"How I Increased My IQ By 13 Points" - IQ boost via working memory training?

[thenondualtankie]

 

TL;DW

• The man's IQ was tested to be 136, and re-tested three years later at 149. There were no other IQ tests in the three year period, meaning "practice effect" unlikely
• He attributes the boost to a brain training program called Dual n-Back, which primarily focuses on training your working memory
• An IQ "boost" may well not correspond to a real improvement in intelligence, but he also claims many benefits:
  • Improved memory
  • Improved ability to solve analytical problems, e.g. he claims he's much better at chess puzzles
  • Improved vision
  • Much higher frequency of insights and creative ideas.

[Carl-Richard]

I'll try it out to see if it improves my thinking.

[integral]

Dual N Back Training

Tutorial

Edited June 24, 2023 by integral

[Carl-Richard]

I tried it a few times. The best I've got is 67% correct on Dual 2 Back, and I'm very sleep deprived ?

[integral]

Alright so im able to get 100% in Dual 2 Back with some practice, but im really not memorizing anything, its more pattern recognition and intuition, I feel it and know what the right button is. lol

Edited June 24, 2023 by integral

[integral]

On 6/21/2023 at 5:17 PM, thenondualtankie said:

• He attributes the boost to a brain training program called Dual n-Back, which primarily focuses on training your working memory

How high does one need to get results? 

Dual 8 back?

Another site that does not have pay wall.

Edited June 25, 2023 by integral

[thenondualtankie]

I don't think there's a level goal because everyone has different starting abilities. From what I can tell it takes a few weeks to a few months of daily 15-30 minute practice to see benefits.

[Carl-Richard]

13 hours ago, integral said:

Alright so im able to get 100% in Dual 2 Back with some practice, but im really not memorizing anything, its more pattern recognition and intuition, I feel it and know what the right button is. lol

Your working memory is less like a storage space and more like a working space.

[Carl-Richard]

12 hours ago, integral said:

How high does one need to get results? 

Dual 8 back?

Another site that does not have pay wall.

The guy with the 13 point increase practiced Dual 4 Back for 400 hours.

[supremeyingyang]

On 6/21/2023 at 11:17 PM, thenondualtankie said:

 

TL;DW

• The man's IQ was tested to be 136, and re-tested three years later at 149. There were no other IQ tests in the three year period, meaning "practice effect" unlikely
• He attributes the boost to a brain training program called Dual n-Back, which primarily focuses on training your working memory
• An IQ "boost" may well not correspond to a real improvement in intelligence, but he also claims many benefits:
  • Improved memory
  • Improved ability to solve analytical problems, e.g. he claims he's much better at chess puzzles
  • Improved vision
  • Much higher frequency of insights and creative ideas.

If you train something, you improve -- who would have thought! This is the golden age of civilization.

Lemme ask you this: What is the benefit beside bragging? Are there any organizations that have the requirement of a IQ over 140? If no, so what? If yes, is it a good idea to train to pass the test? Are you really smart or merely trained? Isn't that the same as with the inflation of grades in school? You perform better on paper, but you are the same person?

[integral]

15 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

If you train something, you improve -- who would have thought! This is the golden age of civilization.

Lemme ask you this: What is the benefit beside bragging? Are there any organizations that have the requirement of a IQ over 140? If no, so what? If yes, is it a good idea to train to pass the test? Are you really smart or merely trained? Isn't that the same as with the inflation of grades in school? You perform better on paper, but you are the same person?

I was thinking about this to, is the training truly generalized? I think it might be because if you can hold more space in working memory then you can create larger conceptions. Ideally?

There are potential red flags, he said his vision improved, that could be because hes stuck in a more stimulated focused state and overall that is not healthy. 

Edited June 25, 2023 by integral

[supremeyingyang]

21 minutes ago, integral said:

I was thinking about this to, is the training truly generalized? I think it might be because if you can hold more space in working memory then you can create larger conceptions. Ideally?

There are potential red flags, he said his vision improved, that could be because hes stuck in a more stimulated focused state and overall that is not healthy. 

It seems not like the real thing. I can't test it afterwards, but I surely improved my IQ by learning to program and working as a programmer for 4 years. For example I can you memorize random passwords effortlessly without trying to, it just sticks after two or so manual entries ( for example: s4/k.Po4$+821) -- just one example of my improved memory and pattern recognition. I'm sure the same pattern recognition skills would be a benefit in taking an IQ test, but again: So what?

