Israel / Palestine News Thread

[Breakingthewall]

51 minutes ago, zazen said:

Asking you to examine why October 7th happened, its root cause and the conditions that would lead to it - isn’t justifying it.

Implies that the cause is in the people who was murdered more than in the murderers, it's similar than justifying 

51 minutes ago, zazen said:

The 70% support could be for breaking the siege and the act of resistance itself - not the horrific crimes that were done on the day. For Gazans that was a crack made in a prison wall - that doesn’t mean they supported the brutality of what happened when Hamas went across the wall.

Have you seen the videos? In one, they transport a 20-year-old German girl with her leg bones completely broken, bent 180 degrees, who later died. In her wake, there's a hysterical crowd screaming, raising their hands to the sky, weeping in ecstasy, and many furiously hitting her with sticks. Think about it seriously. What's the reason for such joy? Are they going to achieve something with this action, and that's why they're happy? No, it's pure hatred. It's a satanic ecstasy of pure, absolutely irrational hatred that they've cultivated for generations.

51 minutes ago, zazen said:

Before October 7th - a 2023 Pew survey found nearly half of Jewish Israelis believed Arabs should be expelled or transferred from Israel. Does that justify their punishment? Obviously not.

Well, Knowing that for their Palestinian neighbors, the highest level of humanity is to be a martyr by killing Jews, more than being a doctor, engineer, father, or mother. And that killing a Jew is a direct ticket to eternal paradise, the fact that only 50% of them think about it speaks volumes for the Jews.

51 minutes ago, zazen said:

Whether they’re making Gaza un-livable through starvation or destroying buildings is beside the main point - which is that they are making it un-livable to begin with. You call it destroying Hamas but it’s collective punishment in practice

Well, it's different attacking the bodies than the objects, and the point was knowing if Israel used starving as a weapon. I think they didn't, but maybe they did in some extent, some days, like an warning: What's certain is that photos of skeletal men like those in Auschwitz, when thousands of videos show everyone looking normal, are demagoguery.

51 minutes ago, zazen said:

you rob me then I target you with a nuke - aren’t I in effect collectively punishing everyone around you because of the method and tool I use to “target” you? It’s like trying to blow out a candle with a flamethrower and burning the whole house down - “but I targeted the candle bro my bad”.

Hamas It's an army with a vast network of tunnels. How are you going to fight them? By sending your soldiers to be slaughtered?

Edited Saturday at 08:16 PM by Breakingthewall

[Raze]

9 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I didn't insult you by sending those links. I said that 5 photos of hungry people against 1000 hours of videos of healthy people aren't valid as proof to me.

 

I’m not talking about that, you insulted me and used sarcastic remarks and even AI walls long before I did anything, and kept doing it after I told you to stop. Now you play the victim.

9 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I

And regarding the reports from organizations that talk about arm circumference, etc., I said that in a situation like Gaza, food distribution isn't the same as in peacetime. It's also carried out by Hamas. Therefore, it's to be expected that there will be people who aren't perfectly fed. But that's absolutely different from using starvation as a weapon of war. All the food that comes in goes to Israel, the genocidal enemy. And seeing the people after two years, I see that there's no use of hunger as a weapon.

This statement provokes insults from you and very long insulting AI messages that, for you, validate your perspective (strange). So, since I don't like being insulted, I would like to know what to say so as not to provoke your righteous anger thirsty of justice that makes you insult so much. 

No, the food distribution isn’t carried out by Hamas, as per usual you do not know basic things about what you’re talking about.

Youve been discussing this for months now, are you incapable of using basic logic? Do you actually think israel is giving large sacks of food to Hamas and they shake hands and Hamas goes around distributing it? 

It was distributed by the UN, later israel banned them and brought in an American company GHF to do it.

It you are not aware of these basic facts on the ground but still share your opinion over and over arrogantly as though you’re right it’s not my fault the AI calls you a dense idiot.

No, the food doesn’t come from israel, they let the aid organizations in.

Israel purposefully limited food and blocked all aid for 3 months. The finance minister literals stated the purpose was to use it as a war strategy, the former general whose plan they used to limit food said it was a war tactic. 

As you were told multiple times, some people looking healthy is irrelevant, no one said everyone; was dying of starvation. I pointed out how even during worse historical famines most people actually didn’t die of starvation either. 

