Women have wildly different interests than men

[theleelajoker]

Quote

Do you want to keep the image of a certain woman?

Nope.

Quote

Or can you tell me why you are reacting so protective?

Harmful narrative created in your own head IMO. 

Quote

You behave as if it is somehow forbidden to talk about a topic about a large group of humans.

Pointing out the dangers of projection, showing how one can hide behind seemingly meta analysis instead of acting in your direct field of awareness and thus avoiding confrontation.

You say you want just to know if others see things like you, and if they don't, then "they are triggered" or "they are protecting women".  Whatever, live your life 

Edited yesterday at 03:22 PM by theleelajoker

[Puer Aeternus]

Just now, OBEler said:

@Puer Aeternus well this topic is clearly triggering you.

You were right the previous times but I'm as calm as a clam right now. Your misunderstandings were what did it back in the day!

I'm telling ya man, there's just something off with how you go about this topic. You present things very rationally. I'm just looking for truth, we're just having a discussion, etc etc. 

But underneath that? Somethings a lurking. The way I've seen you talk about this previously. The takes. How you can bend evidence to support your opinion. 

What you're saying isn't devoid of truth but does it represent exactly what you think it does? I don't think so. I think there's something there under it all. What it is? I've got no idea, I don't know enough to say. That one's up to you! 

[OBEler]

@theleelajoker everything is a narrative in your head. 

Harmful ? Every generalization can be harmful. 

"Pointing out the dangers of projections" You don't understand projections can also be very useful.

[theleelajoker]

2 minutes ago, OBEler said:

@theleelajoker everything is a narrative in your head. 

Harmful ? Every generalization can be harmful. 

"Pointing out the dangers of projections" You don't understand projections can also be very useful.

Generalization - so why do it when you know it's harmful?

Projection  - how exactly is it useful? When you want to find out the truth, empty your mind of any assumptions.

[OBEler]

30 minutes ago, Puer Aeternus said:

You were right the previous times but I'm as calm as a clam right now. Your misunderstandings were what did it back in the day!

I'm telling ya man, there's just something off with how you go about this topic. You present things very rationally. I'm just looking for truth, we're just having a discussion, etc etc. 

But underneath that? Somethings a lurking. The way I've seen you talk about this previously. The takes. How you can bend evidence to support your opinion. 

What you're saying isn't devoid of truth but does it represent exactly what you think it does? I don't think so. I think there's something there under it all. What it is? I've got no idea, I don't know enough to say. That one's up to you! 

Ok I got you.

Yes there is something going on. Half of mankind are women, you can't ignore them, they are very important. So it's important to understand them. Yet understanding woman is a rare topic - mostly just in a funny way and not seriously.

Right now the cultural narrative is that everyone and everything is equal in their minds. Even if I never buyed into this I got brainwashed with this narrative. So even if I know men and women are very different I still get shocked how different they really are. To such an extreme that I try to figure out if some of that maybe a distortion of my reality. Of course I am aware of my own projections on to them, seeing truly for what they are will hardly be possible.

If I watch and read womens behavior on the Internet I come to some deep realizations about the nature of feminity. Yes Internet is not the real world but still you can see patterns.

I am open to exploring that field. Unfortunately here are mostly men so it's a bit difficult. On the other hands in general women rarely show their true face so they would be instantly triggered and would probably protect their gender.

Edited yesterday at 03:51 PM by OBEler

[Schizophonia]

3 hours ago, theleelajoker said:

@SchizophoniaInteresting take btw.

Thanks

Quote

I get you right, you're saying it's about taking responsibility for your experience vs. seeing yourself as victim?

Well, indeed, victimizing/ruminating tends toward feminization because it involves transferring anxiety onto the symbolic.
Just as a camera can film everything except yourself, the sign that you are in the masculine position is the feeling, the responsibility of femininity.

For example, if you want a girlfriend (because the topic is about women) but you don't have one, you will be proactive, do what it takes to get a girlfriend, or else accept not having one, and therefore you will have to accept the emotional burden (hatred, knots in your stomach, etc.). If you're too feminine, you'll be tempted to ruminate/dwell on it, which may seem strange at first glance because it's painful and counterproductive, but it's a way, as I said above, of displacing anxiety onto the symbolic (a blackpilled website or video is symbolic, it's something tangible, the same goes for a thought of rumination/victimization, it's "something"), because otherwise it would be propelled into the emotional.
It's not even "worse," it's another form of frustration or of experiencing things in general; what's behind it is the fear (Oedipus complex, childhood trauma, etc.) of taking the phallic position.
When you ruminate on something in your head, when you victimize yourself, these phrases are like an imaginary phallus; That is to say, you have castration anxiety that you're going to calm by transferring it to this symbol, by clinging to it.

