Fifty fifty relationships versus man providing as an alternative?

[Pretty In Blue]

Hello everyone,

After an unsuccessful relationship, I have been single for the past couple of years. During that time, I was studying different viewpoints of relationships and I came across a YouTube channel "The Universe Guru" by Mina Irfan. This is a Pakistani immigrant living in US a she is putting forward this idea of 3 levels of relationships:

1. level - masculine man and feminine woman - the man is in complete control, woman is obedient and not in control of the finances, etc. 

2. level - the 50:50 relationships - typical in western countries, either partner pays half or some percentage (not a strict half - depending on their income ratio), they sort of do half of household chores..basically the "fair" relationship, based on the information from her, this is the type of relationship that makes people miserable after a longer time and also it is the most sexless of all types

3. level - conscious relationship, the woman uses rotational dating and dates multiple men at once without being physical with them and once any man is interested in her, he asks her to marry him (this can happen very fast, even in a month or two). After his proposal, her family gets to meet him and vet him, he provides documents and bank statements that he is able to provide for his family and that he is decent and stuff. When she agrees to marry him, they get married and have sex after the marriage (she says this is important, as otherwise the man will just have casually sex with the woman, she will get emotionally attached to him and he will never marry her, or he will, but after a looong time and that this is very common in western countries - the endless dating without proposal. When in marriage, the man is consciously providing for the woman, paying all the basic needs from his money, woman has her own money (or they can have a shared account), but she is independent, however lets the man provide for her (she could easily take care of herself, but in order to keep the relationship polarized, she consciously puts herself in feminine energy when she is with the man and he is securing and protecting her fully). Her own money is then used for her beauty, self growth or investment or extra luxuries. In order for this kind of relationship to work properly, Mina claims that this couple should be married, so that they are in that together and can build their generational wealth together, that both the woman is secured (in case she stays at home for periods of time with children etc...so that is why the man needs to secure her financially by himself) and the man knows as well, that this is his wife and he is pouring his money into his family basically. 

My apologies for this wild explanation, but I hope you get the point. I got kind of stuck on this concept, because I am not from any kind of arabic culture or other culture that would practice this. There are some things I find extremely valuable, because to be honest, I HATE fifty fifty relationships, for some reason they make me feel like crap (and she actually touches on a lot of reasons why that is..). However, on the other hand the idea of marrying someone so fast seems very dangerous, as marriage is no guarantee of anything and divorce can be very painful, if you already built a life for yourself as well. 

I am very desperate lately, as I cannot seem to grasp this concept fully and I guess I am looking for some alternatives? Do you guys follow any YouTubers or influencers or have some books on this topic? Cause the idea of man providing seems to be pissing a lot of men off (in unrelated internet discussions that I have seen so far) and in my head the idea of men providing and keeping relationship polarized sounds great, but of course if the men don't like that, then I (as a woman) don't feel like pushing anybody into anything. I saw some male channels on instagram like Stephen Speaks (also on YT) or taylorlove.co on Instagram and others, but from what I have seen a lot of women follow them..in a book by David Deida - The way of superior man - nothing like this is mentioned. I remember that only like one sentence was "Man should take the financial responsibility" I am like huh?? can you be any more vague? what does it mean?

Mina was also talking about how women being feminine feed the men with their energy and feminine women are basically building men up by having sex with them. That a man is truly self confident only after he has sex with a woman, because he is pulling that precious feminine energy from her and building himself up. She is saying that this is known in eastern cultures and they are protecting women by keeping the sex after marriage, so that both men and women get what they need (men gets that feminine energy through sex and women get that masculine providing). That a woman to be fully feminine needs to be rested (and work and educate herself for her pleasure or on her own terms, not from a desperate need for money - that is the man job) and that is the man who takes care of her and lets her rest to be radiant and fuel him. And that unmarried women lets themselves being used and they spent years building a man up while being his girlfriend and then the man leaves them for someone else and is already built a lot of money etc with the use of one woman, who does not get to benefit from that.

Anyhow, sorry for my rant, but if there is anybody who can recommend to me any good concept on how to approach relationships or what is your views on dating with and without marriage, I would appreciate it so much. I want to clarify for myself what I really want and what is possible, before I start dating again.. 

Thank you very much in advance for your help.

 

 

 

[Hojo]

That 3rd one dosent work the men will just stay single. There is nothing protecting the man from the woman taking half his belongings if he's paying for everything.

Imagine saying in the reversal the woman works and pays for the man while he dates around and then find one and gets married after a couple months. The man then can spend all his own money on working out and beauty products and video games and the woman must take care of him.

What is building generational wealth together when the man is paying for everything they need and the woman is doing whatever she wants.

 

This woman is bonkers.

 

It does piss men off. Cause getting fucked over once means its back to square one from the very beggining.

This is like reversal reason we have common law. Maybe we need common law for men.