The AI told you this at least six times, but because you still didn’t get it, the AI started calling you stupid. Because you are, there’s no other word to describe someone so proud of their ignorance who cannot process as a basic concept repeated to them over and over.

I didn’t ask AI to insult you, I asked it to review your claims with forceful language, it correctly called you out for complete ignorance and defensiveness, the terms used are insulting because they are negative, but they’re accurate in this case. 

Edited Saturday at 08:43 PM by Raze

[Breakingthewall]

24 minutes ago, Raze said:

.

No, the food distribution isn’t carried out by Hamas, as per usual you do not know basic things about what you’re talking about.

No, the food doesn’t come from israel, they let the aid organizations in.

Approximate distribution (2024–2025)

Source of food entering Gaza    Approx. share

Israel (production + distribution)    ≈ 60–75 %
Egypt (via Rafah)    ≈ 20–30 %
Other donors (Turkey, Qatar, Jordan via Egypt)    ≈ 5–10 %
 

About the distribution, who has the power In gaza? Food enter in trucks, who decides where those supplies goes, who stores them? Who controls the streets? 

24 minutes ago, Raze said:

The AI told you this at least six times, but because you still didn’t get it, the AI started calling you stupid

Why are you insulting again? I thought that was enough insulting. Do you feel like threatening or anything? Do you need a hug? Don't insult people.

24 minutes ago, Raze said:

it correctly called you out for complete ignorance

Shit, another insult. I'm so ignorant. Then why you need to insulting again and again? Do you insult all the ignorants? Before you said that im an ignorant because the food is not Israeli. But who could supplies the food for 2 million people during 2 years? Some organizations? It's a serious amount, not some aid. Maybe you should try to think by logic , not by emotions. 

About the starvation, then no people looks starved except those 5 pictures of men and kids almost skeletons that you sent as a proof, but people in general looks normal, and this is compatible with general starvation. Well, sounds bit forced, but if you feel better believing it, that's ok. 

Edited Saturday at 09:04 PM by Breakingthewall

[Raze]

18 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Approximate distribution (2024–2025)

Source of food entering Gaza    Approx. share

Israel (production + distribution)    ≈ 60–75 %
Egypt (via Rafah)    ≈ 20–30 %
Other donors (Turkey, Qatar, Jordan via Egypt)    ≈ 5–10 %
 

About the distribution, who has the power In gaza? Food enter in trucks, who decides where those supplies goes, who stores them? 

Serious question: do you have dyslexia? Or some other issue that makes it difficult for you to read? This is I believe the third time I’ve seen you quote something to prove your point that actually disproves it.

The very thing you yourself quoted says Israel does the distribution. I’m assuming it’s counting the GHF as israel since it was distributing during that period which is what I said. And thats because israel at that time was blocking the humanitarian organizations. They were spending tens of millions in aid.

 Yet you ignored that and doubled down on Hamas distributing it.

Actually it looks like that’s origin of entrance, not the source of actual aid. That’s why it says Egypt via Rafah. The UN and Europe have spent the most on aid. 

 

Edited Saturday at 09:12 PM by Raze

[zazen]

@Breakingthewall Your username is literally Breakingthewall. Maybe you’d have a euphoric outburst from breakingthewall on October 7th too - from breaking the siege of your oppressors. Obviously if the euphoria is from the suffering you cause those on the other side of the wall your a sick sadist though. It’s so obvious it’s dumb for me to even have to mention that nuance but you seem to conflate and misread things entirely.

Your now saying that maybe they did use starvation as a weapon but only sometimes.

Your saying its different and okay that their attacking objects (buildings) instead of bodies (civilian) - but attacking the buildings still makes the place un-livable in which those bodies (civilians) live. You just evade and sometimes concede begrudgingly lol

If Hamas are in the tunnels underground then what’s the point of destroying everything above ground including the civilians ability to live there. It only ensures more recruits for Hamas, and more hatred and condemnation from the world.

Edited Saturday at 09:13 PM by zazen

[Breakingthewall]

14 minutes ago, Raze said:

The very thing you yourself quoted says Israel does the distribution. I’m assuming it’s counting the GHF as israel since it was distributing during that period which is what I said.

