Charging Problem

[integral]

So I'm building this app I just got a contract to build and I told him it's going to take me between 6 to 8 months to build it.

This was before Claude code was released which was 2 weeks ago. 

With Claude code I tell it to write a feature and it does it in less than 30 minutes.

I easily wrote 3 months worth of code in 2 weeks with ai.

I'm almost done the app...

The problem is I told him I'll be charging ALOT... For 6 months of work.

I'm not sure what to do? Do I lie????

The only thing I can think of is I over deliver and build a very high-end application. This way it actually takes me alot longer to finish it.

Edited June 9 by integral

[integral]

I guess by next year Ill built the entire app in a single day.

Edited June 9 by integral

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Does your client value time over money?

https://youtu.be/jE53O1PzmNU?si=Br9MMrHFDMId5IkI

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Does your client value time over money? If it were me, I would bill the client the same. I would take is as a learning process to reassess my own efficiency for future work. Your value has increased as a contractor

 

Edited June 9 by Natasha Tori Maru

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Shit someone delete that juju - the website went mental and posted a link that told me it failed to embed.

Ghost in the machine 

[Emerald]

You should price for how much value that your customer will get from your work... not for the time you've spent.

I would just specify in the future that your process will involve AI and will be a shorter window of time to get completed, that way there's transparency.

But if the client is getting the same results, but it took you a shorter period of time to create it, there is no issue there. In fact, it's more valuable to get it to them quicker.

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

On 9. 6. 2025 at 6:05 AM, Emerald said:

You should price for how much value that your customer will get from your work... not for the time you've spent.

I would just specify in the future that your process will involve AI and will be a shorter window of time to get completed, that way there's transparency.

But if the client is getting the same results, but it took you a shorter period of time to create it, there is no issue there. In fact, it's more valuable to get it to them quicker.

If someone or something can do the same task faster than you, then that absolutely does decrease the value of one's work, regardless whether it's in the eyes of an employer or contractor. Because in this case, the ammount of skill and effort needed to complete the task is evidently very overrated, making his contribution much less valuable. Him, and all the others exploiting A.I. like this, may be able to get away with this a couple of times or for some unspecified period of time, but eventually the true value of your work will make itself known in your pay, seeing as people are not stupid. I would feel pretty dumb if I was that contractor

[Emerald]

13 hours ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

If someone or something can do the same task faster than you, then that absolutely does decrease the value of one's work, regardless whether it's in the eyes of an employer or contractor. Because in this case, the ammount of skill and effort needed to complete the task is evidently very overrated, making his contribution much less valuable. Him, and all the others exploiting A.I. like this, may be able to get away with this a couple of times or for some unspecified period of time, but eventually the true value of your work will make itself known in your pay, seeing as people are not stupid. I would feel pretty dumb if I was that contractor

But they already paid the OP... and then the AI came out two weeks later.

So, while the existence of AI might eventually drive the general market value down of the service... that was not in effect when the OP struck the deal.

But cheaper widespread market options (like AI) driving the general market price of a service down not-withstanding.... I still stick by the statement that people should charge for the value of the service and not the time spent producing it.

And for most people, quicker is better than slower. So, it's even more valuable.

So, if someone is a skilled painter and they can painting in 10 hours rather than 20 hours and get the same result... it's more valuable for many of those who might be interested in purchasing the painting for the painter to do it quicker.

[integral]

@NewKidOnTheBlockThe main counter is I think you would be shocked of what people pay for

If someone knows they're going to get a high quality product, quickly with good service they're willing to pay a lot.

I've seen people make 100K a month just by selling a color palette + branding with basic website design.

Well I'm building an entire full featured app + branding

Edited Saturday at 11:48 PM by integral

[Jannes]

Your customer could find out about Claude. 

[integral]

lol guys it still takes skill to create all this, I still have to work, a non-engineer can't do this.

Basically what's going to happen is, I'm going to be able to build a much better product than I normally would have, because I could use AI to remove the low level stuff that was taking up 95% of my cognitive time. Now I could free up all that mental energy and focus on quality.

Edited Sunday at 12:00 AM by integral

[Natasha Tori Maru]

2 minutes ago, integral said:

lol guys it still takes skill to create all this, I still have to work, a non-engineer can't do this.

Basically what's going to happen is, I'm going to be able to build a much better product than I normally would have, because I could use AI to remove the low level stuff that was taking up 95% of my cognitive time. Now I could free up all that mental energy and focus on quality.

Exactly - you are automating the processes that don't require executive decisions and creative direction. It's how AI should be used. 

Take it as learning, asses and change your productivity timelines. Get more done, make more $$$. 

It now leaves your life open to: persue other accomplishments you are interested in. Or invest the additional time into more work. 

There's no deception to me, just an adaption.

[Joshe]

It is unethical. You told the guy your level of effort would be 100 but it turned out to be 5, and you used your LOE as justification for the price. So yeah, that's unethical. You probably wouldn't have a problem being open to a friend of family member about this, and you wouldn't charge them nearly the full amount, right? 

That said, it's the survival game we're operating in.

I'd justify it like this: You've got just as much right to survive as everyone else. Capitalism is the system we must operate in, and in this system, we have to find exploits, like finding better sources for goods or developing more efficient processes. As long as you deliver the agreed product or service, the means by which you produce are irrelevant, even if you priced the product based on your means of production. Maybe next time, figure out how to omit LOE altogether in the price. Not sure how though. Seems tricky if you have integrity. 

[LordFall]

I would never lie about my business. I would quote him the same price and if he refuses negotiate it down but do not compromise your integrity for short term gain, it's never worth it and will hurt your expertise in the long run. Then become an ever more deadly code builder and charge more to the next clients for fixing deeper and deeper problems. 

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

On 15. 6. 2025 at 0:58 AM, Emerald said:

But they already paid the OP... and then the AI came out two weeks later.

So, while the existence of AI might eventually drive the general market value down of the service... that was not in effect when the OP struck the deal.

But cheaper widespread market options (like AI) driving the general market price of a service down not-withstanding.... I still stick by the statement that people should charge for the value of the service and not the time spent producing it.

And for most people, quicker is better than slower. So, it's even more valuable.

So, if someone is a skilled painter and they can painting in 10 hours rather than 20 hours and get the same result... it's more valuable for many of those who might be interested in purchasing the painting for the painter to do it quicker.

Fair enough. That's another way to look at it, and value is subjective to a huge degree. It also really depends on what we're talking about. Just sayin tho, for the kind of procesess which can be more streamlined and they mostly serve purely utilitarian purpose, I would say what I claimed mostly applies. Whereas, what you said could be applied to more creative purposes, where subjective value reigns supreme. Although, not sure how much true it is that making something quicker (in creative pursuits) = that thing or service becomes more valuable. Depends on other factors as well such as perceived scarcity of that thing, etc. But good points

On 15. 6. 2025 at 1:47 AM, integral said:

@NewKidOnTheBlockThe main counter is I think you would be shocked of what people pay for

If someone knows they're going to get a high quality product, quickly with good service they're willing to pay a lot.

I've seen people make 100K a month just by selling a color palette + branding with basic website design.

Well I'm building an entire full featured app + branding

Good for you man, making tools work for you. Makes sense