We Need to Start Bullying AI Slop Again

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

17 hours ago, Basman said:

I'm not so optimistic that's possible. That line of thinking skews easily into hyperbole. 

I'll believe when I see it.

Well, artificial inteligence is many orders of magnitude more scalable than a biological one, in fact a biological one is not really scalable at all and as a matter of fact we do not even know for certain where's the ceiling for artificial one. This is where that assumption comes from and I think it's pretty logical

[Basman]

22 minutes ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

Well, artificial inteligence is many orders of magnitude more scalable than a biological one, in fact a biological one is not really scalable at all and as a matter of fact we do not even know for certain where's the ceiling for artificial one. This is where that assumption comes from and I think it's pretty logical

That's currently just a fantasy. There doesn't exist anything that approaches that nor do we know where to even begin. We don't know if it's possible. It's like saying "one day we'll have flying cars". No, what you get is tanks with fur. The future is nigh impossible to predict in a neat way that follows some kind of popular archetype.

The popular idea of AI is just the idea of a computer scaled up in a linear fashion till it becomes so powerful it becomes sentient and smarter than humans. It's a mythical conventien of how computers work from the 80s.

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

7 minutes ago, Basman said:

That's currently just a fantasy. There doesn't exist anything that approaches that nor do we know where to even begin. We don't know if it's possible. It's like saying "one day we'll have flying cars". No, what you get is tanks with fur. The future is nigh impossible to predict in a neat way that follows some kind of popular archetype.

The popular idea of AI is just the idea of a computer scaled up in a linear fashion till it becomes so powerful it becomes sentient and smarter than humans. It's a mythical conventien of how computers work from the 80s.

I don't understand, we do know it is possible to scale computing power, it's been been doubling every 2 years since about mid 1970s, and the growth has been exponential not linear. It has only slowed down somewhat for a short time during late 2000s because we've hit the physical limits in the shrinkage of transistors, but we've circumvented that issue as well and the growth is continuing at more or less the same rate. Current A.I. models are also demonstrating exponential growth in terms of their benchmark abilities. In general, we can see that scaling the number of data centers works. Giving them access to more energy works as well, and they can get access to as much energy as they can handle. With biological beings this doesn't work, you can't scale them by giving them more energy nor space. Just claiming something is a fantasy is not an argument

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

I don't understand, we do know it is possible to scale computing power, it's been been doubling every 2 years since about mid 1970s, and the growth has been exponential not linear. It has only slowed down somewhat for a short time during late 2000s because we've hit the physical limits in the shrinkage of transistors, but we've circumvented that issue as well and the growth is continuing at more or less the same rate. Current A.I. models are also demonstrating exponential growth in terms of their benchmark abilities. In general, we can see that scaling the number of data centers works. Giving them access to more energy works as well, and they can get access to as much energy as they can handle. With biological beings this doesn't work, you can't scale them by giving them more energy nor space. Just claiming something is a fantasy is not an argument

What happens when you scale a rock?

[Natasha Tori Maru]

7 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

What happens when you scale a rock?

Holy fuck, I was going to say 'What happens when you scale a doorstop?' to make a similar point ...

Fuck. CARL! 

[Carl-Richard]

15 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Holy fuck, I was going to say 'What happens when you scale a doorstop?' to make a similar point ...

Fuck. CARL! 

I will throw a rock- I mean a doorstop at you right now through the screen and you will catch it with your left arm, yes? Let's go. 

My screen is black.

Sorry, I've been watching "not allowed to laugh in the cabin", a horrible Norwegian game show that destroys your sense of what is funny.

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

28 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

What happens when you scale a rock?

Nothing of course, because nothing is happening within a rock. This is why philosophical point of view is insufficient

[Carl-Richard]

4 minutes ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

Nothing of course, because nothing is happening within a rock. This is why philosophical point of view is insufficient

A computer is a rock: silicon and metal.

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

11 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

A computer is a rock: silicon and metal.

Yes, and there are physics happenning within that rock - quantum mechanics, electromagnetism, termodynamics. Just like there is chemistry happening within inorganic matter, but certain specific types of chemistry have given rise to biological consciousness, I don't see why there can't be another, artificial kind

[Basman]

4 hours ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

I don't understand, we do know it is possible to scale computing power, it's been been doubling every 2 years since about mid 1970s, and the growth has been exponential not linear. It has only slowed down somewhat for a short time during late 2000s because we've hit the physical limits in the shrinkage of transistors, but we've circumvented that issue as well and the growth is continuing at more or less the same rate. Current A.I. models are also demonstrating exponential growth in terms of their benchmark abilities. In general, we can see that scaling the number of data centers works. Giving them access to more energy works as well, and they can get access to as much energy as they can handle. With biological beings this doesn't work, you can't scale them by giving them more energy nor space. Just claiming something is a fantasy is not an argument

More computing power doesn't follow that it becomes sentient. Computing power just increases. It's a leap in logic to assume that scaleability turns into general intelligence. 

Edited 58 minutes ago by Basman

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

17 minutes ago, Basman said:

More computing power doesn't follow that it becomes sentient. Computing power just increases. It's a leap in logic to assume that scaleability turns into general intelligence. 

Yes, if you're just scaling computing power then that's not enough specifically for general inteligence. But you can isolate the various components of what makes up general inteligence, develop them in isolation and then merge them together and scale it all together. That's what we are attempting with world models, neurosymbolic structures, etc. There are still components missing but we can develop those as well. The way humans are scaling their inteligence (although not really) is in the number of people, we create societies, states, institutions, companies and the list goes on. Those numbers are capable of creating things a single individual would never be inteligent enough, nor capable enough of creating. Well, A.I.s are gonna work the same way, even if they'll be less inteligent than us in a 1-1 comparison, with the power of numbers they would still be able to outhink us. They'd also think much, much faster than we can