A foray with Meaning, Discipline & Pleasure

[Natasha Tori Maru]

A question for the users of the forum to reflect on: In your life, how have you linked meaning, discipline & pleasure?

I really enjoy using this triangle to assess where I need to place more energy.

• Meaning is the energy that punctuates everything, a great river of momentum. It is why we do what we do. Linked intrinsically with belief, it is a story we tell ourselves in meditation, prayer. Without meaning, life has no momentum. A hollow existence.
• Pleasure, the juice, the tantalizing spark of life. Dopamine, serotonin. It makes the journey worth it. It makes hard times easier. It can bring joy to existence even... but without meaning as an undercurrent, it can turn unto a numbing chase. The spiral of addiction. An endless junk food binge.
• Discipline is the bridge between the fleeting pleasure of the flesh, and the greater, lasting meaning of existence. The constant steering rudder toward things that matter. Never about self-flagellation, but always about choosing the hard choice, the boring choice, the actions invisible to others.

Master discipline!

You will learn to delay your pleasures in service of something greater, that will foster your personal expansion. 

Pleasure keeps you alive, meaning gives you a reason to stay alive, and discipline ensures you build a life worth staying alive for.

The balance of this triad is difficult, but with age & experience, it becomes easier. 

I hope this question is of service to you all.

My intention with this post is to highlight an issue I see with many users of the forum who are not as far along their path. But this triad is always worth thinking on, wherever you currently sit with your development, as it is also the key to managing stress in life <3

Edited Sunday at 02:53 AM by Natasha Tori Maru

[Carl-Richard]

Discipline becomes pleasure if you pursue meaning.

Edited Sunday at 02:55 AM by Carl-Richard

[UnbornTao]

It might be useful as a model, so if you notice it benefits you, that's a point in its favor. In addition to that, we could consider what each of these things is for itself.

For example, in order to act, the only requisite for that is intention. To pick up a rock, you pick it up. Planning to pick it up, pondering about picking it up, stressing over picking it up, are activities that often get in the way of a simple action. Of course, this then involves commitment and discipline for more complex pursuits that require more process to be accomplished, but the principle is the same. Just a thought. So: What is meaning? What role does pain play in our search for pleasure? How does discipline come about? 

Edited Tuesday at 11:35 AM by UnbornTao

[Eskilon]

Thanks for sharing this, in my opinion it is only lacking the spiritual liberation aspect of life.

I don't know if you know about the 4 purusharthas, but I think It can go well with your principles: Dharma(One's duty in life; meaning, discipline and ethics go here), Artha(Material success, wealth; meaning and discipline go here too), Kama(Pleasure, Desire, Sex; your pleasure part goes here), and Moksha(Liberation, awakening; this one you could add to your principles). 

[WikiRando]

 

On 27/04/2025 at 10:48 AM, Natasha Tori Maru said:

 Never about self-flagellation, but always about choosing the hard choice, the boring choice, the actions invisible to others.

 

A labour of love is no labour at all. 

Boredom means you're missing the ever-present grandeur of reality. You don't need boredom to be disciplined. You can simply find real pleasure in it. 

Your framework has value to newbies who might be at a totally different stage of life. 

 

 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

9 minutes ago, WikiRando said:

 

A labour of love is no labour at all. 

Boredom means you're missing the ever-present grandeur of reality. You don't need boredom to be disciplined. You can simply find real pleasure in it. 

Your framework has value to newbies who might be at a totally different stage of life. 

 

 

Yes indeed, which is why, if you noted my final disclaimer, this would be evident.

My intention was to frame this triad in a way that others can use to assist in steering them back on their chosen path. Hence why, I posted in this forum, and added the last point. 

The gap in growth amoung the forum users is great, and leads to lots of confusion when attempting to grasp higher concepts. In particular, integrating matter reality with spirituality. My post aims to assist with the next steps they need to master 💜

[Salvijus]

On 2025-04-27 at 5:53 AM, Carl-Richard said:

Discipline becomes pleasure if you pursue meaning.

Yoo, that was sick. 

[WikiRando]

Example: 

A kid is often bored in school, yet basic education is life-changing for survival, even if they find it ridiculously boring. 

So yes, an adult can have the self mastery to never be bored and truly love being disciplined, but that might be too far down the line for people just trying to get their basic shit together.  

But even a kid in school would do better if they stopped being bored and knew how to love it. 

 

15 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Yes indeed, which is why, if you noted my final disclaimer, this would be evident.

Yes, that was me noting your disclaimer 

Edited Tuesday at 07:40 PM by WikiRando

[Applegarden8]

I disagree. Discipline alone is dry and causes existential dread. I think it's too much emphasis on discipline.

You have to want what you are after, something has to pull you. You pushing yourself is not enough.

I would rather master being mindful, projecting what I want and spending time desiring something and then doing. That adds life to what you are doing, while there might not be much meaning, because you just want to express or do something and in a world where there is not objective meaning.

Edited Wednesday at 03:54 AM by Applegarden8

[Natasha Tori Maru]

9 minutes ago, Applegarden8 said:

I disagree. Discipline alone is dry and causes existential dread. I think it's too much emphasis on discipline.

You have to want what you are after, something has to pull you. You pushing yourself is not enough.

I would rather master being mindful, projecting what I want and spending time desiring something and then doing. That adds life to what you are doing, while there might not be much meaning, because you just want to express or do something and in a world where there is not objective meaning.

Your post is full of strange disagreements/agreements with your premise.

On the one hand you are claiming you want an external force to give you momentum.

Then you say you want to 'master' being mindful - which requires discipline?

 

 

[Natasha Tori Maru]

8 hours ago, Salvijus said:

Yoo, that was sick. 

Yes agree! @Carl-Richard nailed it so well, it could be a signature quote!

[Yimpa]

25 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

@Carl-Richard nailed it so well, it could be a signature quote!

Make it yours :3

[Applegarden8]

2 hours ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Your post is full of strange disagreements/agreements with your premise.

On the one hand you are claiming you want an external force to give you momentum.

Then you say you want to 'master' being mindful - which requires discipline?

 

 

I strongly believe that everything starts with desire. Only "discipline" you need is to regularly and continously project what you want. For example, you want to be healthy and what does it mean for you. Then rest of the "Discipline" or effort does not feel like a discipline and there the grudgery and dread is minimized. Without this component any discipline is dry and dreadful. Even success can be depressing. That's all I meant. Sorry if I caused some confusion. I think the emphasis is more on the Value you describe than to master the discipline. The practice of desiring what you want (it's rather internal than external force) consciously will make you relaxed and mindful.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

On 30/04/2025 at 4:41 PM, Applegarden8 said:

I strongly believe that everything starts with desire. Only "discipline" you need is to regularly and continously project what you want. For example, you want to be healthy and what does it mean for you. Then rest of the "Discipline" or effort does not feel like a discipline and there the grudgery and dread is minimized. Without this component any discipline is dry and dreadful. Even success can be depressing. That's all I meant. Sorry if I caused some confusion. I think the emphasis is more on the Value you describe than to master the discipline. The practice of desiring what you want (it's rather internal than external force) consciously will make you relaxed and mindful.

I think the part bolded is the discipline in this case. You are consciously guiding your thoughts to focus on an outcome. 

Nonetheless, I think you and I are saying the same thing!

The practice becomes the pleasure, when you are aligned with your desire.

[Applegarden8]

15 hours ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I think the part bolded is the discipline in this case. You are consciously guiding your thoughts to focus on an outcome. 

Nonetheless, I think you and I are saying the same thing!

The practice becomes the pleasure, when you are aligned with your desire.

Essentially yes.