 

Edited 19 hours ago by Hojo

[Pretty In Blue]

Hello Hojo, thank you so much for your reaction! I completely understand where you are coming from and those were my concerns as well. 

I just want to explain some things from my post that I did not write too clearly - 

The idea was not that the woman dates around while the man is providing. The idea is that the woman goes on dates with multiple man to find out the one that is most compatible for her (and she supposes that men are actually doing the same thing - they are dating multiple women at once to find the right one - this is actually a whole concept of rotational dating - you are not physical with any of those people, you are getting to know them). After they choose each other, the presumption is that they enter a monogamous relationship. So I wanted to clarify this part. 

Also the reason behind man providing was that she can up level herself for him, so that her energy, beauty, body, everything is the best it could be for her husband. And so when she invests in her looks, that is something that he benefits from as well. (Although I get your point that this is speculative, I am just simply explaining the logic behind it). From the men side, she claims that a man is falling in love by providing and if he does not pour into the woman, he cannot ever love her fully, nor can he ever feel like a complete man (she said it is correlated to his hormonal system and that he is wired to give from his overflow and that is what brings him deep satisfaction). Also she said that a lot of men will claim they don't want this and that they want a fifty fifty, but once they try it, they enjoy it and she gave testimonies from her clients who switched from fifty fifty to man providing and their relationship quality improved overall (even sexually).

So the example that you provided - a woman providing for a man - this also exists, but it doesn't function very well longterm, cause woman's body is not set up for such productivity and she inevitably burns out. The man is not falling in love and does not feel masculine and useful and is not satisfied at all. (Again, maybe you would disagree, I am just trying to explain the theory behind this). And also evolutionarily, this does not have any background, while a man providing for a woman has evolutionary background. 

Building generational wealth part - she was talking about this in connection that it is important for the woman to have her own outlet and be able to make money as well, cause it is very possible that once she comes back to work after having kids, or she launches some business or whatever, because she is not forced to make money (their livelihood is covered 100 % by the man), she is making money out of pleasure, which is the way women are supposed to work (according to her input) - because women have different hormones and bodies and they can achieve top results under different conditions. And so once the woman starts making money, that is the time they can put these money into investments and build the wealth (while the mans income is used to cover basic expenses). The whole idea is that the women's income is not needed, however it should come as the woman should also be capable and not useless in the real world like the woman from the level 1.

The reason why I am talking about this in such detail is that I tried fifty fifty relationships (I never had any other type of relationship) and the man never fell in love with me, the relationship became boring no matter what we tried and it eventually faded away. After studying this, I also came to the conclusion that one thing is what men say and whole another thing is what men DO. So you saying that men hate it - I hear you, but at the same time, are they really satisfied in fifty fifty? All I see around me are miserable fifty fifty relationships. Nothing is polarized. 

So I honestly have no idea what to do. I want a relationship, but I have NO CLUE how to treat men anymore. I don't know what to do, cause I don't want to be miserable again, at the same time I don't want to force a man into anything, if they really do not want to provide, I get it, but is it possible that they actually like it but will not admit it? In my fifty fifty, I always felt like something is off, but could not put my finger on it..

And what is the best model you could strive for? Honestly I am sooo confused by all the contradictory advice on the internet..all I know is that nothing has been working for me and I want to try something different, but I am not sure what that could look like. Honestly, at this point I am so desperate that I am contemplating just forgetting this and take things as they are..

Anyway, thank you for your input, you actually confirmed what I already thought..so yeah I get it..I understand men don't want to be used  My ultimate goal was to create a fulfilling relationship..that is all..

As I said above, I would be super grateful for any advice how should the well working relationship look like in practice. What is your model then?

[something_else]

13 hours ago, Pretty In Blue said:

3. level - conscious relationship, the woman uses rotational dating and dates multiple men at once without being physical with them and once any man is interested in her, he asks her to marry him (this can happen very fast, even in a month or two). After his proposal, her family gets to meet him and vet him, he provides documents and bank statements that he is able to provide for his family and that he is decent and stuff. When she agrees to marry him, they get married and have sex after the marriage (she says this is important, as otherwise the man will just have casually sex with the woman, she will get emotionally attached to him and he will never marry her, or he will, but after a looong time and that this is very common in western countries - the endless dating without proposal. When in marriage, the man is consciously providing for the woman, paying all the basic needs from his money, woman has her own money (or they can have a shared account), but she is independent, however lets the man provide for her (she could easily take care of herself, but in order to keep the relationship polarized, she consciously puts herself in feminine energy when she is with the man and he is securing and protecting her fully). Her own money is then used for her beauty, self growth or investment or extra luxuries. In order for this kind of relationship to work properly, Mina claims that this couple should be married, so that they are in that together and can build their generational wealth together, that both the woman is secured (in case she stays at home for periods of time with children etc...so that is why the man needs to secure her financially by himself) and the man knows as well, that this is his wife and he is pouring his money into his family basically. 

