Leo, How Many God-Realized Women Have You Met?

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Nemra said:

I'm saying that if those are opposites, then they are not absolutes or one of them is absolute.

Everything is absolute from an absolute point of view. Everything is relative from the relative point of view. Absolute is not something you can point to, it's the perspective from which you observe the reality(the coin). You can choose to see both sides of the coin, or you can choose to see the coin in its totality. Both ways you're right.  

Edited May 13 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

57 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

people high in testosterone actually tend to be highly passionate and involved in material things.

Sexual energy is actually a creative feminine energy. That's why it fuels you for action. 

[Schizophonia]

22 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Sexual energy is actually a creative feminine energy. That's why it fuels you for action. 

Where did you get that from? 🤔
And if it's true, then why are the most androgenic people the most active in the maya?
Spiritual people are supposed be more masculine than average from this pov, but most of the time they're at the contrary  more gentle/feminine than average.

 

Edited May 13 by Schizophonia

[Nemra]

2 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Everything is absolute from an absolute point of view. Everything is relative from the relative point of view. Absolute is not something you can point to, it's the perspective from which you observe reality. From a relative point of view energy can be in a state of potential or in a state of expression. It's still one energy. 

Is your sole mission to confuse people with cheap tricks and make them agree with you?

I'm starting to understand what Leo felt when he came up with "epistemic scoundrel".

[Salvijus]

7 minutes ago, Nemra said:

Is your sole mission to confuse people with cheap tricks and make them agree with you?

I'm starting to understand what Leo felt when he came up with "epistemic scoundrel".

I edited a bit to make it more clear. 

 

[Salvijus]

15 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

Where did you get that from? 🤔

Even Freud would agree with his "libido" theory. 

Edited May 13 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

49 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

And if it's true, then why are the most androgenic people the most active in the maya?
 

Because they have no Zen in them? If a person was to disidentify from everything, the kinetic (sexual) would transform into potential (emptiness) energy. In a state of Zen absorption there would be no movement whatsoever. Even the 5 senses would cease. There would be nibbana. 

Edited May 13 by Salvijus

[Schizophonia]

18 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Even Freud would agree with his "libido" theory. 

The Freud's analysis of genders' dynamic is a bit poor; but he would say playing is about playing detaining the "phallus" and women getting it.

So imagine you have your self; If you're a man, most of the time you'll prefer to play at moving around, identifying with the layers of the self that aren't threatened with castration, and projecting the layers that are threatened with castration.
This is what makes us generally more stoic (because we don't identify with the layers threatened with castration) and more dominant (because castration is projected on the other, wants to be submissive the layers that want to exist).

If you are really very masculine and cannot stand castration, even more layers will be projected and you will end up dressing in thick, black leather clothes, spending your days with whores and at the casino, and living alone in the forest.

Jokes aside, this goes back to what I said before about "I" and "it".

15 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Because they have no Zen in them? 

Yes, but precisely, you linked in another thread and here that masculinity was linked to Zen Buddhism.

What I see is that the most masculine men are, on the contrary, very involved in the Maya, generally as "protectors" (for example, political leaders, military personnel, athletes, pornographic actors, doctors, engineers, etc.), while Far Eastern gurus are often weak.

And that seems logical to me, spirituality is often a logic of escape.

Edited May 13 by Schizophonia

[Salvijus]

22 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

So imagine you have your self; If you're a man, most of the time you'll prefer to play at moving around, identifying with the layers of the self that aren't threatened with castration, and projecting the layers that are threatened with castration.
This is what makes us generally more stoic (because we don't identify with the layers threatened with castration) and more dominant (because castration is projected on the other, wants to be submissive the layers that want to exist).

If you are really very masculine and cannot stand castration, even more layers will be projected and you will end up dressing in thick, black leather clothes, spending your days with whores and at the casino, and living alone in the forest.

Those are nice insights. 

22 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

What I see is that the most masculine men are, on the contrary, very involved in the Maya, generally as "protectors" (for example, political leaders, military personnel, athletes, pornographic actors, doctors, engineers, etc.), while Far Eastern gurus are often weak.

Idk what to say here. I need to eat something for my brain is not working anymore, lol. 

[Nemra]

36 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I edited a bit to make it more clear. 

You are too humble and thoughtful.

[Salvijus]

6 minutes ago, Nemra said:

You are too humble and thoughtful.

I know, I'm the greatest. 

[Yimpa]

3 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I know, I'm the greatest. 

[Salvijus]

1 minute ago, Yimpa said:

I knew I count on you for having my back ✌️

[Schizophonia]

20 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Those are nice insights. 

Thanks

20 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Idk what to say here. I need to eat something for my brain is not working anymore, lol. 

No problemo.

[Nemra]

11 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I know, I'm the greatest. 

[Salvijus]

9 minutes ago, Nemra said:

Tcare 

[Nemra]

14 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Tcare 

[Emerald]

@Salvijus @Wilhelm44 The issue is interpreting "Masculine and Feminine" only through the lens of human gender.