 Yet you ignored that and doubled down on Hamas distributing it.

I know it's a complicated idea, I will try to speak easy. Look, in gaza there is a war, then, when it's said that Israel does the distribution means that they deliver the food to the door of Gaza , but they can't do the distribution inside the city. Why? Because if Jews get in, Hamas would kill them! Then, who distributes the food inside the city to the 2 millions of persons one by one? Some volunteers? And what are going to do those volunteers? Who decides inside gaza about everything? Hamas! Bingo!!! If you are inside gaza and Hamas tells you to put the food there, you do. Again, logic is the key.

Edited Saturday at 09:19 PM by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

3 minutes ago, zazen said:

Hamas are in the tunnels underground then what’s the point of destroying everything above ground including the civilians ability to live there. It only ensures more recruits for Hamas, and more hatred and condemnation from the world.

I guess that the only way to prevent Hamas from hiding is to eliminate the hiding places. They can't always be in the tunnels.

4 minutes ago, zazen said:

username is literally Breakingthewall. Maybe you’d have a euphoric outburst from breakingthewall on October 7th too - from breaking the siege of your oppressors.

Well, it's different braking walls than breaking lifes and being euphoric knowing that the consequences that are coming are death for your people. Why you can't admit that this is absolutely insane, like a mental illness? You could be happy if you kill your bully and now you are free, but being happy by killing some innocents knowing that the revenge is going to fall in your family is simple being insane 

[Raze]

17 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

I know it's a complicated idea, I will try to speak easy. Look, in gaza there is a war, then, when it's said that Israel does the distribution means that they deliver the food to the door of Gaza , but they can't do the distribution inside the city. Why? Because if Jews get in, Hamas would kill them! Then, who distributes the food inside the city to the 2 millions of persons one by one? Some volunteers? And what are going to do those volunteers? Who decides inside gaza about everything? Hamas! Bingo!!! If you are inside gaza and Hamas tells you to put the food there, you do. Again, logic is the key.

So like I said, as per usual you don’t understand basic things about what you’re talking about.

Thats not what distribution means, distribution is what is done inside Gaza, not just letting it into the access point.

You’re very strange, when most people get shown they have basic facts wrong they become either ashamed or humble and maybe look into the issue deeper before talking. Even if they get defensive or won’t admit it they will at least shift the topic or privately begin looking more into what they’re saying to avoid it in the future. You don’t, you just double down and somehow become more confident, you actually become more ignorant the more you discuss the topic and even more confident in your beliefs the more you are proven wrong. as thought you think acting like a stubborn child who denies reality right in front of them over and over will change it, then when people get frustrated with you that’s proof you’re somehow “winning”. It’s an extremely bizarre psychology. 

And no, Israeli officials themselves admitted there was no evidence of Hamas systematically stealing aid.

It’s distributed by handing it out to civilians at aid sites.

you can see examples in this: 

 

Hamas has no capability to steal aid en masse, they numbered 20-40K and were being hunted, they can’t somehow stop aid from getting to 2 million people.

The starvation only began after israel began limiting aid and then blocked all aid from entering for 3 months. Guess what happened when they stopped, the starvation reduced. That had nothing to do with Hamas.

Edited Saturday at 09:31 PM by Raze

[zazen]

14 minutes ago, zazen said:

Obviously if the euphoria is from the suffering you cause those on the other side of the wall your a sick sadist though. It’s so obvious it’s dumb for me to even have to mention that nuance but you seem to conflate and misread things entirely.

@Breakingthewall I literally said if the euphoria is coming from the killing itself then it is insane and sick.

Anyway - is this how AIPAC Zionists approached you:

If you’re getting a yatch I want an invite next year for 2026 season. Let’s go Ibiza and Formentera papi.

[Breakingthewall]

9 hours ago, Raze said:

You’re very strange, when most people get shown they have basic facts wrong they become either ashamed or humble and maybe look into the issue deeper before talking

You insulted me before because I said that Israel provides the food, then I gave the information that Israel provides 75% of the food, and you insulted me again.

 

9 hours ago, Raze said:

So like I said, as per usual you don’t understand basic things about what you’re talking about.

