, evolving from the Bulgarian Social Democratic Party (founded in 1891).

Romania: The Communist Party of Romania (PCR) was formed in 1921, though it remained small and often underground due to government bans.

Yugoslavia: The Communist Party of Yugoslavia (KPJ) was founded in 1919, becoming a major force under Josip Broz Tito by the 1940s.

Greece: The Communist Party of Greece (KKE) was established in 1918 and grew influential during the 1930s and 1940s, especially during the Greek Civil War.

Finland: The Communist Party of Finland (SKP) was founded in 1918, operating in a semi-legal status due to government restrictions.

Sweden: The Communist Party of Sweden (SKP) was formed in 1917, splitting from the Social Democratic Party.

Norway: The Communist Party of Norway (NKP) was established in 1923, following a split in the Labour Party.

Denmark: The Communist Party of Denmark (DKP) was founded in 1919, influenced by the Russian Revolution.

Belgium: The Communist Party of Belgium (PCB) was formed in 1921, emerging from earlier socialist movements.

Netherlands: The Communist Party of the Netherlands (CPN) was founded in 1918, building on Marxist groups active since the late 19th century.

Switzerland: The Communist Party of Switzerland was formed in 1921, though it remained small due to the country’s conservative political climate.

Portugal: The Portuguese Communist Party (PCP) was founded in 1921, operating clandestinely under the Salazar dictatorship from the 1930s.

Albania: The Communist Party of Albania was established in 1941, though Marxist groups existed earlier in the interwar period.

Canada: Communist Party of Canada (CPC): Founded in 1921 in Guelph, Ontario, the CPC emerged from earlier socialist and labor groups, influenced by the Russian Revolution and the Comintern. It initially operated underground due to government repression under the War Measures Act.

United States: Communist Party USA (CPUSA): Formed in 1919, the CPUSA emerged from splits within the Socialist Party of America, particularly after the Russian Revolution. Two initial groups, the Communist Party of America and the Communist Labor Party, merged in 1921 under Comintern guidance.

China: Communist Party of China (CCP) 1921: Founded in Shanghai by Chen Duxiu and Li Dazhao; grew rapidly among urban workers and peasants, leading to rural soviets by 1931 and the Long March (1934–35). Revolutionary against Kuomintang rule; peaked in influence during the Chinese Civil War (1927–1949).

Mexico: Mexican Communist Party (PCM) 1919: Emerged from socialist groups post-Mexican Revolution (1910–1920); advocated for land reform and anti-imperialism. Participated in labor strikes and influenced agrarian movements, though faced repression.

India: Communist Party of India (CPI) 1925: Formed in exile (Cawnpore/Kanpur) by M.N. Roy and others under Comintern guidance; revolutionary focus on anti-colonial struggle and peasant uprisings. Active in trade unions and the independence movement.

Japan: Japanese Communist Party (JCP) 1922: Founded clandestinely amid post-WWI labor unrest; aimed at proletarian revolution against the emperor system. Faced severe crackdowns (e.g., Peace Preservation Law, 1925), operating underground.

South Africa: Communist Party of South Africa (CPSA) 1921: Originated from International Socialist League; revolutionary against apartheid precursors and colonialism, organizing Black workers and strikes. Later renamed South African Communist Party (SACP) in 1953.

Australia: Communist Party of Australia (CPA) 1920: Split from socialist groups; focused on revolutionary unionism and anti-capitalist agitation during the Great Depression. Influential in waterfront and mining strikes.

Argentina: Communist Party of Argentina (PCA) 1918: Earliest in Latin America; formed by anarcho-syndicalists turning Marxist post-Russian Revolution. Revolutionary activities included general strikes and anti-oligarchy campaigns.

Brazil: Communist Party of Brazil (PCB) 1922: Founded in Rio de Janeiro; led urban revolts (e.g., 1935 uprising) and peasant leagues. Banned multiple times but key in labor movements.