The Masculine and Feminine exist in all living and nonliving systems and supersede yet inform human gender expressions.

The issue is just that human beings are very human centric.

And we can understand these polar "energies" best through relating them to man-likeness and woman-likeness... as male/female is the closest human expressions we have to these two polarities.

Hence, why we refer to them as Feminine/Masculine and understand them through male and female symbolism. But it's really more like Yin and Yang.

The problem arises when we filter these understandings through the notion of "This is what men and women ought to do." or "This is how men and women always are."

Every person contains both the Masculine and the Feminine... just like all other living and non-living systems.

And the archetypal and energetic Masculine and Feminine sometimes coincide with the gender norms of a particular society... but often diverges.

For example, you both cited Love as a Feminine element of awakening.

But Love is actually Masculine principled.

It's just that our gender norms characterize love as being more in association with the Feminine because contemporary women tend to consciously value love more than men do... generally speaking. 

But this is just love in the way that we conceptualize of it in society, which is more like connection and relationship... which are Feminine principled.

So, it's a matter of a word-based mix-up that causes us to characterize Love as Feminine... when what we mean by love is connection, romance, relationship, etc. which have to do with the relationship between separate human beings.

And separation is the Feminine polarity... while oneness is the Masculine polarity.

This is the major issue that so many people want to talk about the Masculine and Feminine but haven't had enough direct experience to speak about them accurately without mincing them together with social constructs and notions of human gender.

Now, there are some subtle but important differences between men and women as general groups in the broad strokes. And you will find that men will gravitate more towards transcendence-based paths... and women will gravitate more towards embodiment based paths.

And that is because the transcendence-based path is more archetypally and energetically Masculine and the embodiment-based path is more archetypally and energetically Feminine.

 

Edited May 13 by Emerald

[Emerald]

13 hours ago, Wilhelm44 said:

But surely to combine transcendence and embodiment, would be better than just focusing on one path to the exclusion of the other ? And is it even really possible to exclude, because it seems like when people just focus on transcendence for example, that life actually begins to force them to also look at embodiment. Maybe the Beauty with a capital B is revealed in combining the masculine and feminine path.

Yes, the embodiment path is enhanced by its opposite.

So, the Feminine path is dualistic... and it about appreciating embodiment and limitation through contrast with transcendence and the infinite.

And there can be glimpses of Truth which bring greater meaning to the experience of the illusion through a contrast of opposites.

But the end goal is the embodiment of the illusion... and the awakening to Truth is only a tool for enhancing the experience of the illusion form the perspective of this path.

But with the transcendence path... it is non-dual.

So, it is about embracing both relative truth and illusion... in service of transcending the attachment to the illusion and abiding in Truth.

Ultimately both have similar means... but different end-goals.

[Emerald]

3 hours ago, Schizophonia said:

Where did you get that from? 🤔
And if it's true, then why are the most androgenic people the most active in the maya?
Spiritual people are supposed be more masculine than average from this pov, but most of the time they're at the contrary  more gentle/feminine than average.

The spiritual is the Masculine... and the physical is the Feminine.

So, yes... libidinal/sexual energy is Feminine. 

This is why, in Kundalini yoga, with the symbol of Shiva and Shakti... the libidinal energy is said to be like Shakti who is a Goddess in the form of a snake and is coiled three times at the base of the spine as waiting potential.

And the awakened Shakti (or risen snake) is a symbol of integration of the Masculine and Feminine.... and awakening from the human perspective and relates to the ability to express the Shakti energy towards both spiritual and creative outputs. 

What must be understood about Masculine and Feminine in the archetypal and energetic sense... is that there are often divergences from both gender norms and the ways that men and women tend to generally be.

The Masculine and Feminine were named by people who want to use a human symbol to understand these primordial energies. But we make a mistake when we only relate these dynamics to human gender.

That said, women do actually have a stronger connection to libidinal energy than men, generally speaking.

Though men generally tend to channel their libidinal energy in a more focused way... where women tend to just abide and marinate more in the soup of that energy without externalizing it as often.

So, you're seeing a difference there that comes more from the Masculine principled tendency towards externalization and the Feminine principled tendency toward internalization.

But women generally have a greater connection to libidinal energy in an internal and being sense... as we create life inside our bodies. So, like Shakti and Shiva... the Shakti stays dormant until it rises up the channel of the spine to meet Shiva.

So, a woman needs to integrate the Masculine to be able to tame and channel that libidinal energy outwards towards creative and productive works. Otherwise, it is just a marination in those energies on an internal level.

But with regard to how Masculine and Feminine can diverge from gender norms and how men and women tend to be... men are actually more Feminine principled in the sense that men are more physically equipped than women with more resilient bodies.

And women tend to be more likely to possess the Masculine-principled quality of communication... as we are usually more expressive (verbally and otherwise) than men.

But of course, these are broad strokes generalizations that aren't always true... just patterns that can be noticed where our gender norms and patterns diverge from the energetic Masculine and Feminine.