Thats not what distribution means, distribution is what is done inside Gaza

Then you said before, just after insulting, that in the IA text that I posted says that the 75% of supply and distribution of food comes from Israel, then I explained you that inside of Gaza Israel doesn't go, because I side gaza is Hamas who controls , so the food goes where Hamas says. It's quite simple, read again, you will see that you can get it

9 hours ago, Raze said:

Even if they get defensive or won’t admit it they will at least shift the topic or privately begin looking more into what they’re saying to avoid it in the future. You don’t, you just double down and somehow become more confident, you actually become more ignorant the more you discuss the topic and even more confident in your beliefs the more you are proven wrong

Maybe you are talking about yourself. Here we are talking about where the aid comes from and who distributes. You insulted me because I said that Israel supply, then I show you than I was right, and now you really believe that it's you who said it. Anyone who reads this can see it.

9 hours ago, Raze said:

you think acting like a stubborn child

You think that by insulting you will become more right, but it doesn't work like that, believe me. Over all when you insulted before for an statement I said, and then showed you it was true

9 hours ago, Raze said:

And no, Israeli officials themselves admitted there was no evidence of Hamas systematically stealing aid.

I didn't say Hamas stole the aid, as many Palestinians have confirmed, but it decides where it's stored, who it's given to, and when. There also seems to be a black market where everything is sold for very high prices. Where does that money go?

9 hours ago, Raze said:

Hamas has no capability to steal aid en masse, they numbered 20-40K and were being hunted, they can’t somehow stop aid from getting to 2 million people.

Some aid is taken directly by people but there are 2 millions of people in gaza, food must delivered inside by the Gazans and Gazans are ruled by Hamas. There are plenty of testimonies from Gazans saying that Hamas keeps food, distributes it as it wishes and sells it. Hamas maybe are just 35k but they have the power and weapons. it's like saying that in a city there are just 30k of cops then they can't decide what the people does, they do in great extent. 2 millions ÷35.000 is like 50, not so much people to handle

Try to discuss without insulting and distorting what is said . It is tiring

Edited Sunday at 06:46 AM by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

11 hours ago, zazen said:

literally said if the euphoria is coming from the killing itself then it is insane and sick.

The euphoria seems by honor and revenge. It seems their psychology revolves around victimhood, remembering abuses, and hatred of the enemy. They don't seem to give much thought to their children's future and such things, since any future is small compared to paradise, which will open if they manage to kill the hated Jews who desecrated sacred places.

Do you imagine that your neighbors have those feelings towards you? Maybe it's your fault because nakbas and that, but what a scary situation 

 

11 hours ago, zazen said:

you’re getting a yatch I want an invite next year for 2026 season. Let’s go Ibiza and Formentera papi.

😂 Formentera is great, Ibiza is very expensive party. Btw papi is south American, and only women say to men papi, like papi, you are so a man, I'm trembling . Spanish used to say tío (uncle), and nowadays "bro". Globalization.

Edited Sunday at 08:50 AM by Breakingthewall

[Raze]

21 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

You insulted me before because I said that Israel provides the food, then I gave the information that Israel provides 75% of the food, and you insulted me again.

 

Then you said before, just after insulting, that in the IA text that I posted says that the 75% of supply and distribution of food comes from Israel, then I explained you that inside of Gaza Israel doesn't go, because I side gaza is Hamas who controls , so the food goes where Hamas says. It's quite simple, read again, you will see that you can get it

Maybe you are talking about yourself. Here we are talking about where the aid comes from and who distributes. You insulted me because I said that Israel supply, then I show you than I was right, and now you really believe that it's you who said it. Anyone who reads this can see it.

You think that by insulting you will become more right, but it doesn't work like that, believe me. Over all when you insulted before for an statement I said, and then showed you it was true

I didn't say Hamas stole the aid, as many Palestinians have confirmed, but it decides where it's stored, who it's given to, and when. There also seems to be a black market where everything is sold for very high prices. Where does that money go?

Some aid is taken directly by people but there are 2 millions of people in gaza, food must delivered inside by the Gazans and Gazans are ruled by Hamas. There are plenty of testimonies from Gazans saying that Hamas keeps food, distributes it as it wishes and sells it. Hamas maybe are just 35k but they have the power and weapons. it's like saying that in a city there are just 30k of cops then they can't decide what the people does, they do in great extent. 2 millions ÷35.000 is like 50, not so much people to handle

Try to discuss without insulting and distorting what is said . It is tiring

There wasn’t a single insult in that reply, if that counts as an insult you have 0 authority to complain about it because you’ve said similar things to me multiple times long before I was this caustic towards you. 
 

