Is a Doorknob Conscious?

[AtmanIsBrahman]

I'm making this post trying to connect the dots between different parts of Leo's teachings, for myself and anyone who might be interested. I was thinking about how academic philosophy thinks of consciousness as something that biological organisms have, and that can be tested based on criteria for what makes something conscious. This is obviously wrong-- the criteria are arbitrary, and the entire approach misunderstands what consciousness is. Leo has said that consciousness is what reality is, not something that a biological organism has, so the organism actually is consciousness, it doesn't "have" it.

But still, there is something that is meant by the conventional idea that an organism has or doesn't have consciousness. It's obvious if you contemplate that consciousness is a spectrum, which can be imagined as having something like single-celled organisms at the bottom, then plants, animals, humans, enlightened humans, aliens, and God.

This makes a lot of sense, but it gets tricky when you think about what exists below that bottom layer of single-celled organisms. Based on our experience, it seems like most things in the universe actually fall into this category, which is what we would conventionally call "physical" or "dead matter." Let's take the example of a doorknob, for example. As a spiritual, new age person, you definitely want to say that the doorknob is conscious, but is that really true? It's pretty obvious that it doesn't have the mental machinery needed to have any subjective experience at all. So in the conventional sense, no, the doorknob isn't conscious. But if we switch to the consciousness as Everything paradigm, then the doorknob is consciousness.

The issue here is basically, can consiousness decide to be unconscious? From a finite point of view, it can-- that's what it means for consciousness to appear as a "physical" object, it's dumbing itself down to a state where it has no awareness. But from the absolute point of view, the object is consciousness even if it's completely unaware of itself as such.

Leo has a really profound blog post from a few months ago that touches on this topic. It's called "Absolute Blue" (link if you want to read it: https://www.actualized.org/insights/absolute-blue). The questions is, if you imagine a reality where nothing exists but the color blue (you can replace this with the doorknob), in all directions, eternally, then does this reality perceive itself? The answer is yes, because Absolute Blue is Truth and Truth is self-luminous. Truth is synonymous with existence, so it is the only thing that can exist. And Existence must know itself because it is the foundation and bedrock of reality- there is nothing behind the scenes; this is where it all ends.

So the takeaway is that consciousness knows itself even in its simplest form because it is Truth. Understanding that fully is probably going to take an awakening (I haven't fully gotten there myself), but contemplating these things gets you closer and closer. 

@Leo Gura Is my understanding on the right track? How do you grasp the connection between Consciousness and Truth more deeply?

 

[Malkom]

Everything is Consciousness. But the key question here is whether the doorknob possesses Self-Consciousnesss...

[Malkom]

And the consciousness of a doorknob is completely different from the consciousness of a human being, and you can't even imagine this until you yourself become a doorknob. No description will help, because there is no analogy for it in our consciousness.

[Leo Gura]

A confusion happens between Consciousness and having a mind. A doorknob is Consciousness but it does not have a mind so it cannot do what minds do.

When humans say that a doorknob is not conscious what they mean is that the doorknob does not have a mind.

Edited yesterday at 08:31 PM by Leo Gura

[Schahin]

This guy on YouTube that had a salvia trip said he became a house in a pretty neighbourhood and he was actually very pleased and happy of being the rest of eternity a house.

The other houses of the neighbourhood were teaching him Divine laws (how amazing).

Well therefore I think even a doorknob has consciousness and might even know the Divine laws, that we people don't even know

[Leo Gura]

@Schahin That is not a doorknob, that is a human/God dreaming it is a doorknob.

[theoneandnone]

10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Schahin That is not a doorknob, that is a human/God dreaming it is a doorknob.

That’s how radical God is. ♾️

[Terell Kirby]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

A confusion happens between Consciousness and having a mind. A doorknob is Consciousness but it does not have a mind so it cannot do what minds do.

When humans say that a doorknob is not conscious what they mean is that the doorknob does not have a mind.

Well .. I’d take it that God is only entity which has a mind/Consciousness. Humans don’t have minds, just like a doorknob, a chair or anything else for that matter (animate, inanimate and everything in between).

Things that appear in Mind/consciousness are often mistaken for having Consciousness-in the world of duality, it’s silly when you think of it-what’s Infinite can never be contained in something finite like we assume

Edited yesterday at 10:08 PM by Terell Kirby

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyHumans have mind cause they have the ability to record reality. Maybe the mind of a doorknob are its knicks and scratches.

