If Liberals Won’t Enforce Borders, Fascists Will

[enchanted]

David Frums NPR interview on "If Liberals Won’t Enforce Borders, Fascists Will" 

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/22/705729699/the-atlantic-if-liberals-wont-enforce-borders-fascists-will

[Leo Gura]

That is correct.

One of the delusions of leftists.

Leftists are even worse than liberals on this point. Liberals at least want some enforcement. Leftist want zero enforcement and they don't see how this is a problem.

Frum is a smart conservative, despite his role in the Bush admin.

Edited Tuesday at 11:34 PM by Leo Gura

[Husseinisdoingfine]

I remember i was listening to Vaush, and he said something along the lines of;

" There are millions of people every year pouring across the border, okay, and? "

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

I remember i was listening to Vaush, and he said something along the lines of;

" There are millions of people every year pouring across the border, okay, and? "

Yes, because leftists do not care about borders. And they think everyone should not care, not realizing that most people care a lot.

This is the self-absorbed narcissism of the left. It makes leftists blind to serious political realities.

Border enforcement is very important if you want to win elections.

Edited Tuesday at 11:39 PM by Leo Gura

[Hardkill]

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, because leftists do not care about borders. And they think everyone should not care, not realizing that most people care a lot.

This is the self-absorbed narcissism of the left. It makes leftists blind to serious political realities.

Border enforcement is very important if you want to win elections.

But you know that no progressive politicians, including Bernie Sanders and the Squad, aren't for open borders.

Even Bernie said before, "Nobody thinks illegal immigration is appropriate."

Even Cenk and Ana believed that Biden should've closed the border much sooner, despite how complicated legally, logistically, and geopolitically it was for him.

Edited yesterday at 12:01 AM by Hardkill

[Apparition of Jack]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, because leftists do not care about borders. And they think everyone should not care, not realizing that most people care a lot.

This is the self-absorbed narcissism of the left. It makes leftists blind to serious political realities.

Border enforcement is very important if you want to win elections.

Apparently elections don’t matter because you can just lead a riot and kill a bunch of people and still get elected President.

[DocWatts]

2 hours ago, Apparition of Jack said:

Apparently elections don’t matter because you can just lead a riot and kill a bunch of people and still get elected President.

Amazing how 7 million Americans had very little difficulty protesting against a fascist regime on No Kings Day without commiting any crimes.

Yet if you put 2500 MAGAs at the steps of the Capitol Building, they can't resist the urge to bludgeon police officers with flag poles, trample people to death, and attempt to murder their political opponents.

"Law and order for thee, not for me".

The intent was always to let white bigots with red hats do whatever the fuck they want with zero consequences, while using a lawless state to persecute minorities.

There are ways to remove people who are here illegally while respecting due process - so let's not pretend that the terror tactics we've seen over the last 9 months are anything more than racism for racism's sake and a ploy to consolidate naked, unaccountable power.

Edited yesterday at 03:27 AM by DocWatts

[Apparition of Jack]

5 hours ago, DocWatts said:

Amazing how 7 million Americans had very little difficulty protesting against a fascist regime on No Kings Day without commiting any crimes.

Yet if you put 2500 MAGAs at the steps of the Capitol Building, they can't resist the urge to bludgeon police officers with flag poles, trample people to death, and attempt to murder their political opponents.

"Law and order for thee, not for me".

The intent was always to let white bigots with red hats do whatever the fuck they want with zero consequences, while using a lawless state to persecute minorities.

There are ways to remove people who are here illegally while respecting due process - so let's not pretend that the terror tactics we've seen over the last 9 months are anything more than racism for racism's sake and a ploy to consolidate naked, unaccountable power.

Republicans have also hamstrung every Democratic effort to pass meaningful immigration reform, most recently being in 2024 for the express purpose of making life worse enough for everybody that they’ll vote Dems out (really, look it up.)

 

At this point I genuinely wonder if this isn’t some weird psychological impulse in Republicans to deliberately make society as chaotic as possible. They will not support aid in other countries to prevent people from migrating in the first place. They will not invest in communities in America to make the shock of immigration more manageable. They will not find border enforcement until it’s 10 years too late. It’s hard not think that these people LIKE having a bunch of “others” in their country that they can blame all their problems for whilst oligarchs loot their country, lmao. 

Edited 19 hours ago by Apparition of Jack

[BlueOak]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Leftists are even worse than liberals on this point. Liberals at least want some enforcement. Leftist want zero enforcement and they don't see how this is a problem.

The left has a spectrum bigger than any other political dynamic. There is every voice on the left, including what you suggest and worse, all the way through to very harsh border enforcement.

By virtue of how far right the world has shifted, there is this space.

[BlueOak]

9 hours ago, enchanted said:

David Frums NPR interview on "If Liberals Won’t Enforce Borders, Fascists Will" 

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/22/705729699/the-atlantic-if-liberals-wont-enforce-borders-fascists-will

****
Correction
****

If capitalists (corporatists) don't enforce borders, white nationalists will.

Why is this important? Because this addresses the two dynamics of the problem.

Race and Profit.

The other dynamics are things such as social cohesion vs quality of life, but these are not given consideration by the political class. Despite all the things you are about or want to tell me. Which I will nod and agree with.

Edited 18 hours ago by BlueOak

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, because leftists do not care about borders. And they think everyone should not care, not realizing that most people care a lot.

This is the self-absorbed narcissism of the left. It makes leftists blind to serious political realities.

Border enforcement is very important if you want to win elections.

Problem is that people are too paranoid and are blowing things out of proportion, so what can lefties really do about it, they have to pick the most opposite side on the immigration spectrum. People do not think in nuance in general, for them it has to be either this way or the other way. Either we build a giant wall on the borders and sent all those who we deem to be illegal immigrants back to where they came from, or we should just let everyone get in freely because world is sunshine and rainbows. And even if there are some people on both sides who do think in nuance, for example conservatives who think Trump is taking it too far, or leftists who are for some border restrictions, your election choices are always just binary. People really are simpletons with knee jerk reactions to everything, and spreading of propaganda, misinformation and wishfull thinking from both sides (of course Trump holds a majority share of all of those) is making this situation even more complicated and making people even more dead set in their views. 

Edited 18 hours ago by NewKidOnTheBlock