We know that there are 150+ IQ person who are losers (lack of discipline) or assholes (lack of EQ) and 'lower IQ' Persons, who lead great lives. The correlation between IQ and living the good live seems for me only going within a certain range. Easily said: It does not matter really if you are smart or super-smart as everyone is in comparison  much worse of. If you have 100 Billion Dollars, it not guaranteed to make the great difference to your happiness to gain 10% cash. Reverse: If you are physically starving and then earn yourself up to 100K in your Bank account, wow, this changes something!

Of course I'd like to score higher everything else being the same, but does this makes a real difference after 2 standard-deviations above norm (130)?? I recommend the book flowers for algernon;)

Edited June 25, 2023 by supremeyingyang

[integral]

10 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

It seems not like the real thing. I can't test it afterwards, but I surely improved my IQ by learning to program and working as a programmer for 4 years. For example I can you memorize random passwords effortlessly without trying to, it just sticks after two or so manual entries ( for example: s4/k.Po4$+821) -- just one example of my improved memory and pattern recognition. I'm sure the same pattern recognition skills would be a benefit in taking an IQ test, but again: So what?

We know that there are 150+ IQ person who are loser (lack of discipline) or assholes (lack of EQ) and 'lower IQ' Person, who lead great lives.

Of course I'd like to score higher everything else being the same, but does this makes a real difference after 2 standard-deviations above norm (130)??

Definitely, im also not interested in IQ, its more for general intelligence.

Psychedelics seem to be the most productive tool ive been working with as of lately.

As it generally effects the mind for general training? I guess if you want to increase general intelligence you need a general training tool.

Edited June 25, 2023 by integral

[integral]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

The guy with the 13 point increase practiced Dual 4 Back for 400 hours.

I wonder if taking LSD would speed up learning curve for this task?

Edited June 25, 2023 by integral

[thenondualtankie]

49 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

If you train something, you improve -- who would have thought! This is the golden age of civilization.

Lemme ask you this: What is the benefit beside bragging? Are there any organizations that have the requirement of a IQ over 140? If no, so what? If yes, is it a good idea to train to pass the test? Are you really smart or merely trained? Isn't that the same as with the inflation of grades in school? You perform better on paper, but you are the same person?

Dude, read the post. I addressed this in my third bullet point. He says he experiences legit benefits that aren't just a piece of paper with an increased number.

Edited June 25, 2023 by thenondualtankie

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, supremeyingyang said:

Lemme ask you this: What is the benefit beside bragging? Are there any organizations that have the requirement of a IQ over 140? If no, so what? If yes, is it a good idea to train to pass the test? Are you really smart or merely trained? Isn't that the same as with the inflation of grades in school? You perform better on paper, but you are the same person?

A 13 point IQ difference is huge. 100 is normal, 87 is too low for working virtually any job, and at 83, you can't even join the military.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[supremeyingyang]

9 minutes ago, thenondualtankie said:

Dude, read the post. I addressed this in my third bullet point. He says he experiences legit benefits that aren't just a piece of paper with an increased number.

And he measures the realness how?

9 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

A 13 point IQ difference is huge. 100 is normal, and 87 is too low for working virtually any job.

Thanks for highlighting this, that is exactly what I meant, but maybe could not clear enough describe. If you are, like the person in the video, 2 standard-deviations above normal (136).. then the increase of 13 Points won't be as drastic as from 87 to 100. Say he improved, everything is fine. Does he changes his live, does he makes smarter decisions? If not, then the 13 extra points are useless, except for making a video and bragging. Am I too harsh?

 

[integral]

There is actually Triple-N-Back as well. It adds a color to keep track of.

Dual means that verbal auditory stimulus and spatial visual stimulus are presented at the same time, Two memory tests are ran simultaneously.

For Triple an additional Color stimulus are presented at the same time making 3 memory tests are ran at the same time. 

[Carl-Richard]

5 minutes ago, integral said:

There is actually Triple-N-Back as well. It adds a color to keep track of.

Dual means that verbal auditory stimulus and spatial visual stimulus are presented at the same time, Two memory tests are ran simultaneously.

For Triple an additional Color stimulus are presented at the same time making 3 memory tests are ran at the same time. 

That sounds god damn horrible ?

[Carl-Richard]

19 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

Thanks for highlighting this, that is exactly what I meant, but maybe could not clear enough describe. If you are, like the person in the video, 2 standard-deviations above normal (136).. then the increase of 13 Points won't be as drastic as from 87 to 100. Say he improved, everything is fine. Does he changes his live, does he makes smarter decisions? If not, then the 13 extra points are useless, except for making a video and bragging. Am I too harsh?

You could argue it's even more drastic, as he went from being 1/50 to 1/10000. He went from being very high IQ to genius level. The type of work that becomes available to you in that jump is more valuable than going from say a janitor at 87 IQ to say an office worker at 100 IQ.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Carl-Richard