Chile: Communist Party of Chile (PCCh) 1912 (as Socialist Workers' Group; formalized 1922): Early Marxist circles post-1900; revolutionary against semi-feudal land system, joining Popular Front in 1930s for anti-fascist actions.

Uruguay: Communist Party of Uruguay (PCU) 1925: Emerged from socialist splits; focused on revolutionary trade unionism and anti-imperialism against U.S. influence in the region.

Indonesia: Communist Party of Indonesia (PKI) 1920: Founded as Indies Social-Democratic Association; largest non-European communist party by 1920s, leading peasant revolts (e.g., 1926 uprising) against Dutch colonialism.

Iran: Communist Party of Iran (Tudeh Party predecessor) 1920 (as Justice Party; communist turn 1927): Early revolutionary group against monarchy; influenced by Baku Congress (1920), focusing on oil worker strikes and anti-Shah agitation.

Turkey: Communist Party of Turkey (TKP) 1920: Formed post-WWI amid Ottoman collapse; aimed at proletarian revolution but suppressed by Kemalists, operating in exile.

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 06:15 PM by MightyMind

[Apparition of Jack]

Marxism / communism is a fascinating subject. You could spend a lifetime studying it and only scratch the surface.

I’m sympathetic to Marxism in many ways, at the very least as a political counterweight to the bullshit oligarchic capitalist realism we live in these days. I’m not a huge fan of revolutionary violence or metaphysical materialism but I think Marxism holds a lot of fascinating insights to human nature that capitalist ideology sorely lacks.

[MightyMind]

@Apparition of Jack Feel free to drop any videos and specific insights that you think would be beneficial to consider. I work outside and I've been listening to videos all day long so give me some content! I do wonder though, if oligarch's fund both sides in order to create a problem-reaction-solution scenario. 

[MightyMind]

"alliances between communists and liberals."... it's also happening today but those who call themselves democrats don't realize what's happening in their own house

"Alexander Trachtenberg (1884–1966), a prominent member of the Communist Party USA (CPUSA) and head of its publishing arm, International Publishers. Trachtenberg was indeed a speaker at the CPUSA's National Convention held at Madison Square Garden in New York City from May 20–23, 1944. The convention was a major event attended by over 1,000 delegates, focusing on wartime strategy, the "People's Front" against fascism, and post-war planning, aligning with the broader context of World War II alliances between communists and liberals."

 

AI:

"Based on multiple secondary sources, the most common full version of the quote is:

"When we get ready to take the United States, we will not take it under the label of Communism; we will not take it under the label of Socialism. These labels are unpleasant to the American people, and have been smeared too much. We will take the United States under labels we have made very lovable; we will take it under Liberalism, under Progressivism, under Democracy. But, take it we will."

Key differences from your version:

"Speared" is almost certainly a transcription error for "smeared" (meaning tarnished or defamed through anti-communist propaganda)"

Edited Wednesday at 10:44 PM by MightyMind

[UnbornTao]

This is now our thread, comrade. 

[MightyMind]

@UnbornTao well then feel free to contribute 

[UnbornTao]

6 minutes ago, MightyMind said:

@UnbornTao well then feel free to contribute 

Just a silly joke

[MightyMind]

@UnbornTao no worries, I liked it

[MightyMind]

So isn't this interesting. Here you have Marx (a jew) who is critiquing Jews. Am I wrong to think that Hitler and Marx had similar views about certain jews and religion? Am I missing anything? or how else could this be interpreted? 

 

"What is the secular foundation of Judaism? Practical necessity, selfish interest.

What is the secular cult practiced by Jews? Usury.

What is their secular god? Money."

On the Jewish Question. Karl Marx.

 

Karl Marx's most controversial book: "The Jewish Question"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAaAhj_7-CU

[Leo Gura]

All three are delusional ideologies that are beyond redemption.

You can find plenty of books on the disasters of each. I have a few in my book list and will add more in the future.

