Someone Please Explain What Is "ego"?

[Argue]

Throughout this forum, there are many members expressing opinions about ego. But I cannot comprehend what they're explaining. 

I want to know what ego is. So, I searched for the word ego and learned this: 

My takeaway from these definitions is that ego is pretty much an opinion you have about yourself. For example, you drive a nice $70,000+ car. Thereafter, you're mentally expressing to yourself how good/better you are. Is this right? 

What gets me confused is how people talk about killing ego, an ego is nothing, reality this, meditation that and so on. 

In short, I want to gain the knowledge about what is an "ego." Can someone explain it here - in this thread - articulately that a 10 year old can comprehend? Thank you.  

[Natasha]

@Argue In a nutshell, ego is a mind created false sense of self, and the reason we see ourselves as separate from the rest of existence.

[Argue]

@Natasha very good. You say "ego is a mind created false sense of self."

Can you give some examples of a "sense of false self"?

[jjer94]

14 minutes ago, Argue said:

Can you give some examples of a "sense of false self"?

Here's an analogy for ya.

The job of an actor is to don the role of a character. A character has a certain personality, memories, habits, etc. The degree to which an actor portrays the character sets the good actors apart from the bad actors. From this analogy, you see that the "character" is an imaginary costume garment: that entity with all the personality traits, habits, memories we call the "character" doesn't actually exist. It's just an idea that's portrayed through mind and body by the actor. 

All humans are the greatest actors in the world. We have come to identify ourselves completely with our character (i.e. the "sense of false self") that we don't even realize we're not the character. We actually believe that we are such-and-such: a lawyer, a carpenter, a mother, father, son, a boyfriend, an unworthy bastard, a worthy salesman, a powerful billionaire, a snarky person; that we are shy, stupid, smart, like this book, like this movie, have a grudge against this person...the list goes on. The journey of enlightenment is the process of seeing through and de-identifying with the character you created. 

[Argue]

@jjer94 this is an excellent analogy. Thanks for the insight. I'm grasping the idea now. The only thing that bothers me is enlightment. People praise it so much. I'm skeptical of it. Of course this is another topic but an interesting one where I want to find the core and get an understanding. 

[Natasha]

Just now, Argue said:

@Natasha very good. You say "ego is a mind created false sense of self."

Can you give some examples of a "sense of false self"?

The mind undergoes conditioning from the time we're born. Our family of origin, friends, school, social media, society, etc. all mold the image we adopt of ourselves, which is always based on the false premise, not reality. 'Self' becomes a product of collective un-consciousness. 

Each and everyone of us can serve as an example. De-constructing the conditioned 'self' and replacing it with higher-conscious parts can take years (if not lifetime) of focused effort, courage, and sacrifice. 

[jjer94]

30 minutes ago, Argue said:

@jjer94 this is an excellent analogy. Thanks for the insight. I'm grasping the idea now. The only thing that bothers me is enlightment. People praise it so much. I'm skeptical of it. Of course this is another topic but an interesting one where I want to find the core and get an understanding. 

It's okay to be skeptical; that's a good trait to have going forward. As the philosophical/analytical type, I was the same way. I'll give you a little preview of what enlightenment is, as concise as I possibly can get:

You identify with your character. The problem with this is that you do a lot of things that cause you suffering...without even realizing it. Because it's a character, you constantly need to think it into existence, maintain it, protect it with all your might, because that's who you think you are, right? As a result, most of your life is lived in fear of losing the character. On the flipside, you're also working hard to add on to the character, so you have an endless number of desires to chase after fruitlessly. Not to mention that your potential is held back by the character's "rulebook": its set of should's and should not's.

Enlightenment, in simplest terms, is realizing your true nature. This Truth is very special, because it's not bound by anything; it's timeless. It is what you were before you were born, what you will be after you die, and what you are right now. It sounds a bit airy-fairy, yes, but bear with me for a second. What if you discovered that you were not the time-bound, finite character? That you were not the body nor the mind? That what you fundamentally are cannot die because it was never born? That it is absolute complete perfection right now, and you are it?