The claim “Israel provides 75 % of food to Gaza” is not well-substantiated
I did not find credible, up-to-date, independently verified data that Israel itself (as a government actor) provides 75 % of the food used in Gaza, or that “75% of supply and distribution comes from Israel.” That figure seems more like a rhetorical exaggeration or a misinterpretation of how many trucks cross, or how much of aid is enabled via Israel-controlled crossings. The distinction between “Israel allows trucks in” and “Israel directly supplies food” is crucial, and the quoted person is conflating them.

Assuming that “food must be delivered inside by Gazans, and Gazans are ruled by Hamas” implies full control
This is a sweeping generalization. Even though Hamas is the dominant political authority, Gaza is not a uniform bloc. There are internal factions, municipal authorities, NGOs, activists, and civilians who may resist or circumvent control. The fact that Hamas is armed and holds power does not mean it has perfect control over every distribution point or individual’s access to food. Also, in many conflicts, control of aid does not strictly map to control of territory in such a simplified way.

Putting full responsibility for hunger on Hamas ignores many structural and external factors
Hunger and famine are rarely the result of misdistribution alone. They typically involve lack of supply, obstruction of aid, damage to infrastructure, restrictions on agriculture, displacement, military destruction of food storage and farms, and restrictions on movement. By attributing hunger to “Hamas’ fault,” the person is ignoring the role of Israeli military operations, the blockade, constraints on crossings, restrictions on humanitarian access, and the destruction of Gaza’s food systems.

Logical inconsistency and rhetorical aggression weaken credibility
The speaker repeatedly accuses the interlocutor of insulting or failing to understand, using a tone that blends insult and accusation. That suggests rhetorical defensiveness. Also, they shift between different claims (e.g. “I didn’t say Hamas stole aid” vs. “there are black markets”), which makes it harder to pin down their thesis. The attempt to present arithmetic (2 million ÷ 35,000 = ~50) as a refutation is simplistic: even if control is exerted by a small elite, it does not guarantee perfect enforcement of every distribution outcome.

Appeal to witnesses/anecdotes are weak as evidence
They mention “testimonies from Gazans” about Hamas hoarding or selectively distributing food. While those testimonies may exist, in conflict reporting such accounts must be critically evaluated, cross-checked, and compared to broader data. Anecdotes alone are insufficient to prove systemic causation.

 

Edited yesterday at 02:58 AM by Raze

[Breakingthewall]

10 hours ago, Raze said:

Anecdotes alone are insufficient to prove systemic causation.

 

Of course, only the logic rules. 

There are three versions: one says that Israel is using starvation as a weapon of genocidal war; another that Israel provides enough food but Hamas distributes it unfairly; and the third, that Israel limits the intake of food to keep the Palestinians anxious, or aware of the fact that Israel could, if it wanted, starve them.

Logically, I would say that reality is somewhere in between the second and third. There is no starvation, there is scarcity. It is a war, and Israel uses every psychological tactic it can to achieve its ends. Israel cannot starve Gazans Genghis Khan-style because the world is watching.

For example, this video shows the hard situation that have to face an aged Palestinian man to live day by day. It's extremely challenging living in the situation, but same time, the video shows a healthy man. Then, the logic tells that the starvation is not the case. You can't, in any case, believe any report of any part, because both sides lies completely. The only possibility to make a map is observation and detached logic 

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQRckK5lFab/?igsh=Z252dzVkM2R3ajdh

[Twentyfirst]

@Breakingthewall You guys have just built up so much fear and demonization towards Palestinians. You think that you are the one under threat meanwhile they just have sticks n stones and they just want some land back and basic rights. Somehow you convinced yourself that there entire religion is based on "us important Jews" and that "if we close our eyes for even second the Arabs will make us dead" 

Don't you know that you are the powerful oppressors who are hunting them and threatening them? Crazy how you can't see it. You should just take a pause and really consider this because you are either a shill or worse 

[Breakingthewall]

2 hours ago, Twentyfirst said:

You think that you are the one under threat meanwhile they just have sticks n stones and they just want some land back and basic rights

I'd say that their objective is more de dissapearance of Israel. Look:

 

🕰️ 1. UN Partition Plan (1947)

Proposal: Two states — one Jewish, one Arab — with Jerusalem under international administration.