You'll hear here and there that women might choose an asshole over a nice guy because he's better looking, cooler, has more to offer, etc.
You're doing exactly the same thing! You don't want nice mental self-talk; you're stuck on bad mental self-talk because what interests you is its ability to absorb anxiety.

So if you have a tendency toward victimization, to be mannered, perhaps masochistic fantasies, etc., you want to recondition yourself to identify more with the phallic position.

Now, to get back to OP, that's not really what I'm seeing. Maybe that's how it is, but what emerges in this case is not directly the hypertrophied castration anxiety typical of victimization (see obsessional neurosis) itself, but rather the defense mechanism of identification with the father (and then with substitutes) against castration anxiety.
That is to say, in the Oedipal situation and then in power struggles later in life, one strategy to calm the anxiety is to submit completely to the father (and later to authority in general).
Normally, the libido is always directed towards the mother and then the substitutes, but if identification as a defense mechanism is too strong, it will tend to create misogynistic tendencies; because since you don't have the phallic position, you will blame women for not having it and bless your father for having it (instead of "killing" him).

In the OP's case, it's this strange neurotic misogyny that comes out, like "ah, look, women are women, they prefer to do their hair rather than talk about spirituality, bla bla bla bla"

Without realizing that what he sees as masculine is actually a defense mechanism found mainly in men for Oedipal reasons, but which is actually childish.

The average peasant or rugby player is virile, more so than any man on this forum, and yet by OP's standards, he would actually be feminine.
Emotional rigidity, dwelling on "the truth," and all that nonsense isn't masculine; it's defense mechanisms found more in men and is actually a bit feminizing because it tacitly betrays a fear of being phallic.

Edited yesterday at 03:57 PM by Schizophonia

[Puer Aeternus]

27 minutes ago, OBEler said:

Ok I got you.

Yes there is something going on. Half of mankind are women, you can't ignore them, they are very important. So it's important to understand them. Yet understanding woman is a rare topic - mostly just in a funny way and not seriously.

Right now the cultural narrative is that everyone and everything is equal in their minds. Even if I never buyed into this I got brainwashed with this narrative. So even if I know men and women are very different I still get shocked how different they really are. To such an extreme that I try to figure out if some of that maybe a distortion of my reality. Of course I am aware of my own projections on to them, seeing truly for what they are will hardly be possible.

If I watch and read womens behavior on the Internet I come to some deep realizations about the nature of feminity. I am open to exploring that field. Unfortunately here are mostly men so it's a bit difficult. On the other hands women rarely show their true face so they would be instantly triggered and would probably protect their gender.

Yes it certainly is very important!

Current cultural narrative definitely isn't right, we are not all equal. Beyond even gender too! Easy to assume everyone is like you but it can be some spooky stuff to realize they just aren't.
To such an extreme that I try to figure out if some of that maybe a distortion of my reality. Of course I am aware of my own projections on to them, seeing truly for what they are will hardly be possible.

How do you contend with this? How do you try to stop yourself from getting bogged down in ideas that just aren't real? It can be a tricky thing, I've definitely experienced it myself! Yet, its kind of necessary to an extent isn't it. Trying to grasp for something we can't reach. I much prefer to just leave things open and take it case by case for each individual, with maybe some ideas for reference in the background. 

I am also curious to hear your criticisms of the male gender? If you don't mind going off topic a bit! I have seen the female critiques a lot from you but not the reverse, and I suppose that has biased my view against you. Do you have any? I'm just allergic to the gender wars shit and it can give me a reaction. It can be easy to yap on about the other gender when its really some deep seeded psychological stuff going on underneath.

Edited yesterday at 03:58 PM by Puer Aeternus

[Schizophonia]

I think it fix when you really give up on the idea of finding the phallus in girls, and therefore see them for softer/sensitive/weaker things to cuddle, activities and sex with. 

You know something is integrated when you don't feel the need to symbolize it anymore.

[OBEler]

@Puer Aeternus well I am male and all men are almost the same. There is no mystery really if you know yourself as a man you know other men too. The wiring of the brain is almost same in men.  Even Osama bin Laden had memes and counterstrike on his computer. 

If you want to see somehow a balance so that not only women are portrayed negatively for sure. Men have very dark forces in them. They can be grifters like women in a more effective way. They can lie, steal, destroy, being total delusional, irrational. But yeah it's somehow a bit pointless to talk about because we all know I think how men are because we are men ourselves.

Edited 23 hours ago by OBEler

[Princess Arabia]

6 hours ago, OBEler said:

This thread is about showing the true face of women.

Showing a Meghan Markle interview doesn't quite fit the bill. Like seriously. She's a representation of the true face of women? A woman married into royalty? Then we criticize her when she shows fakeness. Royalty is fakeness by definition already. 