Can you imagine the sense of relief that would bring? There is no longer a need to constantly fear the character's death, to constantly strive to add on to the character. You don't take it seriously anymore, but you can wear it like a costume and play with it, as should normally be the case. Every single ineffable moment is perfect for you. You are quite literally reborn, and you now approach the world in child-like wonder. Life becomes a vacation. You wonder why everyone is so serious...and then you remember that they all identify with their characters. Those who must play...cannot play. 

However, all of this comes at a cost. In order to realize what you really are, you must realize what you are not: the character. Fortunately, the character never existed in the first place because it's just an idea, but it sure as hell won't feel that way when you start the journey. At times, it may feel as though you are dying. After the fact, you may still use the character (or another character - you're free to act however you want after the character is seen through) to interface with the world, but you will no longer identify with it. 

Hopefully that clears things up for you a little!

[Argue]

3 minutes ago, jjer94 said:

It's okay to be skeptical; that's a good trait to have going forward. As the philosophical/analytical type, I was the same way. I'll give you a little preview of what enlightenment is, as concise as I possibly can get:

You identify with your character. The problem with this is that you do a lot of things that cause you suffering...without even realizing it. Because it's a character, you constantly need to think it into existence, maintain it, protect it with all your might, because that's who you think you are, right? As a result, most of your life is lived in fear of losing the character. On the flipside, you're also working hard to add on to the character, so you have an endless number of desires to chase after fruitlessly. Not to mention that your potential is held back by the character's "rulebook": its set of should's and should not's.

Enlightenment, in simplest terms, is realizing your true nature. This Truth is very special, because it's not bound by anything; it's timeless. It is what you were before you were born, what you will be after you die, and what you are right now. It sounds a bit airy-fairy, yes, but bear with me for a second. What if you discovered that you were not the time-bound, finite character? That you were not the body nor the mind? That what you fundamentally are cannot die because it was never born? That it is absolute complete perfection right now, and you are it?

Can you imagine the sense of relief that would bring? There is no longer a need to constantly fear the character's death, to constantly strive to add on to the character. You don't take it seriously anymore, but you can wear it like a costume and play with it, as should normally be the case. Every single ineffable moment is perfect for you. You are quite literally reborn, and you now approach the world in child-like wonder. Life becomes a vacation. You wonder why everyone is so serious...and then you remember that they all identify with their characters. Those who must play...cannot play. 

However, all of this comes at a cost. In order to realize what you really are, you must realize what you are not: the character. Fortunately, the character never existed in the first place because it's just an idea, but it sure as hell won't feel that way when you start the journey. At times, it may feel as though you are dying. After the fact, you may still use the character (or another character - you're free to act however you want after the character is seen through) to interface with the world, but you will no longer identify with it. 

Hopefully that clears things up for you a little!

This is perfect! I understand it so well it's scary! I finally get what enlightment means. To me it's something very serious and not for the faint of heart, in my opinion. Enlightment sounds so challenging to accomplish. Especially where I'm from (NYC). Our culture here judges, criticizes, and laughs at things that are not status quo if that makes sense. Right now my mind is telling to not pursue enlightment. That might sound crazy but that's what's happening right now. But thank you so much for the insights, it's flawless I must say. 

[Khin]

@Argue Do you remember when Leo said thoughts are you? (if you watch that part in his videos)  

This is very hard to explain.

I do not expect you would understand and agree with me. You know that since you were born or we were born, there's always been this kind of mindset that a soul is in our body. Please hear my story. When I was young, I once sat down and looked at my body and thought I am inside this body. The "ME", the spirit is possessing this body. In my mind, there were two parts, the body and spirit. When the body die, the soul, me, will get out of it and move on to another body. I had very severe depression when I realized that I and every one would die someday. After that I asked myself, WHAT THE HELL AM I? WHY DEATH? I had gone crazy. So I was sent to Buddhist temple. I'm not religious though but I thank my mother for sending me there. So at the temple, I meditated. woke up early at 3:30 a.m. The temple was high up in mountains. So it was so cold. Bath place had no cover. It wasn't in temple. We all would start the meditation at 4 a.m. to 5:30 a.m. Then have breakfast. Then 6:30 a.m. to 11:00 a.m., had one 30 minute break in between. We would have our lunch before noon. Then whole day meditation with little breaks in between until 9 p.m. without dinner. After five days, imagine how I would be like. I was so thin and felt so dizzy for a week... I fell asleep right away when I laid down on bed.  BUT........  I never hated that place. Actually, I loved it. Because all those effort I put on meditation paid off. I got this whole new knowledge of there is NO ME to DIE!! What a wonderful! I understood what ego is which basically does not exist. In Pali, it's called "Eatta," the sense of entity and permanence.