Accepted by: Jewish leadership.

Rejected by: Palestinian Arab leaders and all surrounding Arab states.

Reason: They refused to recognize any Jewish state on what they considered Arab land.

Result: Immediate invasion by Arab armies after Israel’s declaration of independence (1948).

🕰️ 2. Post-1948 negotiations

Context: After the Arab defeat, Israel offered limited territorial compromises and partial refugee return.

Rejected by: Arab governments and Palestinian representatives, who demanded Israel’s elimination and full refugee return.

🕰️ 3. “Land for Peace” offers (1967)

After Israel’s victory in the Six-Day War, it signaled willingness to return land for peace.

Arab League response (Khartoum Resolution, 1967):

“No peace with Israel, no recognition, no negotiations.”

Result: Total diplomatic rejection.

🕰️ 4. Camp David Summit (2000)

Offer by: Israeli PM Ehud Barak, brokered by U.S. President Bill Clinton.

Terms: Palestinian state in all of Gaza and ~94–96% of the West Bank, with shared control of Jerusalem.

Rejected by: Yasser Arafat.

Reason: Disagreements over Jerusalem’s sovereignty and the right of return for refugees.

🕰️ 5. Taba Negotiations (2001)

Final attempt under the same framework — offered up to 97% of the West Bank and land swaps.

Talks collapsed amid the outbreak of the Second Intifada.

No agreement reached.

🕰️ 6. Olmert Proposal (2008)

Offer by: Israeli PM Ehud Olmert to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.

Terms: State in Gaza and almost all of the West Bank, 1:1 land swaps, capital in East Jerusalem.

Outcome: Abbas never formally replied, citing political weakness and distrust.

⚖️ Summary

Since 1947, Palestinian leadership has rejected or failed to act on at least six major peace plans
that could have established a sovereign Palestinian state.
Reasons included religious ideology, national pride, refugee disputes, and deep mistrust —
especially the unwillingness to formally recognize Israel as a legitimate Jewish state.

 

[Raze]

8 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Of course, only the logic rules. 

There are three versions: one says that Israel is using starvation as a weapon of genocidal war; another that Israel provides enough food but Hamas distributes it unfairly; and the third, that Israel limits the intake of food to keep the Palestinians anxious, or aware of the fact that Israel could, if it wanted, starve them.

Logically, I would say that reality is somewhere in between the second and third. There is no starvation, there is scarcity. It is a war, and Israel uses every psychological tactic it can to achieve its ends. Israel cannot starve Gazans Genghis Khan-style because the world is watching.

For example, this video shows the hard situation that have to face an aged Palestinian man to live day by day. It's extremely challenging living in the situation, but same time, the video shows a healthy man. Then, the logic tells that the starvation is not the case. You can't, in any case, believe any report of any part, because both sides lies completely. The only possibility to make a map is observation and detached logic 

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQRckK5lFab/?igsh=Z252dzVkM2R3ajdh

The speaker outlines three “versions” — Israel using starvation as a weapon, Hamas mismanaging aid, and Israel restricting supplies for psychological pressure — then claims the truth lies “between” the second and third. This assumes all narratives are equally valid and that truth lies in the middle, a false balance fallacy. Humanitarian crises aren’t understood by averaging claims but through verifiable evidence — UN data, aid agencies, and independent monitors 

There is significant credible evidence that the situation in the Gaza Strip is not simply one of scarcity but of **starvation that has been intensified – and in some respects caused – by actions of the State of Israel (Israel). For example:

The World Health Organization (WHO) described Gaza as “suffering man-made mass starvation” caused by the Israeli-led blockade that prevents sufficient food, water and medicine from entering. The Guardian+2Foreign Affairs+2

Multiple senior Israeli officials have publicly declared that blocking humanitarian aid is a deliberate policy pressure tool. For instance, Israel Katz, then-Defence Minister, said “no humanitarian aid will enter Gaza… blocking this aid is one of the main pressure levers preventing Hamas from using it as a tool with the population.” United Nations+1