Very few men reading this will think "this is what I want in life"

She's basically saying the man should take on all responsibility while the women gets to live a life of zero stress, ease and luxury. How is that fair?

In many ways this is worse than the level 1 relationship because in the level 1 relationship is purely transactional and everybody involved knows, while this level 3 relationship is basically the same, but the woman is trying to screw over the man and extract as much from him as possible with intent.

This is a power dynamic that heavily favours the woman, and imbalanced power dynamics generally create very unstable relationships filled with hatred, resentment and misery.

Quote

after a looong time and that this is very common in western countries - the endless dating without proposal

This is a feature, not a bug. It takes a long time to work out if you're compatible enough to spend the rest of your life with someone, and the consequence of getting this wrong is extremely high. This isn't a decision that should be made within less than a year. 3-5 years is typical in Western countries, that's a pretty decent amount of time to spend with someone to figure out if you're compatible enough to marry. 3 years is where most relationships start to show cracks, because before that you're still hyped up on love chemicals.

The level 2 relationship with two compatible and conscious people will be far more of a 'conscious' relationship than what she proposes for level 3.

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

Nowhere am I seeing what it is that you are supposed to provide, except for yourself. Not even any kind of effort from your side, and clearly not being raised all too well, considering you are engaging with the idea of spinning men as plates (yes they'd all be dates, but that's pretty much almost identical as men spinning women via sex from a woman's POV). So, since you haven't been brought up well and you'd never be willing to put much effort if any, it is pretty much a wrap, or, in other words, it's over, finito

[Pretty In Blue]

Hello something_else,

thank you for your reply and input. I really appreciate you taking the time and replying to me on this. 

To clarify on what I meant (I am sorry maybe I am writing it all wrong, cause I feel like I am leaving a very negative impression here on her work based on the replies here) - she did not mean that the woman is just laying around all day doing nothing. That would not be something I would even consider. What she means is that the partners work together as a union, each of them is in their polarity (man is in his masculine and woman is in her feminine) and each of them is contributing with their individual gifts. She was saying that men are unhappy in fifty fifty relationships (and that they are ending up resenting the woman they are with), because they do not feel respected, appreciated and they don't feel like a man, living to their full potential. (I cannot comment on this, cause I am not a man, so I don't know what men need to feel fulfilled in a relationship). However she was saying that a true respect is not possible in a relationship where a woman si basically doing exactly the same thing as the man. But if he is securing her, taking care of her and providing, then she can respect him easily and appreciate him honestly. What the men is getting out of this - based on her explanation is that he feels useful, manly and fulfilled. He is fed with the feminine energy (this is what she was explaining as well that kind of disturbed me a bit - she was saying that the women is being depleted by having sex with the man, as he is recharging and refreshing himself through sex, while she is depleting herself - that is why she should be provided for, cause if she is charging up a man via sex, then she should get something back...?). I mean this feels off to me and if any of you have any resources on this sexual dynamics, I would be happy to educate myself further. 

Well the difference between level 1 and 3 should be in the consciousness and options - each of them is in their polarity and recognizing that in order for them to be fulfilled, they have to have a polarized relationship - it is not supposed to be fair, it is supposed to be in adherence to nature. Nobody is forced to do it, they have other options, but they decide to do, cause it makes them feel good. I mean the whole providing was normal in the past, so she is basically talking about how we evolved. And the level 3 is supposed to bring together two people who consciously know what makes them feel good and they acting according to it, even if it is not fifty fifty fair. 

The endless dating point - she says it is a bug because men allegedly know very fast if they want to marry a woman (historically people got married in arranged marriages where the person was vetted and they did not have three years to be dating and testing and verifying. There was mentioned in the videos that a lot of men basically knew that they are never gonna marry their longterm girlfriends and they were just dragging them on. I would never think this was possible, until I discussed this topic with several groups of women who told me that after years of having a boyfriend, they had to drag him to the altar (I mean he was not willing to do it on his own without a little or bigger push...). And Mina says that if you use rotational dating, the men usually propose very fast (because they know soon if they want you as a wife or not).

Look I am not saying that this is a correct approach. This is what I studied as a concept, I never used it in practice. I do not have the feeling that anybody would be used in this case. I mean the man has to be aware of what is happening. I am simply asking questions here, because this is a forum and this was an idea and concept that is drastically different from what I ever studied on relationships.

I want to thank you again for your thoughts. I find them super useful and your comment is exactly why I asked this question. I have many issues with this approach, but I wanted to discuss it. 