There is no such thing as EGO inside you or in part of you. Actually Ego is illusion of permanence. But when you realize nothing is permanent, you can't find yourself anymore. That is called ego death for enlightened people. They didn't actually kill it or take something out of them. When they say experience of ego death, it means they understood the truth that there is no such thing as ego. There is no entity as "I." Death means, DISAPPEARING. So with enlightenment, the believe and sense of entity disappeared realizing that there wasn't You or I in the first place. That's ego death.

Ego is sense of permanence. It's named for an illusion of You, the entity exists. Do you aware of you surroundings? Do you aware that nothing lasts forever. You might know but you forget most of the time. You are always filled with day to day things in life. Let alone the microscopic level of impermanence which you would see in sharp awareness, you even forgot your death most of the time. You know because it's obvious but you always feel like, oh I don't think I'm gonna die now.  You know you will die and nothing lasts forever but that's just as a thought. In deep down, you don't see the impermanence. That's ego. Not seeing the way they are makes an illusion of permanence that caused a feeling of an entity, the self.

Actually, every thought, every senses, every feelings are you. I am NOT saying that YOU ARE FEELING THEM. I am saying THEY ARE YOU.

All of your thoughts, senses, feelings never last forever, in fact they disappear right away. Therefore, YOU are disappearing every minute, every second. So which feeling and senses were you? Could you ever hold onto any feelings or senses as the way they are for a little longer after it happened?

This is how illusion of self or life or ego is formed. When something touched you, there will be a sense of "TOUCH." If you did not notice right away as soon as it happens, it generates another thought which is very similar. It's almost like "Touch" and "Touched." And if you don't notice, that "touched" generates another thought which is very similar to it but a little different from actual sense. Example, it's like "touch, touched, touched it." It happens very fast that you will never know without very sharp awareness. There's only one thought can appear in awareness field, so every time the second thought appears, the first will disappear. With awareness, you will see the sense "Touch" as soon as it appears. So awareness cut out the generation thoughts. There for no more thoughts of that sense. If not, like I said, that sense will generate similar thoughts as it disappears, makes it seem like that first actual sense was always there and is permanent. But actually, that actual sense was already gone as soon as it appears. If someone is remembering something for a long time, that means that person is thinking about it again and again. Because it is obviously not an actual sense or feeling.

 

[jjer94]

 

18 minutes ago, Argue said:

Right now my mind is telling to not pursue enlightment. That might sound crazy but that's what's happening right now.

Not crazy at all. In fact, that is exactly what mind will tell you. Mind, i.e. the domain of the character, does not want enlightenment because that means the end of the character as you know it! You want comfort and security. You've been playing the character for so long, and it's familiar. Sure, it's pretty miserable at times, but at least it's known, certain and familiar. The journey of enlightenment is one of entering into the unknown, into uncharted territory where "here be dragons." 

I have a suggestion if you choose not to take this journey. If you're not going to see through yourself, learn to see through other characters around you. NYC is a hub for egoic delusion. Watch everyone scurry around like salmon, taking everything so seriously as if it were all a life-or-death situation. Watch everyone bitch and moan about their circumstances, hoping for a better tomorrow. Watch everyone chase after materialistic possession, as if that will make them permanently happy. With any of your friends, see if you can dissect their character: their motives, their desires, why they do the things they do. By seeing all of this in others, you will learn to see it in yourself, and you will at least learn to loosen up and not take everything so seriously. 

Though something tells me that I implanted the virus in you...and it will only spread until you can't help but begin the journey 

Cheers mate!

Edited April 5, 2016 by jjer94

[Argue]

@Khin interesting that you lived in a Buddhist temple. The whole awareness thing is interesting and the notion of "you". Sounds similar to the book I read, "Self-awareness" by Anthony Di Mello. I dismissed it though and later disagreed with it. It got me into trouble. 