Aid-agencies and human rights groups report that thousands of trucks worth of food aid remain stuck, access is heavily limited, and key crossings have been shut or bottlenecked. For example, Oxfam states Israel is “deliberately hindering” aid and that “virtually all households across Gaza are starving” in parts of the enclave. Al Jazeera+1

On a ground-level basis, interviews and reports show dramatic change in diet among Palestinians in Gaza: one family interviewed had a Friday meal of four cans of peas and carrots, shared among 11 people including six children, reflecting a collapse of meaningful nutrition. The food-security monitoring body IPC (Integrated Food Security Phase Classification) already flagged large parts of Gaza at Phase 5 (catastrophe/famine) level.

Citing a single video of “a healthy man” as proof against starvation is also flawed. Individual cases can’t represent population-wide conditions, especially in conflict zones where suffering is uneven and videos are selectively shared. This anecdotal fallacy substitutes personal observation for data. The claim that “both sides lie completely” further weakens credibility, reflecting cynicism, not critical thinking. True critical inquiry weighs sources for reliability and transparency; rejecting all information leaves no factual basis, making “detached logic” detached from reality.

Their view rests on flawed logic, selective observation, and misunderstanding of humanitarian evidence. In short, the speaker projects the appearance of critical thinking without its substance.

3 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I'd say that their objective is more de dissapearance of Israel. Look:

 

🕰️ 1. UN Partition Plan (1947)

Proposal: Two states — one Jewish, one Arab — with Jerusalem under international administration.

Accepted by: Jewish leadership.

Rejected by: Palestinian Arab leaders and all surrounding Arab states.

Reason: They refused to recognize any Jewish state on what they considered Arab land.

Result: Immediate invasion by Arab armies after Israel’s declaration of independence (1948).

🕰️ 2. Post-1948 negotiations

Context: After the Arab defeat, Israel offered limited territorial compromises and partial refugee return.

Rejected by: Arab governments and Palestinian representatives, who demanded Israel’s elimination and full refugee return.

🕰️ 3. “Land for Peace” offers (1967)

After Israel’s victory in the Six-Day War, it signaled willingness to return land for peace.

Arab League response (Khartoum Resolution, 1967):

“No peace with Israel, no recognition, no negotiations.”

Result: Total diplomatic rejection.

🕰️ 4. Camp David Summit (2000)

Offer by: Israeli PM Ehud Barak, brokered by U.S. President Bill Clinton.

Terms: Palestinian state in all of Gaza and ~94–96% of the West Bank, with shared control of Jerusalem.

Rejected by: Yasser Arafat.

Reason: Disagreements over Jerusalem’s sovereignty and the right of return for refugees.

🕰️ 5. Taba Negotiations (2001)

Final attempt under the same framework — offered up to 97% of the West Bank and land swaps.

Talks collapsed amid the outbreak of the Second Intifada.

No agreement reached.

🕰️ 6. Olmert Proposal (2008)

Offer by: Israeli PM Ehud Olmert to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.

Terms: State in Gaza and almost all of the West Bank, 1:1 land swaps, capital in East Jerusalem.

Outcome: Abbas never formally replied, citing political weakness and distrust.

⚖️ Summary

Since 1947, Palestinian leadership has rejected or failed to act on at least six major peace plans
that could have established a sovereign Palestinian state.
Reasons included religious ideology, national pride, refugee disputes, and deep mistrust —
especially the unwillingness to formally recognize Israel as a legitimate Jewish state.

 

The argument is a selective, one-sided narrative that reduces a complex history to a moral dichotomy — “Palestinians want destruction, Israel wants survival.” While the timeline includes factual milestones, it omits crucial context and misrepresents motives on both sides. The 1947 UN Partition Plan was indeed accepted by Jewish leaders and rejected by Arab ones, but the rejection stemmed from seeing the plan as unjust: Arabs made up two-thirds of the population and viewed partition as granting most of the land to a newly arrived minority owning less than 10%. The 1948 war was not a unified campaign of extermination but a regional conflict with complex causes, and Israel also expelled or barred hundreds of thousands of Palestinians — a key source of enduring mistrust.

