Why shouldn't I kill someone, steal something, etc.

[Gesundheit]

21 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@Gesundheit @Gesundheit

"watch your ignorance". 

?

[Someone here]

@Gesundheit hehe jk

[tsuki]

On 25.10.2020 at 6:25 AM, Nthnl said:

Although I personality don't want to do these things that are usually considered wrong due to societal training. What actual reason do we have not to do them. In many of Leos videos he says There is no right and wrong, or good and evil are an illusion. I completely agree and understand that. But then what motivation do we have not to do things that are considered bad. Why isn't Leo running around killing people. I want a moral code I can follow while also being a high level thinker. But im starting to think that's impossible. When i say moral code I don't mean moral like Leo has spoken about I've seen those videos as well. 

@Nthnl The idea that you need a reason to not do something comes into the picture when reason to do it exists, and yet, is rejected.
Instead of looking for counter-reasons, I'd suggest investigating why would you want to commit acts that are conventionally considered immoral in the first place.

When you investigate deeply into this matter, there are none.
In fact, reasons for violence exist only because you are not investigating them deeply enough. 

On 25.10.2020 at 6:25 AM, Nthnl said:

I simply want to know, while understanding these illusions and concepts, what i should and shouldn't do. If theres no answer, im not sure i want to be a high level thinker. Maybe I don't fully understand your idea of conscious morality as you talked about before. The idea of not doing harm because you see everyone as you. But if so how does that make any action bad. If we are all an illusion, wouldn't going around killing everyone be a good thing? freeing thousands from the illusion? I'm just lost on this topic, i must have missed something or maybe you didn't cover exactly what im getting at. But if Leo or anyone else has an idea of this please let me know.

When the person is an illusion, killing the person does not free it from illusion. It simply kills the person.
What is pointed at is that you are not the person. It does not imply that the person should be disposed of as trash, killed, or belittled.
The person feels, thinks, breathes, has hopes and aspirations, and a purpose. Why would you ever want to stop that? You cannot love anything other than the dream, for reality itself is love and is your true nature.

Edited October 27, 2020 by tsuki

[mmKay]

Good and bad are relative to our own survival agenda. 

Actions are not good or bad. 

One thing is sure, whatever you do or don't , simply expect consequences. 

Consequences are not good or bad. 

But I'd rather chill and enjoy life doing my own thing rather than being locked up for stabbing someone with a fork. 

But fearing bad consecuences is a  quite autisitc and neurotic way to live life. 

Feel into your life and follow your heart , as cliché and hippie that sounds. 

Your felings of Love and Joy are a good compass. 

When you see a tiny 6 week old kitty, your intuition is to pet it, hold it, cuddle with it, not to reverse triangle choke him with your legs. 

Why? Idk, we just tend to have a natural inclination towards some things rather than others. 

[Gesundheit]

58 minutes ago, mmKay said:

When you see a tiny 6 week old kitty, your intuition is to pet it, hold it, cuddle with it, not to reverse triangle choke him with your legs.

lol no. I have personally witnessed several cases where even children would do mean things to animals. One of my friends who was 14 y.o. at the time kicked a cat down from the 5th floor and it died. He says he hates cats. I myself used to have sadistic thoughts towards my own rabbit when I was a kid. It was because I wanted him to be more intelligent but he wasn't. I did not hurt him though but the thoughts I used to have were strong. Maybe I was born a psychopath idk.

[Nthnl]

On 10/27/2020 at 9:44 AM, tsuki said:

@Nthnl The idea that you need a reason to not do something comes into the picture when reason to do it exists, and yet, is rejected.
Instead of looking for counter-reasons, I'd suggest investigating why would you want to commit acts that are conventionally considered immoral in the first place.

When you investigate deeply into this matter, there are none.
In fact, reasons for violence exist only because you are not investigating them deeply enough. 

When the person is an illusion, killing the person does not free it from illusion. It simply kills the person.
What is pointed at is that you are not the person. It does not imply that the person should be disposed of as trash, killed, or belittled.
The person feels, thinks, breathes, has hopes and aspirations, and a purpose. Why would you ever want to stop that? You cannot love anything other than the dream, for reality itself is love and is your true nature.

I see what your saying, but i genuinely dont want to commit these acts. I'm not saying why shouldn't I particularly. I'm saying whats objectively wrong about these actions we usually call bad or evil. Although throughout reading here i believe I have some more clarity. It feels obvious that anything that goes against the inherent nature of the universe would be seen as bad or feel wrong. Thats probably where these ultimate things came from in society. Feelings and emotions. But, of course, only sith deal in absolutes haha. I'm fairly surprised this post got as popular as it did. Lots of thoughts on the topic. Thank you for your contributions.