[MightyMind]

@Leo Gura have you elaborated your views on how "all three are delusional" on any threads? 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, MightyMind said:

@Leo Gura have you elaborated your views on how "all three are delusional" on any threads? 

Not in any serious way.

A serious answer to that question would require a lot of prep of material.

But, in general, they suffer from the same problem all ideologies suffer from: a lack of grounding, with foolish, fantastical ideas that fail to work in the complexities of real life.

If you just read the history of fascism and communism as it was enacted you will see all the problems and points of failure.

[Leo Gura]

 

[Daniel Balan]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

 

Basically this video tells us that the reason marxism/communism/nationalism/fascism fails is because those ideologies are way too narrow, too close minded, too simplistic to solve systemic issues.

All these ideologies present pie in the sky solutions to problems that have existed since the dawn of human civilization. 

The issue Marxism/Communism/Socialism fails is because it tries to solve a tier 2 problem with the tier 1 thinking. If you are a apprentice mechanic you can't solve complex and systemic problems that a failed engine has. Only an expert mechanic can do that.

You can't solve tier 2 systemic problems with tier 1 tools. To expect that communism  would fix the inherent problems of capitalism and inequality is as foolish as expecting that you can build a house by only using a hammer. It's preposterous!

That's why all ideologies must fail and will fail. 

Reality is too broad and complex to expect that it can be fixed by narrow, closeminded and self deceived sets of values and principles. 

Edited Thursday at 12:33 PM by Daniel Balan

[Terell Kirby]

what would pro capitalist leftism look like in theory and practice? Can that even be a thing?

We seem to always equate leftism to Marxism and Communism in the culture.

[Husseinisdoingfine]

"Why be afraid of one's own people?"

 

Capital’s interests vs. people’s interests

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Terell Kirby said:

what would pro capitalist leftism look like in theory and practice? Can that even be a thing?

We seem to always equate leftism to Marxism and Communism in the culture.

Scandinavian-style social democrats.

West-North EU, basically.

[Schizophonia]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

All three are delusional ideologies that are beyond redemption.

You can find plenty of books on the disasters of each. I have a few in my book list and will add more in the future.

Communism transformed the russia into a nuclear superpower despite the civil war, the stalinist bureaucracy, the tens of millions of direct and indirect deaths of World War II, and the global western indirect embargo quickly after ww2 that i quickly talked about in my topic about Trosky; I should make a second improved and cleaner version btw.

Even Cuba, which found itself self-sufficient, went from being the current equivalent of Cambodia to one of the countries that trains the most doctors and has the largest cigar industry in the world; Hugo Chávez, too, has made his population literate and drastically increased its standard of living.

Meanwhile capitalist systems spend their time collapsing on themselves due to their contradiction, without there even being a conflict of intensity or deprivation of resources. The United States survived the 1929 crisis mainly thanks to debt (always the same Ponzi scheme) but also thanks to a policy of massive redistribution; Income tax could rise to over 90% during the New Deal.

36 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Scandinavian-style social democrats.

West-North EU, basically.

And these are very redistributionist countries.

Edited Thursday at 09:31 PM by Schizophonia

[Schizophonia]

43 minutes ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

"Why be afraid of one's own people?"

 

Capital’s interests vs. people’s interests

Yes, but if we don't have a communist project, then all the anti-oligarchy rhetoric will lead nowhere.
The Trumpists win, the overtone window shifts in their favor, because the Democratic opposition are weak centrists without a coherent worldview or epistemology.

 

[Leo Gura]

40 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

Even Cuba, which found itself self-sufficient, went from being the current equivalent of Cambodia to one of the countries that trains the most doctors and has the largest cigar industry in the world

Cuba is a total disaster today. Watch some vidoes of vloggers visiting Cuba.

That talking point about doctors is BS. Cuba has no medicine for doctors to do anything.

Edited Thursday at 10:10 PM by Leo Gura