 

7 hours ago, OBEler said:

They are celebrating themselves. They are not really interested in robotics, more like what can robotics do for themselves (getting a job, connect etc). Have a look for yourself.

So.....that's all here...and so. It's not like you're comparing it to a common interest like food, people, environment, etc. It's robotics for Christ's sake, a left-brain interest. That already excludes women automatically.

 

7 hours ago, OBEler said:

Forums are an invention of men. Women don't like these because it's about looking for truth and they don't care about these idealistic things.

Before this forum were videos, mostly male audience, that carried over...has nothing to do with forums in general. Is redditt male dominated, idk, I'm not really on there. Ever thought about women not looking for truth because they innately consider themselves to be truth already and men seek truth more because it's a rough world out there and truth helps with survival. Just a possibility, plus that assumption seems ludicrous. 

 

7 hours ago, OBEler said:

Women are mostly pragmatic and their thoughts are about personal stuff and feelings rather than about abstract things.

Just a little side note, all the men I've encountered all across the board, from any age to all ethnicities and nationalities and i've met and spoke to a lot throughout the years 98% of them all love to talk about themselves. If they asked me something about me and I gave a one or two word answer, it was never a challenge again to turn it right back on them, they'd be happy again to continue to blabber about themselves. All about personal stuff and feelings and whatever else they wanted to talk about concerning their life. Always. Very few cared to drag anything out of me and about my life, and if they did, it wasn't long before the convo turned back on them and their lives again. Most women can attest to this. It's not a judgment just showing how you're mistaken in a lot of what you're assuming.

[Princess Arabia]

2 minutes ago, OBEler said:

well I am male and all men are almost the same. There is no mystery really if you know yourself as a man you know other men too. The wiring of the brain is almost same in men.

This is so far from the truth. In certain gender-related things, yes and biologically, but personality wise, you guys can be very different. Even sexually, such a wide range there. The wiring of the brain is biological, and I agreed there, but in other ways, there are vast differences. 

[OBEler]

@Princess Arabia I just mean gender related and biological.

And yes men love to talk about themselves in front of a woman to attract her mostly. Between men it's not so common. But on the Internet on podcasts I agree there are some men also, who just love to talk about them. It seems that's not so gender dependent.

I choosed Megan because she is kind of an archetype of a typical woman to me. A woman wo thinks she is a princess and somehow entitled etc. That she really is a princess makes her feminine behavior even come more true.

Edited 23 hours ago by OBEler

[Puer Aeternus]

5 minutes ago, OBEler said:

@Puer Aeternus well I am male and all men are almost the same. There is no mystery really if you know yourself as a man you know other men too. The wiring of the brain is almost same in men.  Even Osama bin Laden had memes and counterstrike on his computer. 

If you want to see somehow a balance so that not only women are portrayed negatively for sure. Men have very dark forces in them. They can be grifters like women in a more effective way. They can lie, steal, destroy, being total delusional, irrational. But yeah it's somehow a bit pointless to talk about because we all know I think how men are because we are men ourselves.

That's interesting, 

Because I don't really sense all men are the same.  Sure, there can be plenty of overlap and that's probably what you're look at, ya? And honestly, people in general tend to mimic each other and their personalities for social/cultural reasons too. 

But there's definitely more than just the similarities! With great similarity also comes great variation. On what core things would you say all men are the same though? 
I personally feel like some freak intergender hybrid mix between the two genders, although I just happened to have a rudder. So I definitely don't know. 

[Princess Arabia]

BTW, lots of women are into politics. 

[Xonas Pitfall]

7 hours ago, OBEler said:

This is what a typical woman podcast looks like:

https://youtu.be/OBhchAb3x0s?si=TK--M6Nte_xBG8xx

This is how women talk about tech stuff:

https://womeninrobotics.org/news/

Come on, haha, this is silly! I could also nitpick things like this.

Look, guys! All men talk about is getting women and being insecure. This is what your average male podcast is like:

Compare this to your average female podcast, miles apart:

https://www.youtube.com/@melrobbins/videos

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFGVw1aK9Hb4hOvUjoEhHBIEG-kRTtDMy

Jokes aside, this guy is really helpful if you want to see the dumbness on both gender sides of the "podcast" debate.

https://www.youtube.com/@TheGingerKB/videos

I’m genuinely telling you from the bottom of my heart, go out of your way to see the stupidity on both sides of the spectrum. This bias won’t serve you well. You seem intelligent, so there’s no need to fall into these ideological narratives. Look around, and you’ll see how easily both men and women fall victim to ego, cringeworthy beliefs, and ridiculous statements. But on the other hand, you’ll also find incredibly intelligent perspectives on both sides. 

Pushing these narratives will only discourage smart women from sharing their talents and opinions, which we desperately need. At the same time, it could potentially encourage deluded, ignorant, self-centered men to pick up podcast mics and spread whatever nonsense they have. We need to encourage intelligence, no matter which gender it comes from. Anything that minimizes or represses it is harmful in the long run.