"Could you ever hold on to feelings..." This is an interesting thing to think about. you mentioned senses and now awareness seems like another factor to add. 

[Argue]

6 minutes ago, jjer94 said:

 

Not crazy at all. In fact, that is exactly what mind will tell you. Mind, i.e. the domain of the character, does not want enlightenment because that means the end of the character as you know it! You want comfort and security. You've been playing the character for so long, and it's familiar. Sure, it's pretty miserable at times, but at least it's known, certain and familiar. The journey of enlightenment is one of entering into the unknown, into uncharted territory where "here be dragons." 

I have a suggestion if you choose not to take this journey. If you're not going to see through yourself, learn to see through other characters around you. NYC is a hub for egoic delusion. Watch everyone scurry around like salmon, taking everything so seriously as if it were all a life-or-death situation. Watch everyone bitch and moan about their circumstances, hoping for a better tomorrow. Watch everyone chase after materialistic possession, as if that will make them permanently happy. With any of your friends, see if you can dissect their character: their motives, their desires, why they do the things they do. By seeing all of this in others, you will learn to see it in yourself, and you will at least learn to loosen up and not take everything so seriously. 

Though something tells me that I implanted the virus in you...and it will only spread until you can't help but begin the journey 

Cheers mate!

Haha nice. Thanks. Honestly speaking, I'm afraid and uncomfortable to make a shift from where I'm at to an enlightment state. It seems so risky. But you suggested a fantastic challenge I'm ready to accept. Consciously, I'll observe what's going around in this city and in coworkers and thereafter see if it can truly loosen me up/not take things so seriously. Because boy oh boy, right now everything is chaotic... Everyone at work is so serious, takes work too seriously, coworkers complain about  not being paid more and it goes on and on down a spiraling pessimistic tunnel of crap. 

Everyone, thanks for the input. It's made me more calm and less dismissive about enlightment/awareness/ egoism. I accept it for what it is and I think it's great people do this. 

[Khin]

@Argue LOOK my friend! If something makes you crazy, you should figure it out until you actually know it.

This whole thing I talked about was not something I read in books or from hearsay knowledge. You will never understand it without actually experience. Instead of sitting and thinking about right or wrong, you can take an action to see right or wrong. Aware of your senses as it comes up. Aware what caused it to happen and aware when it disappears. When doing that, make sure you say yourself that there is no you. 

[Argue]

@Khin I think I understand. I'll keep this in mind. This is very helpful and eye opening to me. However, personally for me it's hard because I get easily distracted and lose focus on being "aware". That doesn't mean I won't work hard though. Hope this makes sense? Thank you.  

[nbolt]

52 minutes ago, Argue said:

Especially where I'm from (NYC).

You should hop in the #nyc channel of our actualization chat

 

[bazera]

42 minutes ago, Khin said:

@Argue Do you remember when Leo said thoughts are you? (if you watch that part in his videos)  

This is very hard to explain.

I do not expect you would understand and agree with me. You know that since you were born or we were born, there's always been this kind of mindset that a soul is in our body. Please hear my story. When I was young, I once sat down and looked at my body and thought I am inside this body. The "ME", the spirit is possessing this body. In my mind, there were two parts, the body and spirit. When the body die, the soul, me, will get out of it and move on to another body. I had very severe depression when I realized that I and every one would die someday. After that I asked myself, WHAT THE HELL AM I? WHY DEATH? I had gone crazy. So I was sent to Buddhist temple. I'm not religious though but I thank my mother for sending me there. So at the temple, I meditated. woke up early at 3:30 a.m. The temple was high up in mountains. So it was so cold. Bath place had no cover. It wasn't in temple. We all would start the meditation at 4 a.m. to 5:30 a.m. Then have breakfast. Then 6:30 a.m. to 11:00 a.m., had one 30 minute break in between. We would have our lunch before noon. Then whole day meditation with little breaks in between until 9 p.m. without dinner. After five days, imagine how I would be like. I was so thin and felt so dizzy for a week... I fell asleep right away when I laid down on bed.  BUT........  I never hated that place. Actually, I loved it. Because all those effort I put on meditation paid off. I got this whole new knowledge of there is NO ME to DIE!! What a wonderful! I understood what ego is which basically does not exist. In Pali, it's called "Eatta," the sense of entity and permanence.