The portrayal of later peace offers (2000, 2001, 2008) as generous yet irrationally rejected distorts reality. Each contained major flaws: continued Israeli control of borders, airspace, and settlements that fragmented Palestinian territory, and unresolved issues like refugees and East Jerusalem. Even U.S. and Israeli negotiators later admitted these offers were incomplete. The 2008 Olmert plan was never formalized and came as Olmert was leaving office under indictment.

The claim that the “Palestinian objective is the disappearance of Israel” ignores decades of evidence showing repeated Palestinian acceptance of coexistence through a two-state solution. The Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO)officially recognized Israel’s right to exist within the 1967 borders in its 1988 Declaration of Independence, effectively conceding 78% of historic Palestine and limiting its claim to the remaining territories of the West Bank, Gaza, and East Jerusalem. Since then, Palestinian leaders have repeatedly affirmed support for a two-state framework — from the 1993 Oslo Accords, which created mutual recognition between Israel and the PLO, to later initiatives like the Arab Peace Initiative of 2002, which offered Israel full normalization in exchange for withdrawal from occupied territories. Even groups often branded as rejectionist, such as Hamas, have in recent years issued statements supporting a long-term truce or state along 1967 borders if Israel reciprocates. Consistent polling by organizations such as the Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research shows that, despite deep frustration and disillusionment, large portions of the Palestinian public continue to support either a two-state arrangement or a single democratic state with equal rights for Jews and Arabs.

By contrast, Israel has repeatedly acted to undermine Palestinian self-determination. It continues to expand settlements in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem — a direct violation of international law — making a contiguous Palestinian state increasingly unviable. Successive Israeli governments have rejected or delayed negotiations over core issues like borders, refugees, and Jerusalem, while entrenching military control and permitting settler violence. Leaders such as Benjamin Netanyahu have explicitly opposed the creation of a Palestinian state, calling it a security threat. Israel has also rejected alternatives such as a single, binational state with equal citizenship, preferring to maintain permanent dominance under occupation. Taken together, these actions and statements show that it is not Palestinians who uniformly seek Israel’s disappearance, but rather that Israeli policy has consistently denied Palestinians any form of genuine sovereignty or equality — whether through two states or one shared democracy.

If someone claims to have “studied all perspectives” yet presents this binary view, it shows surface-level knowledge and confirmation bias — accepting facts that fit a preconceived moral narrative while ignoring others. Though articulate, such reasoning lacks depth and balance. Their view is ideologically filtered, not scholarly, and should not be treated as a reliable or well-informed analysis of the conflict.

Edited 19 hours ago by Raze

[zazen]

Praying to maintain humanity amongst inhumanity, around everything broken to connect to the unbreakable. In prostration - at the lowest point when the head touches the floor, they speak of the most high.

It’s sexier and cooler when Aubrey Marcus types congregate for their shamanic journeys though. But Muslims incorporating a daily dose of remembrance in their own way. oooo thats evil and scary ooo Halloween soon ya know. Hippie new age aesthetics are obviously the right and only way to be spiritual cos they be higher on that spiral dynamic colour. Picking colours like we power rangers..go go power ranger.

I see Westerners breaking down in the rat race of urban life cos the barista got the coffee wrong, whilst Gazan kids still singing with a smile after all they’ve been through. The biohacking, journaling, freedom drenched life of hedonism annd “liberties” isn’t enough of a cooling balm for the soul it seems. We assign value to Ryan Holiday stoicism but too easily mock “primitive” sources of strength many still rely on due to our own biases.

Edited 18 hours ago by zazen

[Breakingthewall]

6 hours ago, zazen said:

see Westerners breaking down in the rat race of urban life cos the barista got the coffee wrong, whilst Gazan kids still singing with a smile after all they’ve been through. The biohacking, journaling, freedom drenched life of hedonism annd “liberties” isn’t enough of a cooling balm for the soul it seems. We assign value to Ryan Holiday stoicism but too easily mock “primitive” sources of strength many still rely on due to our own biases.

Human beings quickly adapt to circumstances, in a matter of days. The man who was hysterical yesterday because his new car had been scratched is today piloting fighter planes in the Battle of London on a stormy night in the Strait of Gibraltar. Human beings bring out their noblest side in adversity and become selfish crybabies in prosperity. That's why it's healthy to maintain a good dose of uncertainty and struggle in life, so as not to become a piece of shit.

Edited 12 hours ago by Breakingthewall