Realizations - The Present Moment Doesn't Exist And Movement Is Impossible

[Primeval]

But then again, your theory could also be a projection/brain filter of thoughts.

[vizual]

I think existence does exist. But only as a potential, it's not really happening right now. Like a movie being stored on a DVD, but the DVD never gets played, the DVD is just there. The DVD contains this beautiful pattern of data which degrades in intensity like a gradient. And what you think you are experiencing is one tiny piece of this gigantic pattern. But, of course, the 'real you' is the entire pattern..

[Primeval]

3 minutes ago, Lha Bho said:

But then again, your theory could also be a projection/brain filter of thoughts.

Furthermore, it seems that you are trying to negate the projection of proposed past/present/future that we all live more or less contently within, albeit perhaps it being an illusion. I say, there is a quote I like "When falling into Madness, DIVE!"... that is to say, keep going down that rabbit hole

[Emerald]

8 minutes ago, Lha Bho said:

But then again, your theory could also be a projection/brain filter of thoughts.

That's true. This is a possibility. 

 

9 minutes ago, vizual said:

I think existence does exist. But only as a potential, it's not really happening right now. Like a movie being stored on a DVD, but the DVD never gets played, the DVD is just there. The DVD contains this beautiful pattern of data which degrades in intensity like a gradient. And what you think you are experiencing is one tiny piece of this gigantic pattern. But, of course, the 'real you' is the entire pattern..

I've heard similar perspectives to this. It definitely fits well in a very intuitive way. But it is a rationalization, so it also is an assumption. But it's an assumption that makes sense none-the-less.

 

5 minutes ago, Lha Bho said:

Furthermore, it seems that you are trying to negate the projection of proposed past/present/future that we all live more or less contently within, albeit perhaps it being an illusion. I say, there is a quote I like "When falling into Madness, DIVE!"... that is to say, keep going down that rabbit hole

Definitely.  I'm trying to boil down what my experiences are beyond the labels that I put upon them. So, down the rabbit hole I go. 

[Rodrigo]

@Emerald Wilkins sense/experience is also thought. You do think about your experience of the body, as soon as you feel it you instantly think it. The body exists, it is real, as real as trees, the sun and the moon. But it exists as such only in thought. You will never know the real body, trees and sun because the filter of thought is always there.

if the illusion of reality is fully realized nothing changes but thought.What i mean in that last sentence is that if the illusion of reality that keeps you able to function as provider for the body is replaced by certain other illusions of reality and completely ignored, you as the body you imagine will die and become smaller living creatures.

[jjer94]

15 minutes ago, vizual said:

I think existence does exist. But only as a potential, it's not really happening right now. Like a movie being stored on a DVD, but the DVD never gets played, the DVD is just there. The DVD contains this beautiful pattern of data which degrades in intensity like a gradient. And what you think you are experiencing is one tiny piece of this gigantic pattern. But, of course, the 'real you' is the entire pattern..

Existence does exist...just not as phenomena (the world as we know it). That's what @Emerald Wilkins is referring to. 

Existence exists as you say: pure infinite potential. Also known as Truth, noumena, infinity, Being, nothingness, etc. 

You cannot "know" existence, because that would put you another level above it. Instead, you can only "be" existence. In a sense, you can really only come to the conclusion that "Truth is" through negating all that you are not.

Edited April 14, 2016 by jjer94

[Dash Us Pain]

skimmed through this. stop the contradictions "its all illusion But Time exists" how can time exist if everything else is an illusion. 

[Emerald]

1 minute ago, Dash Us Pain said:

skimmed through this. stop the contradictions "its all illusion But Time exists" how can time exist if everything else is an illusion. 

Time doesn't exist. It's an illusion that comes from other illusory present moments seeming to pass. Or at least this is a possibility. 

Edited April 14, 2016 by Emerald Wilkins

[Dash Us Pain]

Just now, Emerald Wilkins said:

Time doesn't exist. It's an illusion that comes from other illusory present moments seeming to pass. 

thats what one has been saying all along. it wasn't aimed at you. 

as for dimensions there is only one dimension the 10th. 

this is aimed at no-one which is basically everyone.

If you remove time completely from your thinking then your whole life is flashing before your eyes right now ( i.e you are dying right now).  and your fucking wasting it sitting down for 60 hours a week thinking about your alkalinity and your Chakras and I'm so much better than them bollocks. stick do nothing up ur arses do everything. Nothing isn't going anywhere. everything changes, NOTHING stays the same.

[Emerald]

17 minutes ago, Rodrigo said:

@Emerald Wilkins sense/experience is also thought. You do think about your experience of the body, as soon as you feel it you instantly think it. The body exists, it is real, as real as trees, the sun and the moon. But it exists as such only in thought. You will never know the real body, trees and sun because the filter of thought is always there.

if the illusion of reality is fully realized nothing changes but thought.What i mean in that last sentence is that if the illusion of reality that keeps you able to function as provider for the body is replaced by certain other illusions of reality and completely ignored, you as the body you imagine will die and become smaller living creatures.

I follow you right up to the end, with the smaller living creatures part. If you mean atoms, then even this comes from assumption and theorizing. If you mean actual smaller creatures, then this is nothing that I can actually notice in my present reality. If I'm missing something, please let me know. 