There is no such thing as EGO inside you or in part of you. Actually Ego is illusion of permanence. But when you realize nothing is permanent, you can't find yourself anymore. That is called ego death for enlightened people. They didn't actually kill it or take something out of them. When they say experience of ego death, it means they understood the truth that there is no such thing as ego. There is no entity as "I." Death means, DISAPPEARING. So with enlightenment, the believe and sense of entity disappeared realizing that there wasn't You or I in the first place. That's ego death.

Ego is sense of permanence. It's named for an illusion of You, the entity exists. Do you aware of you surroundings? Do you aware that nothing lasts forever. You might know but you forget most of the time. You are always filled with day to day things in life. Let alone the microscopic level of impermanence which you would see in sharp awareness, you even forgot your death most of the time. You know because it's obvious but you always feel like, oh I don't think I'm gonna die now.  You know you will die and nothing lasts forever but that's just as a thought. In deep down, you don't see the impermanence. That's ego. Not seeing the way they are makes an illusion of permanence that caused a feeling of an entity, the self.

Actually, every thought, every senses, every feelings are you. I am NOT saying that YOU ARE FEELING THEM. I am saying THEY ARE YOU.

All of your thoughts, senses, feelings never last forever, in fact they disappear right away. Therefore, YOU are disappearing every minute, every second. So which feeling and senses were you? Could you ever hold onto any feelings or senses as the way they are for a little longer after it happened?

This is how illusion of self or life or ego is formed. When something touched you, there will be a sense of "TOUCH." If you did not notice right away as soon as it happens, it generates another thought which is very similar. It's almost like "Touch" and "Touched." And if you don't notice, that "touched" generates another thought which is very similar to it but a little different from actual sense. Example, it's like "touch, touched, touched it." It happens very fast that you will never know without very sharp awareness. There's only one thought can appear in awareness field, so every time the second thought appears, the first will disappear. With awareness, you will see the sense "Touch" as soon as it appears. So awareness cut out the generation thoughts. There for no more thoughts of that sense. If not, like I said, that sense will generate similar thoughts as it disappears, makes it seem like that first actual sense was always there and is permanent. But actually, that actual sense was already gone as soon as it appears. If someone is remembering something for a long time, that means that person is thinking about it again and again. Because it is obviously not an actual sense or feeling.

 

"Actually, every thought, every senses, every feelings are you. I am NOT saying that YOU ARE FEELING THEM. I am saying THEY ARE YOU"

I am a little confused here. I thought I should not identify myself with my thoughts and mind, because I am not mind and thoughts, I am the observer behind the thoughts. Can you make this a bit clear for me?

[Khin]

Well, you cannot not identify yet because you are not enlightened yet. Once you understand that there is No you in actual experience, you will automatically stop thinking that YOU ARE FEELING. Because you realized there is no You to receive any feelings or to observe. There is awareness to know. For example, you are crossing the river because you there is better life on other shore. You only have woods on this side. So you hold onto a trunk and cross the river. But when you saw boats on other side and thought, man only if I could use a boat, it would be easier. Holding on the trunk was such hard way.

It's exactly the same. Enlightened people are saying this and that but you can't follow them exactly because you don't have actual knowledge as them. There for you can only use what you have. if enlightened people said there's no you, you can only take the word. Observer means an awareness. That is not behind the thought, it actually comes up after senses and feelings. It is knowing the actual sense. In microscopic level, this is how it happens. < sense, awareness (noticing).>, < sense, awareness>, < sense, awareness>. It's not like something stays behind all the feelings and watching over it. You must train to have awareness. Then it goes from manmade to natural.  Enlightened people may say all their knowledge but we can't deny that unenlightened people don't know as much as them.  

So......... in enlightenment path, main goal is to observe YOU? By thinking you are observing, is there still need to find YOU? Because there's already YOU observing things. It's like Since you are driving your car, is there still need to find where your car is at? Therefore, you need to put YOU and I away and be aware of feelings and senses as the way they are with curiosity. Try to look for YOU! like.. is that feeling me? or this?

Edited April 5, 2016 by Khin
sentence error