Ideologies like yours do exactly that, whether you're consciously or unconsciously aware of it.

[OBEler]

@Puer Aeternus core: we love games, we love women, we love technology. We have respect for great things. We acknowledge that. We are not insecure, we know that we have power and it's not someone's else guilt - we don't play the victim card. We recognize the weakness women have so we never hit them. We love facts and information, not talking around the bush. We are creators and more active than passive in doing things. Looking for help is more difficult for us. We are curious, we can forgive. We don't like drama.

We love battlefield 6, a woman would only play that game for money or attention.

Again just generalizations. I know there are some special men with a different wired brain.

Edited 23 hours ago by OBEler

[Princess Arabia]

@OBEleri gotta give you this though, women in politics can be a joke. Remember this, hehe. Not a good representation but funny, nonetheless.

[Princess Arabia]

5 minutes ago, OBEler said:

We don't like drama.

No, you create it.😜

[OBEler]

Just now, Princess Arabia said:

No, you create it.😜

Haha yeah, we don't recognize that we create drama and it's just the woman showing us a sign in her way she thinks we understand. It's sad this miscommunication exists.

[theleelajoker]

57 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

Thanks

Well, indeed, victimizing/ruminating tends toward feminization because it involves transferring anxiety onto the symbolic.
Just as a camera can film everything except yourself, the sign that you are in the masculine position is the feeling, the responsibility of femininity.

For example, if you want a girlfriend (because the topic is about women) but you don't have one, you will be proactive, do what it takes to get a girlfriend, or else accept not having one, and therefore you will have to accept the emotional burden (hatred, knots in your stomach, etc.). If you're too feminine, you'll be tempted to ruminate/dwell on it, which may seem strange at first glance because it's painful and counterproductive, but it's a way, as I said above, of displacing anxiety onto the symbolic (a blackpilled website or video is symbolic, it's something tangible, the same goes for a thought of rumination/victimization, it's "something"), because otherwise it would be propelled into the emotional.
It's not even "worse," it's another form of frustration or of experiencing things in general; what's behind it is the fear (Oedipus complex, childhood trauma, etc.) of taking the phallic position.
When you ruminate on something in your head, when you victimize yourself, these phrases are like an imaginary phallus; That is to say, you have castration anxiety that you're going to calm by transferring it to this symbol, by clinging to it.

You'll hear here and there that women might choose an asshole over a nice guy because he's better looking, cooler, has more to offer, etc.
You're doing exactly the same thing! You don't want nice mental self-talk; you're stuck on bad mental self-talk because what interests you is its ability to absorb anxiety.

So if you have a tendency toward victimization, to be mannered, perhaps masochistic fantasies, etc., you want to recondition yourself to identify more with the phallic position.

Now, to get back to OP, that's not really what I'm seeing. Maybe that's how it is, but what emerges in this case is not directly the hypertrophied castration anxiety typical of victimization (see obsessional neurosis) itself, but rather the defense mechanism of identification with the father (and then with substitutes) against castration anxiety.
That is to say, in the Oedipal situation and then in power struggles later in life, one strategy to calm the anxiety is to submit completely to the father (and later to authority in general).
Normally, the libido is always directed towards the mother and then the substitutes, but if identification as a defense mechanism is too strong, it will tend to create misogynistic tendencies; because since you don't have the phallic position, you will blame women for not having it and bless your father for having it (instead of "killing" him).

In the OP's case, it's this strange neurotic misogyny that comes out, like "ah, look, women are women, they prefer to do their hair rather than talk about spirituality, bla bla bla bla"

Without realizing that what he sees as masculine is actually a defense mechanism found mainly in men for Oedipal reasons, but which is actually childish.

The average peasant or rugby player is virile, more so than any man on this forum, and yet by OP's standards, he would actually be feminine.
Emotional rigidity, dwelling on "the truth," and all that nonsense isn't masculine; it's defense mechanisms found more in men and is actually a bit feminizing because it tacitly betrays a fear of being phallic.

OK I am not familiar with these terminologies, and even after some research I am still not sure. Will give it a try with paraphrasing to see if I get it: 

1. You want X --> you take action --> all good, a least you do what you can. 

2. You want X --> Instead of action -->  accepting not doing anything --> you feel your emotions of not having / not going for X as in 1. 

3. You want X --> Instead of action --> rumination, victimization --> you transfer your discomfort to sth outside, sth symbolic --> not feeling your emotions, at least you have something on the outside to give responsibility to

---> you do 3. because when you say it's on the outside, then its beyond your control. 

So far so good. Can you give a short definition of your understanding of "taking phallic position" and "castration anxiety"?  

Edited 23 hours ago by theleelajoker