[Pretty In Blue]

Hello NewKidOnTheBlock,

I partially replied to this in my previous post (in my reply to something_else) - yeah that is the idea actually. What the woman brings is the intangible, the energy she is in while being with the man, making him feel good, respecting him, creating him a home, bringing and caring for children (if they have any), taking care of herself and her looks, appreciating him for what he does. And also working - I explained it above about the feminine work and also about the sex part. You know when you are doing things in life, when they are truly appreciated, it makes you feel great. Apparently, she says that men need this. That is the dynamic - one person is giving, the other person is receiving. If both are giving, and nobody is receiving with appreciation, that makes the giving not so fulfilling. 

I know there are forums and videos and channels on internet where people agree with this and then there are forums where people strongly disagree. I think it is very courageous from you to be saying that I "haven't been brought up well". Just because I asked a question in a forum? I said that I had many reservations towards this approach and that I was never in any other relationship than fifty fifty.

So..if you have a suggestion what a healthy relationship dynamic should look like, I would love to hear that. But otherwise..I don't know what to say. 

 

[Pretty In Blue]

To everyone - I did not mean to offend anybody. I was literally studying a concept out of desperation I guess. I am trying to explain it as best of my abilities, but apparently I am not doing a very good job. It seems everybody is strictly opposed this - do you please have any other suggestion? Anything to look into? Books etc.? I would greatly appreciate also books on sexual dynamics that you find useful. thank you all.

[something_else]

18 minutes ago, Pretty In Blue said:

I mean this feels off to me and if any of you have any resources on this sexual dynamics, I would be happy to educate myself further. 

It feels off to you because this woman is shrouding selfishness and delusion in spiritual language to make it seem more acceptable. This is your gut telling you that she's spouting twaddle

20 minutes ago, Pretty In Blue said:

it is not supposed to be fair, it is supposed to be in adherence to nature. Nobody is forced to do it, they have other options, but they decide to do, cause it makes them feel good. I mean the whole providing was normal in the past, so she is basically talking about how we evolved.

This is what's called the "appeal to nature" fallacy. Just because something is natural doesn't make it correct.

Almost every human used to feel compelled to enter brutal wars with other neighbouring tribes, yet we have realised that despite this being in our nature, it creates awful outcomes. Because of this, as we developed we have chosen to ignore this impulse because we know it is ultimately bad for us. The people who still follow this natural impulse end up in gangs, dead, or in jail.

Another example is that our 'nature' tells us to gobble up as much sugary and fatty foods as possible, but we as modern humans know that this is bad for us in excess and so we choose to ignore this impulse. The people who follow their 'nature' here end up obese and dead from heart disease at 50.

28 minutes ago, Pretty In Blue said:

she says it is a bug because men allegedly know very fast if they want to marry a woman (historically people got married in arranged marriages where the person was vetted and they did not have three years to be dating and testing and verifying.

Men do not know instantly. They may have a sense that a woman is good marriage material quite early on but ultimately unless you have lived together for several years you really have no idea if marriage is a good idea or not.

Most of these historical arranged marriages were between the wealthy land owners and upper classes, and they were filled with misery and infidelity. It was not uncommon to marry the person your family chose and then continue fucking about on the side with other people you actually liked. The common people mostly chose their partners themselves as well.

Again, tradition is not a good thing to base your opinions on. A lot of traditions are stupid and don't apply to the modern world.

36 minutes ago, Pretty In Blue said:

This is what I studied as a concept,

It's interesting to think about, but it is not a good model for relationships. In general I would avoid outsourcing your love life strategy to other people, especially influencers who benefit financially from preaching systems like this to you.

[LordFall]

It's good that you're introspecting on which relationship model would work best for you. Not enough people do that and get stuck in societal norms which rarely are optimal for anyone.

Personally I'm a bisexual polyamorist and would like to date multiple more submissive partners and ideally work on a collective business together and/or provide for the ones that aren't that productive. I work a lot and have worked on business for a while so seems natural to me to create my own structure outside of established norms. I live in Montreal so alternative lifestyles are pretty normal here. 

I would say use AI to flesh out and reverse engineer your dream lifestyle and go from there. What I agree with most in your level 3 relationship is the importance on going on a lot of dates to find a compatible partner. Dating is pretty exhausting so most people go on less than 10 dates and settle in a mediocre relationship afterwards. That's pretty wild to me, you should probably go on at least 30-50 dates if you aim to find just one final partner. 

Have you read through the female dating strategies subreddit? They fall a bit too much into the anti men philosophy but from a woman's perspective, it'll be probably refreshing to read through women fleshing out their ideal relationships. It's not active anymore but you can sort by top and read through the posts. 

Also in general there are plenty of provider males out there. I am one of them and in general I get dopamine from giving money to a woman and people in general as long as they are appreciative of it. It helps to work on looksmaxxing so you look your best and if by chance you're bisexual I think you're setting yourself up for a much easier ride IMO. 

https://www.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/

 

 

Edited 1 hour ago by LordFall