[Terell Kirby]

11 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Terell KirbyHumans have mind cause they have the ability to record reality.

How do you know that’s true? Of all the humans you know-have you ever accessed their mind to have a direct experience of them recording reality? How do we know it’s their mind doing it and not yours? How do you know your mind is belongs to a human of some sort, is that actually the case? what if it’s something entirely different?

All good questions to ponder / contemplate 

Edited yesterday at 11:19 PM by Terell Kirby

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyYou have to think of humans as a object and human body parts as objects. Why can this object think? In reality this object has a doorknob inside a skull that has many pathways where electricity can fire and make it think something is happening. These pathways can store replicated recording of reality in them. What is a human mind? Its an object that can record states of reality and talk to itself about it.

Does a doorknob the object have ways of recording reality? Yes it can get scratched and knicked its form can change, it can record reality on its surface but has no way of sustaining the image.It dosent have anything in that shoots electricity  so doesnt think. It dosent constantly move like a human body does. It dosent seem to want to do anything.

If you turned into a doorknob your consciousness wouldnt change as you and the doorknob hold the same consciousness. But the way you are perceiving reality would. Like you would get the qualities of a doorknob.For instance you would lose the ability to hold past an future because it dosent seem like a doorknob has the ability to think. It dosent have any machinery in it that would suggest it can think like a human does.

Everything even living things are objects and dont have anyone in them. There is what makes a human in your doorknob, because consciousness makes a human. What you think you are is in your doorknob sitting there like a retard. You probably were already a doorknob for all of creation and just forgot cause your doorknob would destroy your ego and you would just sit there looking at the world like a retard forever.

Or you could awaken, turn into a doorknob, and then just leave cause you are God. God is that which goes into objects, inside of itself, and that which goes into objects is, empty space, or empty space, is  that which objects go into.

Edited 23 hours ago by Hojo

[Terell Kirby]

43 minutes ago, Hojo said:

God is that which goes into objects,

This is false- God is not found in any object.

God is dreaming up all objects.

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyYea from the back. In objective reality You are inside an object that cant be seen. In subjective you are behind and object that cant be seen. Its the same thing seen from both perspectives. Its dreaming it from the back. You can see it when you close your eyes. Whats behind your eyes is behind your computer monitor and wall. Gods inside every object and behind every object. The you that makes the thing you think you are, is behind your doorknob when you are looking at your doorknob.

Everything in reality is a 2 dimensional cardboard cut out with God behind it.

You find God by looking within your object. And you see the thing within is out there and its one thing.

When you awaken you see deep sleep in front of you while you are awake.

Edited 23 hours ago by Hojo

[Terell Kirby]

23 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Terell Kirby.

Everything in reality is a 2 dimensional cardboard cut out with God behind it.

If you insist. After all, You are God imagining that everything in reality is a 2D cardboard cut out. What matters is becoming conscious of how your mind imagine things

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyIts a scientific fact. Science is measuring the screen inside of the brain not objective reality. Science is measuring subjective experience, specifically human, to come to conclusions of its objectiveness. But the objectiveness cant be known because its being measured by a bunch of subjective experiences inside the brain. The subjective experiences cant even know where the objective experience is coming from.

Edited 22 hours ago by Hojo

[Terell Kirby]

1 minute ago, Hojo said:

@Terell KirbyIts a scientific fact. Science is measuring the screen inside of the brain not objective reality.

God hallucinates all of scientific facts, measurements, the brain and objective reality.

Are you able to catch your own Mind doing all of this? 

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyYes but we must remain scientific. Its like saying princess arabia saying i have an opinion but I dont exist. You can start any framework you want but we cant follow because we arent believing that and leads to contradictions.

If you hold 2 completely contradicting frameworks you cant be logical. What you can do is bend your logic to meet certain requirements while remaining in the framework.

Edited 22 hours ago by Hojo

[Terell Kirby]

2 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Terell KirbyYes but we must remain scientific. Its like saying princess arabia saying i have an opinion but I dont exist. You can start any framework you want but we cant follow because we arent beleiving that.

Im telling @Princess Arabia on you 

[Hojo]

@Terell KirbyI muted her already. Im sorry I shouldnt have used her name I will switch the term to neo adviata drone.

Edited 22 hours ago by Hojo

[Ramasta9]

A simple analogy would be: a door knob is "consciousness" but not "conscious", would it not?