[Rodrigo]

@Emerald Wilkins What i mean is if someone thinks about everything being an illusion it will change nothing.Time is thought and all thought is illusion. Thought is never reality. You can call reality illusion and illusion reality but that will never change the fact that your mind will be always and forever unable to even know if there is a reality. Thought can change itself. Reality will never change thought. Reality is as real as thought make it to be.

What i mean with the creatures part is that the only impact these thoughts about finding what is real or not will really have (apart from creating more thoughts) is that if you go too wild with your thinking you may become unable to keep the body alive as you know it.

Sure all this stuff i write is nothing but thoughts and they are worth the same as any thought out there.

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Dummy said:

How about these contemplations:

 

What is dimensionality?

 

How many dimensions are there in truth? Is an answer to this possible that doesn't imply finiteness and differentiation (and thereby duality)?

 

If dimensions exist, whatever that means... what is it, and how is it different from anything else that exists? Is an answer to this possible that doesn't imply finiteness and differentiation (and thereby duality)?

 

Does infinity have anything to do with size? Is it infinitely large, or infinitely small? In how many dimensions?

 

No dimensions and infinitely many/few dimensions? It's sort of like a non-point too, but I'm not sure. Size is all relative. It can be infinitely large and infinitely small. So, size, direction, and dimension don't exist. 

1 hour ago, jjer94 said:

Existence does exist...just not as phenomena (the world as we know it). That's what @Emerald Wilkins is referring to. 

Existence exists as you say: pure infinite potential. Also known as Truth, noumena, infinity, Being, nothingness, etc. 

You cannot "know" existence, because that would put you another level above it. Instead, you can only "be" existence. In a sense, you can really only come to the conclusion that "Truth is" through negating all that you are not.

Well said.

1 hour ago, Rodrigo said:

@Emerald Wilkins What i mean is if someone thinks about everything being an illusion it will change nothing.Time is thought and all thought is illusion. Thought is never reality. You can call reality illusion and illusion reality but that will never change the fact that your mind will be always and forever unable to even know if there is a reality. Thought can change itself. Reality will never change thought. Reality is as real as thought make it to be.

What i mean with the creatures part is that the only impact these thoughts about finding what is real or not will really have (apart from creating more thoughts) is that if you go too wild with your thinking you may become unable to keep the body alive as you know it.

Sure all this stuff i write is nothing but thoughts and they are worth the same as any thought out there.

I see. So, because thought is the creator of our experience, we could think ourselves out of existence if we're not careful... or think ourselves into a crazy existence. It makes sense. But I'll file it into the beliefs category and use it if it's handy.  

[Rodrigo]

6 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

@Emerald Wilkins Exactly. Psychiatric clinics are full of people whose thoughts as tools for survival of the body as you know it became useless.By meditating you can have the same thoughts/illusions you (your thoughts) create under the influence of drugs. No matter how good, one with everything, happy or peaceful you think you are, it will always be thoughts.In my mind i recognize two:Useful thoughts for the survival of the body, because unlike the tree i need to act to stay "alive". Useless thoughts where i include every thought that does not motivate me to get up and do what needs to be done to put food in stomach. I have plenty of both useless and useful thoughts and useless thoughts are most of the thoughts responsible for making me think i feel good.

 

[cetus]

@Emerald Wilkins     He who thinks he knows where he's standing is in for trouble.

[vizual]

The thing about movement is mind boggling. For movement to exist there need to be at least two separate points to compare its relative distance, if one point is all there is, movement can not be. As an "I", I experience this universe from the notion that I am the centre of the universe and everything relates to me. So everything is at a certain distance from "me". When something appears to move away from me, there seems to be movement, either I am moving away from it or it is moving away from me.

Bit this "I" is not a distinct point at all. There is no point in me from which I can start measuring, this me does not exist. I could say that I start measuring from where my eyeballs start, or from the centre of my brain, but these points are not 'me'. The points from which we measure distance is an illusion, these points do not exist.

I'd say that the illusion of movement is part of the ultimate expression, but there is no truth in movement. Movement is part of the illusion of 'life'. If this movement did not exist then our lives would immediately become meaningless, we would experience the universe as a rock experiences it, the start of our lives would be exactly the same as the end, it just 'is'. We can only experience a sense of meaning if different, distinct points exist in the universe. But since the points are an illusion, so is the sense of meaning. The universe has no real meaning.

I seem 'me' as a sugar cube inside hot tea, in the beginning I can resist that i dissolve inside this tea. I think that I am fighting this tea from tearing me apart. But in the end, it is a losing battle. And in truth, the sugar was a part of the tea al along and I never existed as a distinct cube of sugar.

So to relay this back to me, every sensation of separation is an illusion. Whether it be a thought, the feeling of my body, an emotion, a smell or whatever. All these things work only on false presumptions.

[Dodo]

I feel that whenever this "mental masturbation" as Leo likes to say goes on, it is just the mind trying to say, but wait, I can fit infinity within me, I am capable, just give me another shot and I will explain it. We have to let go, not go further, even tho we think we are getting a better sense for infinity. There are infinite infinities and if we even understand one infinity (we won't) then there are infinitely more to investigate. But the mind keeps trying!

Maybe mentally masturbating myself, just had a mentalgasm.

Edited April 15, 2016 by Dodoster

[cetus]

Check this out. Put it on full screen with your vision at a soft focus at the center of the screen. The images will merge into 3d.