[tsuki]

24 minutes ago, Nthnl said:

I'm not saying why shouldn't I particularly. I'm saying whats objectively wrong about these actions we usually call bad or evil.

Nothing. Not in the absolute sense. It is simply a contracted way of being that has the potential to expand.
People that commit these acts get progressively more lost, while people that evolve out of it are happier.
This is where "particulars" come into the picture - you, particularly, shouldn't commit these acts for your own sake.

24 minutes ago, Nthnl said:

Thats probably where these ultimate things came from in society. Feelings and emotions. But, of course, only sith deal in absolutes haha. I'm fairly surprised this post got as popular as it did. Lots of thoughts on the topic. Thank you for your contributions.

Feelings are the only viable compass for growth because they are non-symbolic and you can't get lost within them like you can in thoughts. While we're certainly capable of talking about things we have no clue about, we are always feeling about ourselves, so to speak.

Edited October 28, 2020 by tsuki

[Nthnl]

2 hours ago, tsuki said:

While we're certainly capable of talking about things we have no clue about, we are always feeling about ourselves, so to speak.

Well said.

[Origins]

Short Story time

Imagine you were born in a horrid place, all you knew was the spit, slurs and fists of pain from the people that you're growing up with.

In this environment it was kill or be killed among subordinates as you jostled for approval from your egocentric psychopathic elders. One day when you've left your campsite and you're out in the woods, the only place you've ever known, you see the light that was piercing through the trees glimmer in the distance. This catches your attention to the point that you travel all the way near the end of the woods for the first time where you start to see foreign people riding horses, brushing horse hair, picking berries and farming. Of course, because you've never seen a horse before nor any kind of farming you're startled by the things you see.

Grunts of both fear and curiosity entangle your dissonance but you still struggle to pull your eyes away, eventually a horse without you initially being aware rushes past you and in a panic you pull back where you fall over a rock and hit your head.

Several hours later you wakeup in a bed, water beside you, bandage on your forehead and a candlelight shining the rest of the room. You're all alone. You hear talking just outside your stone built hut, there's an argument between two men in a language you can't understand beyond their expressed emotion, they happen to be arguing about a woman but the only way your brain can interpret the sounds is as a threat. You see a knife beside you. You think inside your internal grunts, "I must break out of here, they have taken me hostage", when in reality they have just tried to heal you.

You pick up the knife, slowly walk towards door you've never seen before, inspect it to the point that you figure out how to turn the handle given its the only option and when you open it abruptly while scaring the living day lights out of the men just outside you slit both of their throats and then make a run for the forest that you see in the distance above the bonfire that's been created by the village people.

As soon as you make it back to camp, through your grunts, facial expressions and hand gestures you communicate to your tribes egocentric psychopathic leaders that they had tried to take you hostage and that maybe they're planning to kill the whole tribe [ of which they of course have no intention, they've known about you all along but they just try to keep their distance ]. 3 days later, no one remained alive between either the tribe or the towns people but one farmer from the town who was crying over his now dead children that were raped and then burned alive.

This is how it used to supposedly be in many different analogous ways. That's a lot to process about human behaviour.

Edited October 30, 2020 by Origins

[Reciprocality]

I believe my post were deleted, but a short version is an innocent question asking maybe instead that there are those you should kill. And perhaps a proposition that murder is not a categorical evil.

Why should you kill them, and are those emotions leading one to such desires to be enacted? If not to an absolution then so not to remain undermined. And even which emotions murder actually sprungs within us, especially men? Are they in themselves a mere self disgust, or is there more?

I would not claim knowledge on these things, which is especially why to cover it is tragical.

[Yamak9889]

On 10/25/2020 at 8:43 AM, Preety_India said:

Because we live in society by following moral standards and a code of ethics just like you browse on this forum by following the forum guidelines. 

Same way. 

And yes these moral standards are set in a way so that everyone gets a decent chance to live and don't end up getting killed like you mentioned. 

 

Agreed

[Yamak9889]

On 10/28/2020 at 8:48 PM, Nthnl said:

Well said.

you should check out Charles Manson. watch his 1996 parole hearing. it's about 2 and a half hours. This should give u a good understanding of why to avoid killing or being around killers. Honestly, I feel like prison is an experience I'd like to have in my lifetime. maybe some day when I get older and experience everything else that can be experienced in this life. LOL